Work for dole

[ReallyTired]

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/7514513.stm

I think that proposals like these are long over due. Although I think that if you make people work full time for their benefits they won't have time to look for job.

Prehaps they should work three days a week and look for a job two days a week.

There are people who for good reasons cannot work full time, but certainly could do something part time.

Because back in those good ol' days sitdowngeorge talks about, misogyny was even more openly targeted.

and this reform does target lone parents, who are mostly women.

Littlemydancingforjoy, all you have to do is gradually gradually gradually shift habits and perceptions and you change society.

30 years ago, I would have been utterly shocked to see healthy young people living on the streets. Nowadays, I hardly notice them.

Don't assume we will never accept American levels of barbarism in this country. We just need to be gradually softened up.

FUCK OFF ihearts - did I ASK for my marriage to breakdown???? Oh yes I sat there and thought "well I know that after I'd had 3 children my marriage will breakdown and I'll be on my own with 3 DC"

Public funds are not the same as benefits.

the whole point of tax credits is to reduce the tax burden of those on low incomes. if it was done through PAYE and those on low incomes paid less tax, then noone would call it a benefit.

the reason it isn't done through PAYE is because the government needs to know who has children etc, and that can't be done easily or efficiently via the employer.

And your right FAQ. I have no idea about benefits because, quite proudly, I have always worked and paid my own way and I don't exepect anyone else to pay for me

'Did anyone force you to have three children?

I would love another but we cant afford two so it looks like we will just have one.

You should have thought about how much it costs to clothe and feed three children
before having them instead of whingeing about it now.

Its called personal responsiblity.'

Right, so if you have 3 kids and then wind up riding the wheel of misfortune, what then?

This is such an American line of thinking it makes me even more despairing. And it also makes me chuckle because you can see the source of the spring more and more every day.

The level of misdirected bitterness, small-mindedness, ignorance and schadenfraude on this thread is so far beyond depressing it's one of the saddest threads I've read on here in 4 years.

Tax credits are not benefits, ask the CSA.

'Public funds are not the same as benefits.'

Yes, they are. They are mean-tested monies funded by taxes.

In fact, some benefits are not means-tested at all.

My understanding was that lone parents were the subject of a completely different paper, IIRC?

I do agree LittleBella, but that doesn't mean throwing out everything America has ever done as a bad idea.

We could equally look at why it isn't working over there, what is going wrong, and make sure that doesn't happen to us. But my point was that talking about single mothers in the US being forced to work two weeks after giving birth isn't very useful in the context of this debate.

'the reason it isn't done through PAYE is because the government needs to know who has children etc, and that can't be done easily or efficiently via the employer.'

That's funny, the Tories used to do it under PAYE.

you like the word schadenfraude dont you? BTW its not relevant as no one is taking pleasure in anyones's misery.

yeah well you know what Ihears - once upon a time - I was a SAHM, then things got tight financially - so I went out to work - 9 1/4hr long night shifts at £5.50hr (just before minimum wage went up to £5.52 or whatever it is now), I got no sick pay, I didn't get paid if I didn't turn up to work one night because my children were ill.

The pill failed for me with DS2, yes - DS3 was a "oops" moment - but the MAP (at £26) failed for me too. However by the time he was born we were sorted again financially - then my marriage broken down 9 months later.

For 8yrs we never claimed benefits, despite at one point 3yrs ago having £15 a week to feed 2 adults and 2 DC, and being in arrears with most of our bills.

of course they're funded by taxes - they're our taxes, which we get back because we have children.

I don't know the ins and outs of being a person on a visa, but for UK citizens, tax credits are a rebate on the tax paid at source through PAYE. And of course they're means tested - what we earn determines how much tax we pay and therefore how much we get back.

Its not just single women that are expected to return to work two weeks after birth, all working women are. Its the norm in the States.

'I do agree LittleBella, but that doesn't mean throwing out everything America has ever done as a bad idea.'

LOL!

I'll loan you my passport and and Social Security Number you can go and live over there with kids and see what a great idea it is.

I'll even throw in my old, fairly well-paid job as a legal secretary (a real bonus considering their recession at hte moment) and free copies of 'Nickeled and Dimed' and 'This Land Is Their Land' for some reading on the flight over.

You'll just need a few thousand in the bank to pay for private health insurance until your kicks in at the job after a year or so - hope you haven't got any pre-existing conditions.

'you like the word schadenfraude dont you? BTW its not relevant as no one is taking pleasure in anyones's misery. '

Yeah, right.

I could use something worse, but I was trying to refrain.

FWIW, I've never lived off the dole. I've never claimed the dole.

Nor has DH, who has worked since he left school.

We are a working poor family.

Always have been, always will be.

Objection expat!

American line of thinking? Please specify that this is the republican way of thinking.

Thanks for the kind invitation expat.

I am not saying America have got it right, by any means. I can read, and listen, and totally agree that America has some very serious problems with its approach to those at the low income or welfare end of their society.

But what I am saying is that just saying 'oh my god we're going to end up like America' is not a very useful way of having the debate.

My abject apologies, ilove!

You are right indeed!

and if you read ALL of my posts on this thread somewhere up ^^ there I say that I fully intend to try and return to work once my DS3 is at school - in the mean time I'm going to be a PROUD (but poor) SAHM and hopefully once DS2 starts school in september do some FE to enable me to get a job which means I can support my family (and pay for holiday care for my older DS if there's any available once I'm ready to go back to work) without the need for benefits.

I sincerely hope you never find yourself in the unexpected position of needing benefits to live on - as it's not fun.

'But what I am saying is that just saying 'oh my god we're going to end up like America' is not a very useful way of having the debate.'

It most certainly is when the Tories are so far ahead in the polls.

My Sister has 3 children under 10, worked evenings when her pig of her husband cheated and left her.

She now works 2 jobs to pay the mortgage. He doesn't contribute anything. She does school hours as an LSA and dinnerlady, rushes home does dinner and starts her evening job at 5pm till 8 pm.

Once your children are at school you don't have to live off benefits unless you want to.
I understand that your are not school age yet and I believe that if the government is serious about people returning to work, they should provide free childcare for single parents.

how did she manage to work evenings when she had 3 DC????

Notes how much people over use >>> key.

I have them and if I cant my other sister will.