Russell Brand 🤢🤮

[Netcurtainnelly]

🤢 🤢 Russell Brand. I never liked him anyway, Now he's on trail. Denies all charges of course.

I googled this as I was curious about it. The research apparently shows that men and women on juries convict at the same rates.

That's interesting. There are 8 men on the RB jury so it is weighted towards men. I would say because rape convictions are historically low are we seeing make influence on juries suppressing guilty verdicts given we can't tell how each individual make her of the jury voted? From what you say mixed juries are coming out with systematically low guilty verdicts and if we as a society have a problem with SA and rape conviction rates could this be a feature?

I feel (and yes this a bias so call me out on this) that you are not guaranteed 8 totally virtuous men on the jury and unfortunately some men may have consumed a lot of pornography or been involved in cultures where misogyny is rife reducing their capacity to think of sexual crimes as truly serious. We have seen the influence of toxic masculinity so what is to stop it pervading an anonymous jury discussion.

Happy to be proved wrong in this of course and there will be counterargumenrs.......

I do think in rape cases it should be 6 women and 6 men. Sadly some men will watch violent porn and surely they’d be less likely to convict. The more men on a jury the more chance of one or two men like that.

An experienced criminal barrister I used to work with years go said he preferred male jurors in his rape cases. He says older women were actually worse as they frequently saw the defendant as their son. Don’t know if things have changed with manosphere etc this was early 2000s
when I decided I didn’t want to do criminal law.

Interesting.

Many of the posters in this thread have already assumed RB is guilty simply because he has an unpleasant public persona and media, and because they’ve themselves had completely unrelated bad experiences with men.
If some women jurors more like to vote for guilty for unrelated matters, and that women never lie, this obviously makes them entirely incapable of evaluating the actual evidence of the charges.

I have been the victim in a trial like this that ended in a no guilty verdict.
I had a 50/50 mix of men and women.
The police couldn’t believe that he was found not guilty because in there opinion the evidence was strong but talking to them after a couple said they wish jurors in trials like mine where educated a little beforehand on things like, coercive control and flight and fight response. Also that so many people are of the opinion that beyond a reasonable doubt means you have to be 100% sure.
My sister was on a jury years ago so I’m comfortable sharing this. She had a case where a man was seen screaming abuse at his girlfriend’s door before entering her house. She was brought out by paramedics an hour later unconscious and there was a broken wooden leg chair on the floor covered in her blood.
His argument was.. yes he broke in and argued with her but she’d hit herself with the wooden chair leg, he hadn’t touched her.
My sister told me more than half of the people on the jury with her argued that his story was unlikely but he might have been being honest so they wouldn’t vote guilty.
They didn’t get reasonable doubt.
My sister and a couple of others refused to budge and she said others on the jury actually changed their mind admitting it was because they wanted to go home and not have to do it again the following day.. this probably happens a lot.
The police told me it gutting sometimes, you spend years building a case and waiting for a trial and a bad jury makes it all pointless.
Maybe it would be better if being on a jury was a trained job.

I think he is guilty because I have heard the victim testimony on a deep dive podcast. If I was on the jury I would of course listen to the defence case but subject to that would say guilty.

I think it's really interesting what a PP said about juries not understanding what 'beyond reasonable doubt' means. I looked it up and actually there can be doubt, but that doubt must be unreasonable in the sense of fanciful and not consistent with the record.

I don't know whether 'it's possible that she beat herself with the bloody chair leg that was found in the house shortly after the assailant fled' is speculative or reasonable and where the line is - I don't know if any criminal lawyers here can contribute?

Either way, it's interesting that the phrase, which seems so straightforward, is not in fact at all straightforward.

Presumably psychopaths and sociopaths are to be found in all walks of life, so I guess it's no surprise when the likes of Brand turn up in the entertainment world. I just hope the celebrity world is learning something and that ppl like this get exposed more quickly in future. Looking the other way isnt an option any more.

I did jury service earlier this year. Both cases I sat on were incontrovertible because we were shown cctv evidence, mobile phone footage and footage from police body-worn cameras. One jury member stayed silent for the whole ten days and another tried to argue with what was clearly in front of our eyes. It’s a complicated business; 12 complete strangers thrown together for one of the most important things they’ll ever be asked to do and which is out of their control. The point I’m trying to make I think is that even when the guilt is so very much evident some jury members will still try to disagree. I know that’s the purpose of the jury room deliberations but in this current case which is based so much on testimony, well I’m glad I didn’t get called for this one. Must be bloody awful.

Were these three men accused by large numbers of women who didnt know each other?

There are a few women on this thread, and on social media who are defending Brand

my husband said he would unquestionably convict Brand given the chance

Thisisme proves my former barristers colleague’s assertion that older women jurors are actually less likely to convict men of rape.

Someone said he walked in and out arrogantly. I thought the first day he came down the steps very carefully. He looked to me like he was on a load of tranquilizers..

Interesting comment below about women with sons feeling sorry for the man

🙄

It's interesting. We were heavily socialised to blame women for being raped, to treat sexual assault as something you just had to deal with and to be careful of 'giving mixed messages'.

On the other hand, men today are routinely exposed, at all ages, to porn of such violence that it would have been specialist back-room material in 'my day'. Maybe the ideal jury would be all women under 45? Or maybe we simply can't win ...

Yes. Im sick of it. something has to change

I am sorry but looking at the pressure the defence is looking like he is scoring points and there are holes appearing in the accusations. I think the lack of obvious struggle or explicit strong physical indications of non consent will be sitting with the jurors now. There seems to be alcohol involved with one victim and a lack of transparency about who initiated the oral encounter. Was this a forced insertion or was the woman fella ting with the idea of getting out of a regretful encounter as soon as able?

I feel terribly for the woman but the defence is asking the right questions.....

Press

If he is cleared, he's going to be even more insufferable than he already is. Can you imagine. He'll probably claim God saved him and declare himself a saint.l or expect to be made Pope.

Absolutely. I have seen nothing that would definitely convict him yet.

I am sorry but crowded Soho pubs with presumably plenty of alcohol is not the scene to set to prosecute these crimes. One perspective could be Brand and the woman flirting, maybe kissing, Brand grasping a breast and meeting no discernible resistance leading the woman to a bathroom cubicle where hurried fellatio occurred with the woman deeply regretting her actions.....awful behaviour by Brand but enough to get sent down for years for??

But that wouldn't be sexual assault would it if she consented then potentially regretted it after the fact.
In which case it's a false accusation...

My perspective is he's likely to be guilty

My guess... he's exceedingly entitled and that's a real red flag for sexual assault... 'I take what I want...'

The first victim has a strong case in my opinion. I’d be asking myself why she’d lie and then she is backed up by his friend saying that he told him.. I took the sex to far with that girl last night whilst acting panicked and desperate to leave the area.