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Duncan Fisher: Stop ignoring fathers when babies are born

271 replies

Tom · 14/04/2008 09:53

The Independent. Monday, 14 April 2008

The only time that attention to fathers is really exercised is when a father is violent.

Consider the new mother who has just had a Caesarean. She needs help to pick up and settle the baby, on a ward where the midwives are overstretched. Or consider the new mother who cannot walk and whose baby is on the special care baby unit, two wards away. She needs the baby's father to help her speedily transfer expressed milk to the newborn ? but he has access only during "visiting hours".

In the NHS you are either a "patient" or a "visitor". And 30 years after it became normal for a father to attend baby's birth, there are still no formal NHS-wide standards for what he needs to know. Nor is there any formal guidance on how he can provide extra support to a mother who is sick or incapacitated after the birth.

Perhaps the ultimate expression of the "nanny state" is when a couple have just had a baby and ? at this heightened family experience ? the hospital says "now you have to part company ? dad, go home". Setting aside any opinions about the father's right to stay with his family, regularly excluding fathers from maternity services in this, and many other ways, has a detrimental effect on mothers and babies.

The NHS does not even have a system of formally registering who the father is, let alone formally assessing his own needs ? does he smoke? Does he know how to support breastfeeding? When my two children were born, my partner was asked only one question about me ? does he have any genetic abnormalities in his family? I was not even asked my name. And yet research shows that, when it comes to the health of mother and baby ? smoking, breastfeeding, depression ? I am the biggest influence. I am uniquely able to support her and my baby and I am uniquely able to screw them both up. Despite the enlightened work of countless midwives and birthing units who genuinely see that a birth is a family event that needs as light a touch as possible from professionals, the NHS continues to commission a system designed for the 1950s. Every maternity unit is filled with fathers ? well over 90 per cent are involved at some point before, during or after the birth. And yet, high-level policy debates in the NHS can continue for hours as if men simply did not exist.

The only time that attention to fathers is really exercised is when a father is violent. A focus on violence is absolutely right, but what if as much energy was expended on mobilising the positive support that the vast majority of fathers provide, or could provide, to mother and baby?

Firstly, fathers would be registered into maternity services and formally engaged with. The failure of a father to show up would result in an enquiry ? no compulsion, just an informed conversation with the mother about what she wants and what is best for baby when it comes to making sure the father is informed and positively engaged.

All health information would be routinely communicated to both parents ? breastfeeding, smoking, mental health, vaccinations. Mother-only provision should always be available but as special provision for special needs, not the default. And if the father is a source of problems, it is no good the NHS just walking away from it ? that won't stop him causing problems the moment the baby is back at home. Fathers in this situation should be treated exactly as mothers in the same situation: extra engagement, not less.

At the heart of the problem is still the cultural expectation that babies are mum's business only. As one young black father said to a government group on children's services recently: "It is too easy for young dads to walk away from their responsibilities."

What happens when a father does not engage? Absolutely nothing. The moral panic only sets in later when the same father fails to pay child support ? then suddenly he is reclassified from a "nobody" to a "feckless father". In the US, where they trialled a simple process of midwives talking to young fathers when they visited their partners, child support payments went up.

Things have to change. When a baby is born, fathers are as responsible for the little one as mothers are. At every point in the process, an expectation of his full involvement should be communicated to both parents.

And this new vision needs to extend far beyond maternity services. Employers still expect that only women, and not men, will compromise work for caring responsibilities. The Government has just introduced a system where fathers get two weeks and mothers get 52 weeks ? the biggest difference in leave entitlement of any country in the world. If we keep going backwards: fathers will be excluded more and mothers will pay a heavier price for being left alone on the high throne of motherhood.

The writer is the chief executive of the Fatherhood Institute.

OP posts:
Beetroot · 14/04/2008 18:16

dh (father of 4 all born at home)

says:

  1. 'You've made it through' - no Mum and baby have.
  1. and it assumes that you will go to hospital
  1. Then he got bored
misdee · 14/04/2008 18:16

agree with expat.

am looking at the dad site now, and really dont like it. sorry.

Beetroot · 14/04/2008 18:20

dh laughed at it

it is all me me me me

dh very hands on dad but not a needy one

even that picutre suggest the man WANTS the pregnancy

dittany · 14/04/2008 18:23

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Monkeytrousers · 14/04/2008 18:26

Any father who wants to be there for pre-natal stuff already can be there can't he - or am I missing something?

The stuff about all fathers being allowed to stay in the hospital - perhaps TFI would be better campaigning for every mother to have a private room, then it wouldn't be such a problem with privacy for other mums and dads I'd imagine?

edam · 14/04/2008 18:26

I think the idea of a website for dads is fundamentally good, but the tone of Tom's is a bit off-putting. Advice on newborn babies is that mum 'has no secret abilities you don't.' This is intended to encourage men not just to hand the baby over to the mother when s/he cries. But it feels a bit dismissive of women. Why not just say the more time you spend looking after your baby the more confident you will be?

There's a lot more in that vein. Surely you can support and encourage fathers without belittling mothers?

Beetroot · 14/04/2008 18:28

absolutely edam

Blandmum · 14/04/2008 18:28

lack of secret abilities is wrong anyway.

newborn and very young babies will preferntially turn their heads towards the smell of their own mother.

While it is a great idea to encourage 'hands on' dads from as soon as possible, you shouldn't do it at the expense of the truth

dittany · 14/04/2008 18:29

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

edam · 14/04/2008 18:40

Very good points, MB and Dittany.

Tom · 14/04/2008 18:46

Oh blimey I'm going to have to respond to that.

Here's the quote in context:

Subtitle: Don't give up when it gets hard

.... you might feel that mum is just better at doing it, but she has no secret abilities for calming crying babies that you don't - she became good at it through practice, although she might have been able to spend a bit more time practicing!

This may be challenging, but it is factually true: Research has shown that mothers and fathers develop the skill of calming their baby at the same rate. Most mothers are better at it than most fathers because they have more time to learn. How are we belittling mothers?! The writer even assumes that she is better at calming the baby than him (because in most cases, the mother is - she's had more practice).

Dittany - I'm perfectly willing to answer your questions, but I don't want to discuss my son on a public website if that's ok. If you really want to know more you can contact me via the Dad Info website, but I will ask you to respect my son's privacy.

There is one person who works for both - Duncan Fisher, who is CEO of the Institute and Dad Info. And yes, we use the same hosts and developers. There is an association between the two, but they are separate.

OP posts:
Tom · 14/04/2008 18:48

Sorry - meant to include the rationale behind telling dads this.

Lots of dads don't get involved in baby/childcare because they think that they will be useless at it. Often they think that dads are not capable with babies, so we're just pointing out that dads are as capable in calming a crying baby.

I.e. it's a barrier for men, so we're addressing it.

OP posts:
Blandmum · 14/04/2008 18:53

Smell of mother is an advantage in soothing new borns

'Clinical Usefulness of Maternal Odor in Newborns: Soothing and Feeding Preparatory Responses
Regina M. Sullivana, Paul Toubasb

a Zoology Department, University of Oklahoma, Norman, Okla., and
b Department of Pediatrics, University of Oklahoma Health Science Center, Oklahoma City, Okla., USA

Address of Corresponding Author

Biol Neonate 1998;74:402-408 (DOI: 10.1159/000014061)

---------------- ----

Key Words

Maternal odor
Mother-infant interactions
Feeding preparation
Soothing
Olfaction
Crying

------------ --------

Abstract

This study assessed the responsiveness of newborn breast- and bottle-fed infants to presentations of maternal odor. Maternal odor was presented for 1 min to crying, sleeping or awake newborns. The odors were: (1) own mother's odor - presentation of a hospital gown worn by the baby's mother, (2) other mother's odor - presentation of a hospital gown of another newborn baby's mother, (3) clean gown - presentation of a clean hospital gown and (4) no gown - no gown presented. The results indicated that crying babies stopped crying when either own mother or other mother odor was presented. Awake babies responded specifically to their own mother's odor by increasing mouthing. These results suggest that the practice of presenting the mother's odor to a distressed infant is of clinical usefulness since it was capable of attenuating crying. The results also characterized a role for maternal odor with respect to feeding since presentation of the infant's own mother odor increased mouthing. Thus, presentation of maternal odor may also be useful in enhancing nipple acceptance and feeding in newborns.'

So , sorry, we do have some natural advantages.

As I said, I'm glad you are encouraging fathers to take an active role, but you shouldn't distort fact, it doesn't help your case

dittany · 14/04/2008 19:04

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Tom · 14/04/2008 19:07

Sounds absolutely correct, but it doesn't really prove the point your trying to make.

The research doesn't compare maternal/paternal odour or account for time the infant has spent in the mother or father's presence. One would imagine that the infant's tested had spent considerable time within smelling distance of the mother, hence the effect.

It's an interesting question though - can a newborn recognise their mother's smell straight from the womb, or is it a result of spending time with her?

You could devise an experiment to really answer the question of whether maternal odour has a different affect to paternal odour, but you would have to control for time spent with each parent.

The only way I think you could do this would be to look at infants who had been in their fathers' arms for an hour or so after a generally anaestetised caesarean while the mother is still unconscious and compare their reactions to infants who had been in their mother's arms for the same period.

Fascinating question though - does an infant emerge from the womb already with a knowledge of their mother's smell?

If so, you're absolutely right - it would be one to add to pregnancy, birth and breastfeeding.

But the paper you present above doesn't confirm this. And it doesn't say whether or not you'd have the same effect with paternal odour if he had been doing all the infant care.

OP posts:
Tom · 14/04/2008 19:10

Finance - investment, mostly from individuals who believe in what we're doing. Our details are available at company house, like everyone else.

Dittany. Unlike for you, my privacy is not guaranteed on this website.

I think you need to revisit your initial perception of who we are. Your suspicions are quite innacurate.

The chair of the Fatherhood Institute is Julie Mellor, whose last job was the Chair of the Equal Opportunities Commission and who was made a Dame because of her work for women's rights and gender equality.

OP posts:
dittany · 14/04/2008 19:12

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Blandmum · 14/04/2008 19:12

There are other studies that indicate that there is a direct link with the babies ingestion of amniotic fluid that ties in to this early response. and yes, they can do this on 'exit' as it were

and it is specifically tied into latch on behaviours.

I rather think that there would be less evolutionary need to recognise paternal odor, since he cannot breast feed.

Really, you do yourself few favours by being factually incorrect

lulumama · 14/04/2008 19:13

tom , i have tried to submit an email via the site, and it won;t allow it.

dittany · 14/04/2008 19:17

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Beetroot · 14/04/2008 19:26

< looks around quizzically>

Where's Beetroot?

oiFoiF · 14/04/2008 19:26
SueBaroo · 14/04/2008 19:30

I think we have rumbled Tom as part of sinister website that corrects factual inaccuracies when they are pointed out, tries to encourage fathers not to be intimidated by their babies, and isn't aimed at women.

Goodness me, won't somebody think of the children?!

Tom · 14/04/2008 19:30

Dittany there's a big difference between saying 'it's bedtime' and discussing the private arrangements of my son, his mother and father - I shouldn't really have to spell it out.

Julie Mellor not an active feminist! lol. I'll tell her someone said that

OP posts:
misdee · 14/04/2008 19:34

ok tom for your arguements sake.

when i had dd1, i was being stitched down below for over 45mins. in that time, i didnt get time to hold dd1. she was handed straight to dh after the midwife had weighed anc checked her.

days later dd1 wouldnt settle unless being held. in one last desperate attempt i took the pillowcase from my side of the bed, and put it in her moses basket. instantly fell silent.

with each subsequent birth, i have taken a babies blanket into my bed in the final few days, to help get my smell onto it. i personally feel it helps settle a newborn.

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