Foster carers

[mamath]

what are mums' views on foster carers?

superchick you call the youtube post pathetic

Whereas, I find it moving, in fact heartbreaking
It was included as an example for people who had not empathised with this issue before
we are all different

when you know a mum existing with this living bereavement, well, it is a living death

perhaps then you might review how much value you can afford to give a little clip of expression like this one

'Pathetic' seems very heavy handed for something with no value, and no empowerment.

No of course I don't! Provide me with some evidence and I will happily retract my previous comments. But you can't can you?

StewieGriffinsMom
I have said I appreciate your cloise hand experience input in the thread, becasue this has given balance to the more negative evidence I am close up to.

Back to following the thread, again, I am not necessarily answering each point in order, but I am answering each point over time.

my words earlier, what did I say, 'you get together with someone to start a family'...
-I have already explained the context of this was to cut to the chase and not even be taken so literally

and besides, for many people, the search and involvement in a serous relationship Is with the hope of starting a family

Someone pointed out earlier that we are not homogenised, yet I was pulled up here -told "See this is where you are going wrong" [sic] and presented with a sort of relationships blueprint

I think I was entitled to call that cultural fascism, however uncomfortable that might feel.

I wouldn't argue that foster carers should be highly competent

I might have a different idea of how this is acgieved rather than the professional pay and status blurprint

However, I draw back to my point about increasing numbers: is there a social phenomena at play that we should be discussing about the deterioration of parent competence to explain such increasing numbers?

What really do you know about the demographics of the 65,000, bearing in mind the point about babies being taken when no harm has occurred in the past or present circumstance?

I don't want to focus in on DV partiocularly as I saiud, that is not what this thread is about, and is a separate area of discussion.

DV was a reference point in the discussion and all those women that have suffered DV should not be put into the category of the situation you cite and are familr with of a mum not being able to free herself for the good of thechildren, especially because the examples I cite are at odds with that scenario and re some of the youtube clips at odds with teh homogenised notion that all social sector workers are have competent integrity and are logical.

I think those not meeting those criteria should not so freely be permitted to hide behind the hard work of those who do meet such criteria.
Homogenising again

thought I should correct the typos in case of confusion about my accessing the advantages of communicating with the English language:

I wouldn't argue that foster carers should be highly competent
I might have a different idea of how this is achieved rather than the professional pay and status blueprint

StewieGriffinsMom
Sorry but no-one did pick up on my point earlier, now relevant in the more recent commments

Baby Peter was seen over and over and over and over again by hard working professionals
the situation was well-resourced, there was no shortage of professionals

Back to my query about increasing numbers, is this a social phenomena we should be discussing about the widescale deterioration of innate parental responsibility

I do not have my head in the sand so there is no need to be rude, because that one might come back to bite you on the ass

of the 65,000 children, what if some of those are screaming in foster care (we know that many of them have, and we can assume that some of them continue to)(good caring foster care placements aside) or in adoption (we know that some have, because they speak out as adults) or elsewhere lost in the system (we know that there are laraming numbers of children disappearing beyond the FC avenue (I am not blaming FCs) I am talking about a situation of keeping tabs when children are separated from their parents on a wide scale

and what about the newborns where no harm has occurred in the past or the present?

mamath, I'm reading this thread thoroughly confused at your actual point. I'm also under the impression that you have something against FCs to be honest, and that's it as I can't understand any of the 'points' that you're trying to make. In response to your previous posts and questions:

On the idea of kids being taken away from loving parents, I know of one or two cases. One genuine and terrible mistake where a child had repeatedly broken their arm and the parents ended up being seen at fault so SS took child away.

And then there's obviously those parents who are deemed unworthy of kids before they're even born and I've met one or two of those children which is sad when the parent does care so much about that child, but it's not fair for a child to be raised by people who can't understand their basic needs enough to care for them without hurting them.

Then there are those parents who have abused children in the past and so all subsequent children are taken. I believe this is right, having met babies and toddlers who have casts on both legs or arms from their parents throwing them forcibly to the floor or snapping their bones like twigs, I don't think that their parents deserve to have children in the slightest.

I'm still very confused as to your point. As a young woman without children but knowing FCs and wanting to FC in the future, possibly as a 'career' (using the phrase lightly) I think that 99% of FCs are fantastic women and men who genuinely want the best for a child that comes into their care and love the opportunity to positively affect a child's life and do something good for them.

StewieGriffinsMom
I agree, every case should be taken on its merits.

I still looking for mums to engage with this, newborns taken where no previous or current harm has taken place

baby well cared for, so parents (committed couple) fully understand their child's needs, don't patronise these parents.

You miss my point earlier- Baby P was killed by his 'parents', those loving caring parents who continually lied to the professionals involved in his and their lives. Foster Carers caused no harm in that particular case.

I know a lot about the demographics of children in the care system thank you. Of the 60,000 or so children in care the largest numbers enter care as infants. After that the next highest age groups are 4-7yo (infant school age)- presumably because there is more contact with professional agencies once children have begun school.

Babies are not taken into care on whims. There is a process to be followed, evidence to be shown. I am not an apologist for social care, but I know hundreds of actual real life children who were necessarily removed from the care of their parent(s), some of those at birth.

There will always be some cases where perhaps the care they receive is deleterious, but it certainly is no worse than the situation they were already living in. The cases I am thinking of do not involve babies, rather these are early-teen-aged children, girls in the main, who go further "off the rails" whilst living in residential care- almost always residential homes as opposed to foster care.

"I still looking for mums to engage with this, newborns taken where no previous or current harm has taken place

baby well cared for, so parents (committed couple) fully understand their child's needs, don't patronise these parents."

How can we possibly comment on this? Of course newborns should never be taken from loving parents who will care for them well. I'm sure you will say you know of cases where this has happened, but equally social workers and the courts involved will say the child was at serious risk of harm.

As people who have no access to any first hand information, how on earth can we judge?

There may well be no previous harm, but there must be significant risk of harm. I do not doubt that there are a few miscarriages of justice, but they must be few and far between. It is better that more children are removed from their parents care (some necessarily, some not) than fewer are removed and some die -in my opinion.

Mamath - how would you raise standards in foster care?

I can think of many ways, unfortunately I would be accused of cultural fascism!

I have to go now. I may be able to come back to the ball back in my court.

Once you have first hand experinec or know someone up close who has first hand experience, then you learn how to read between the lines of all this stuff.

Kind regards to you all.

Baby Peter wasn't killed by his parents.

Without swearing, this poor child's mother was unforgiveably negligent and irresponsible, the father we don't know if the same could be applied to him, or if he was marginalised beyond his parental efforts.

The step-father if that is what he was (I believe they were married) and his brother were the child abusing murderers, have I got my facts correct?

Baby Peter contd
And the authorities were extensively involved quite what they were doing seems sort of intangible in terms of child protection.

mamath i'm still not sure what it is you are asking. You mentioned earlier a case you know of where chldren were abused by fc. I asked you "did those children at any time tell anyone of the abuse" (in long term care they would have had countless oppertunities). I ask that same question again.
We have adopted our youngest. She is the youngest of 8 children. The first 4 came to the attention of ss between the ages of 3 and 7 they were removed from her care and eventually adopted. This was around 20 years ago. She has since had another 4 children all earmarked and removed at birth and adopted. All of the first 4 have a degree of learning difficulities. Two went on to have children who are who are now in LAC. of the second 4, the first is in a stable happy relationship with a young child. The second is at college with a view to becoming a sw. The 2 youngest are happy intelligent children with a healthy attachment to their adoptive parents. Which 4 do you think have had a better quality of life?.
My dds birth mother is not a bad person. She has learning difficulities that make it impossible for her to care for her children in a safe, nurturing environment. She is not able to learn such skills. As her dd fc I spent a long time working with her to try and teach her the basic skills she would need to be able to keep the daughter she loved so much.
With respect it is people like you who put others off coming forward to be fcs. There is a huge need for more carers. At the moment sw have no choice but to sometimes put children in unsuitable placements with carers who may not be qualified to deal with a particular childs needs. But at least saidchild will be safe.
The example I give above is one of many I could give. I have never seen a child removed from a home where they were not in danger. What I have seen many times is children returned to parents by judges who feel the parents need a second, third or fourth chance. More often than not these children are back in the care system more damaged, more traumatised and often to old to be adopted. So they then spend their lives as 'foster children' something no child deserves no matter how good their carer might be.