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The BNP's Nick Griffin on Question Time, what are your thoughts?

973 replies

overmydeadbody · 19/10/2009 08:17

link here

OP posts:
moondog · 21/10/2009 23:57

I don't watch tv either (so invasive) but I would have liked to have seen this. Was at aerobics however

LeninGhoul · 21/10/2009 23:59

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

mrsruffallo · 22/10/2009 00:08

I think the real problem in this country is class. Many white working class people fought the fascists in the thirties(cable st riots etc) it wasn't all the middle classes to save the day.
Nick Griffin h9imself is oxbridge educated- surely this makes him middle class? And a whole lot of his supporters are too
And please don't blame me or my ancestors who lived in poverty throughout the empire days of reaping waht we sowed by plundering the world through the british empire- that was mostly down to the upper/upper middle classes and they are the ones that still benefit from it to this day.
Not us. We are just patronised and dismissed. The working class is full of passionate, educated people and as a matter of fact, people who have been schooled with/lived next to immigrants for a lot longer than most of you mc.And on the whole we have managed to live together in tolerance and harmony.

SomeGuy · 22/10/2009 04:07

Many of the BNP polices are fairly attractive, the problems is that they are a bunch of cunts. Antisemitism is very foolish, that's what they were obsessed with before, despite very few Jews in the UK, they've moved on now, but only because Muslims are more effective targets.

Griffin has put out material like The Rune (from one issue):

'the front cover, displayed a drawing of a large white hangman's noose with the words "What has a rope got to do with WHITE UNITY?" on a black background. The editorial to which the cover referred called for the unification of all "white nationalist" organisations into a single body with the purpose of achieving "final victory over those who wish to destroy us so that they can rule forever over a mass of mongrel slaves." Then "payback time" would come, and "we can put the rope to capital work". '

'an article entitled "Inconvenient facts", claimed that Jews held positions in the media and Hollywood vastly disproportionate to their numbers. A cartoon of hens with "Jewish noses" were saying things like "Hens are special" and "Hens are chosen". The cartoon's caption referred to "greedy, pushy power-mad hens". ... the magazine denied the Holocaust, which it called the "Holohoax"'

'When the police were searching his home, Mr Griffin had taken a telephone call and had said that "They're very civilised, not like the Met at all. No Pakis or Jews."'

The policies of the BNP, which are constrained by what they can get away with, are basically indistinguishable from UKIP anyway.

Compare:

Immigration:

BNP:
"we call for an immediate halt to all further immigration, the immediate deportation of criminal and illegal immigrants, and the introduction of a system of voluntary resettlement whereby those immigrants who are legally here will be afforded the opportunity to return to their lands of ethnic origin assisted by a generous financial incentives both for individuals and for the countries in question."

UKIP:

"?We will freeze immigration for five years, speed up deportation of up to a million illegal immigrants by tripling the numbers engaged in deportations, and have ?no home no visa? work permits to ease the housing crisis."

Europe:
BNP:

"we believe that the nations of Europe should be free to trade and cooperate whenever it is mutually beneficial. We stand for British withdrawal from the European Union. In place of the EU, we intend to aim towards greater national self-sufficiency, and to work to restore Britain?s family and trading ties with Australia, Canada and New Zealand, and to trade with the rest of the world as it suits us"

UKIP:
"?UKIP will leave the political EU and trade globally and freely. We will re-embrace today?s fast-growing Commonwealth and we will encourage UK manufacturing so that we make things again."

Crime:

BNP:
"the Human Rights Act would be repealed during the first term of a British Nationalist Government."
"make criminals serve their full sentences"
"Put police back on the streets and remove the political correctness shackles from them"

UKIP:
"?We will give people the vote on policing priorities, go back to proper beat policing and scrap the Human Rights Act. We will have sentences that mean what they say."

Education:
BNP
"Reintroduce grammar schools"
"Abolish full fees and restore full grants to university students studying proper subjects"

UKIP:
"?We will have a grammar school in every town. We will restore standards of education and improve skills training. Student grants will replace student loans."

etc.

They are very similar indeed. The only difference is that the BNP are staffed by violent racists. UKIP are a perfectly viable right-wing party, and one that beat the Labour party in the last election (2009 Euros), with three times as many votes as the BNP, so what is the appeal of racists who sound somewhat reasonable in public, but when amongst themselves get back to their usual ways of violence and racism.

VulpusinaWilfsuit · 22/10/2009 10:12

ALL my students are talking about this this morning. Which is heartening, actually.

daftpunk · 22/10/2009 10:35

VW;

of course someone from Afghanistan will be different from me....if everyone in the world was exactly the same the word diversity wouldn't exist....or the phrase "multi cultural" .....i'm really not sure what you're trying to say..

i know exactly what the BNP stand for, i don't agree with everything they say...but i agree with enough to vote for them.

i couldn't a give a toss about peasant farmers in Ethiopia, ..or the rights of child killers in prison...i don't want to spend money rehabilitating them...i want them shot..

NG may well be currupt, but so are alot of politicians......did any labour MP use their expenses to send food parcels to starving Africans....? i'm sure they were too busy buying hanging baskets and paying for pornography...they are full of shit...

i am tired of people going on about people's rights....the rights of homosexuals.... immigrants.... prisioners, ....what about the rights of white, law abiding UK born people ...

i'm sticking up for my rights...and if BNP are the only party that will help...that's ok.

BigGitDad · 22/10/2009 10:40

Someguy can we keep the swearing out of the chat please.

VulpusinaWilfsuit · 22/10/2009 10:42

Hi DP,

Glad you're back.

Whoah there, you're moving on a bit too quickly. You say 'of course they're different' and that's diversity. But you still haven't explained WHY and HOW they are different. Yes, they have had different experiences to you because culture and history and custom are different, but you told me to be British you had to be BORN here. I could have been born anywhere, moved here, and had the same experiences as you, couldn't I? So actually would it really matter whether I was born here or not?

I know you feel strongly about them 'sticking up for you etc'. But isn't it a bit important to grasp what they are actually sticking up for?

BigGitDad · 22/10/2009 10:46

But surely DP the right wing section of the conservative party would be in line with your political views (or UKIP). BNP are a dangerous party. They are the National Front of old, they do have members who have a history of violence and their policies will be detrimental to women. Not to mention what their impact as a ruling politicasl party would have on the economy.
I cannot believe you really want them in power. I can believe you want them to rock the boat though.

2shoescreepingthroughblood · 22/10/2009 10:46

"i am tired of people going on about people's rights....the rights of homosexuals.... immigrants.... prisioners, ....what about the rights of white, law abiding UK born people ..."

weird and unbelievable and sick
since when were homosexuals not law abiding, and uk born people.
the ignorance is outstanding and imo proves how sick the BNP are.

seeker · 22/10/2009 10:49

DP - what, as a white law abiding citizen do you want to do that you are not allowed to do? What "rights' do you feel have been taken away from you?

BigGitDad · 22/10/2009 10:49

FWIW I think this is a great thread as it is a good discussion of the BNP and also the alienation of the white working class as shown by the article in the Independant earlier. I am glad this has not deginerated in to a farce.

BigGitDad · 22/10/2009 10:50

PS I cannot spell..

daftpunk · 22/10/2009 10:53

VW...

i could meet an Afghan women and get on great with her...i'm not saying that being different is wrong or in some way bad......what i'm saying is i don't want anymore immigrants coming into this counrty...we haven't got the room or the money....as for the immigrants already here ...yep, i'd happily pay for them to go back to the country they came from.

you asked me what i thought a native Briton was,...i told you.

......it might not be the answer NG would have given you.

but i'm not NGs PR manager.

VulpusinaWilfsuit · 22/10/2009 10:58

You told me but the point is it doesn't work as an answer. There are lots of things that don't add up in the answer.

I'm getting the strong sense that you don't WANT to think anymore about whether the answers add up, because you're happy in your beliefs, whether or not they're based in reality.

And this is how the BNP works. It appeals to your sense that 'it MUST be right' because it seems right to you, from your experience.

But it isn't right. It is wrong. I don't mean morally wrong, I mean factually wrong.

The reason I am politely niggling away at the question 'what is a native Briton' (that you haven't answered) is because you share the same misunderstandings that the BNP plays on. Do you really want to be misled by them or do you want to make your own mind up?

If you want to make your own mind up, think a bit harder about the question. I can suggest some useful websites to help you think about that question if you like?

seeker · 22/10/2009 10:58

Now you're answering questions, dp, answer mine.
" DP - what, as a white law abiding citizen do you want to do that you are not allowed to do? What "rights' do you feel have been taken away from you?"

allok · 22/10/2009 11:01

MrsRuf

I'm kind of with you on the issue of class.

Inspite of a huge welfare system we have almost no social mobility and I wonder whether our state is actually keeping people in poverty.

Watching that Panorama programme earlier this week I can honestly say I've never seen behaviour like that in real life as I live in an OK area. Horrible antisocial behaviour and you could never see these kids passing any exams or getting a job. They'll end up on benefit and their kids will probably not see their parents work and so it goes on. A Swede mentioned to me about 15 years ago that the UK has a class system and then an underclass.

We also live in a society we bang on about our individual rights and there's very little said about our individual responsibilities. UK society is very fragmented - more to do with with aspirations and poverty than different ethnic groups imo.

daftpunk · 22/10/2009 11:04

seeker;

i want the right to vote BNP without being called a fascist.....why can't teachers be members of the BNP..? that right has been taken away from them.

daftpunk · 22/10/2009 11:06

people of this country should be housed before immigrants....that is their right...or should be.

moffat · 22/10/2009 11:09

DP what you are asking for is a totalitarian state - removing the rights of people who are by your definition "different" and this is all based on the idea that you are better ad more deserving simply because you are white.

LeninGhoul · 22/10/2009 11:09

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

seeker · 22/10/2009 11:11

But if you vote BNP you ARE a fascist! I thought you'd be proud to be called one!

Oh, and housing is allocated on a points system - regardless of your colour. If you have a right to be in the country you can go on the housing list. Contrary to popular belief, immigrants do not jump the queue. And if you can give me evidence that they do, I'll give up my vote in the next general election!

BigGitDad · 22/10/2009 11:26

But seeker isn't that the issue that immigrants who do come into the country go onto the waiting list and if they score more points then they go ahead of the say white person who has lower points. Of course that stokes up resentment and alienation. That breeds votes for the BNP.

daftpunk · 22/10/2009 11:33

call me what you like seeker...

the BNP are gaining support.....why do you think that is..?

the BNP are far from perfect....but there is alot of truth in what they say....and alot of people are agreeing with them.....you have to stop denying there are problems..

electra · 22/10/2009 11:34

'there is alot of truth in what they say'

In whose opinion?!!!!