In the night garden light skinned doll

[spokette]

So according to the makers of In the night garden, the characters are toys, not representative of real people here?. I guess that is why most of the characters have light skin then.

One of the reasons I actually liked "In the night garden" is that there is a character who has dark skin and is therefore a positive reinforcement to my mixed race 4yo DTS because, there are very few dark skinned characters on TV and hence why their TV viewing is strictly rationed. Non-blacks will probably not understand why this is important but for those interested, I grew up in 70s Britain and the constant, relentless barrage by the media that black people were either criminals or only good at sports was not only dispiriting and erroneous but also insulting and designed to remind us of our place in society.

This cynical and deliberate ploy to market a lighter skin doll as oppose to the darker skin one was done to appeal to the non-black buying public as usual and demonstrates that the BBC, like many of these institutions are still paying mainly lip service to providing inclusive TV viewing.

Guess who will not be tuning in to this programme again?

god i have to confess i have never thought of Upsy daisy in any human or race-related way...i just like the way her hair wiggles...is that very bad of me?

What blatant racism is that then MsSparkle?

I would see your argument MsSparkle if there were any instances of companies deliberately darkening white people/characters. AS far as I know there arent presumably becasue it is not deemed more acceptable to be darker for public consumption.

I understand all the arguments about childrne not being that interested in differnce at this age. Its the unconscious message that I worry about - that lighter is "better". That succesful people/characters are lighter or white etc

I don't worry about ITNG particualrly as DS doesn;t like it much but I'm always pleased to see a good representation of races on TV.

Even at 3 DS is aware that Pui looks like him.

The toy is SOOO different from the TV character though - can anyone really believe that it wasn't deliberate by the toy-makers at least, even if not by the BBC?

Racism against white people does exist and should not be tolerated any more than racism against anyone else. However, as Spokette points out, it was black people who were the slaves of white and not the other way around. White men hold most of the power in the world, economic or otherwise. So, if you are racist towards a white man, his position of dominance in the world will not be affected. But if you are racist towards someone black you are tapping into all the hundreds of years of oppression that black people have had to suffer. You cannot view racism, imo, in isolation from history. So it may seem like a petty thing regarding Upsy Daisy, but if the BBC have done this on purpose, it is anything but petty.

Sorry I never noticed until I read this thread, the article and then looked at our new Upsey Daisy.

Totally agree with Raspberry.

The racism for me here is that you have a black person stopping their dc from watching a tv programme that isn't even based on real people, because they have made a doll "too white." Like i said earlier;

"if it were the other way around and i had started a thread complaining that the BBC had made a white based charactor on tv too black and said i was stopping my dc from watching the show because of this, i would be flamed to death and branded a racist. I don't see why it should be any different it being the other way around like it is in this case."

The only person making an issue out of skin colour here is the op. That to me is worrying when we all want our dc to grow up accepting all different races/colours, yet here is someone who by stopping her dc watching the show, is pointing out and making an issue of skin colour.

The op said herself in her op "One of the reasons I actually liked "In the night garden" is that there is a character who has dark skin." That to me sparks the idea that she has a problem with white people based on her experience during the 70s. I would never imply that i only watch something because there is white charactor in it

I agree with you somewhat Raspberry and i am not trying to deny that racism towards black people still exists now nor am i trying to trivulise the history of racism towards black people. My own grandmother wouldn't agknowledge to her friends in the 70s that she had grandchildren because her daughter (my aunty) had children with a black man. That is awful.

However i don't see using the racism towards black people from the past as a valid excuse to be racist to ANY skin colour 2009. Not from anybody.

MrsSparkle, either you are being deliberately obtuse or you really are as ignorant as you sound.

What I said in my OP was "One of the reasons I actually liked "In the night garden" is that there is a character who has dark skin and is therefore a positive reinforcement to my mixed race 4yo DTS because, there are very few dark skinned characters on TV and hence why their TV viewing is strictly rationed."

Interesting how you chose not to use the latter part of the sentence because it would have undermined the rest of the nonsense that you subsequently posted.

spokette do you serioulsy ration your dts tv viewing because of a lack of dark skinned characters???

well said raspberry

I ration their TV viewing because DH and I don't believe they should watch lots of TV anyway and if they are going to watch something, I want them to view things which positively reinforces their identity because whether you want to believe it or not, we are all subconciously affected by what we see. They like Bob the builder and to my knowledge, there are no black characters there but they watch it because they really enjoy it. So I am not anal about it. I just wish programme makers would be more representative of their audience.

From the op's posts, I don't think she means that she rations dc's tv based on the skin colour of the characters, but rather that she was disappointed that a show which appeared to contain a black character has subsequently not had the courage of its convictions. Sorry if this misrepresents you OP, but this is how I had understood it.

why do some posters have such a hard time understanding that it is nice to see oneself reflected/validated in the media?

I have some small experience of this - as a child I went to a v v monoculture school and when another, more mixed school across town closed down and some of the kids ended up coming to my school, I can remember how happy and relieved I was to not be 'the only one'/have a funny name that no one could say.

what percentage of the viewing public are now non-white in England? I really don't know this....

I didnt notice. Sorry. I dont know if that is good or bad in light of this thread.

Raspberry, that is what I meant so thanks.

Chibi - I could write a PhD thesis on how the media affects one's perception. For example, non-white women in the West have had to endure for many years the media's stance that the pinnacle of beauty is eurocentric.

I too am surprised at how so many people don;t seem to understand the subconscious influence of the media on many things - racism, sexism, body issues, branding etc.

Just because your 3 year old doesn't say "oh look mummy all the pretty women on TV are really really skinny" doesn't mean they don't absorb that to be pretty and successful you should be really skinny. Only an example but I'm sure you get what I mean.

Please don't give up on the actual show spokette! The makers are brilliant, even if one loose cannon on the marketing tie-in team is a complete idiot.

I don't know about the rest of them, but I know Igglepiggle is played by a very talented northerner, who happens to be ethnically Chinese. That shouldn't matter. But it does when you're under-represented in the media.

The show is ground breaking, please enjoy it!

Bessiebighead, I do actually think the show is excellent compared to many of the other programmes out there.

TBH, now that I have had a day to calm down, I will continue to let the boys watch it if they want to but no way am I buying any the marketing gumph. They ain't getting my money!!

Kwecumber, spot on. Hence why there are girls as young as 5yo who have eating disorders.

fwiw, haven't read the whole thread, as it seemed to have descended even further.

But the cock up is consequential, as the programme is shown and marketed internationally - it's not just a case of representing a certain percentage of British non-white people... it starts to smack of cultural imperialism. I'd be curious to know if the lighter skinned upsy daisy was exported to countries outside of Europe.

Tie-ins are such a con!

spokette I worked in advertising for some years - its obvious how influenced people are by whats on the screen when you see the research results, yet most people would say they weren't influenced by it.