Spoilt children disrupt schools

[PABLOP]

here

Margaret Morrissey thinks we cannot instill values unless we are sahm

I think children and teens (and their parents) often get a hard time. There are plenty of wonderful children about. I don't see anymore troublesome children in my kids school than while I was at school 20-25 years ago.

the reason they're so spoilt is because they're so rare, we only have one or two children these days, my nan had 9.

My dh receives letters stating:

My darling child will not be attending detention. I disagree with the punishment given. I am unhappy at the class teacher who does not control the class/picks on darling child/has BSD... and then lists everything else they are unhappy about re the school.

DH also had to do a home visit with social services & the child didn't move from the Playstation whilst they had a case meeting to discuss his educational future.

children are definitely more spoilt materially than they were when I was a child.

televisions in bedrooms were unheard of, games consoles were only just coming on to the market and mobile phones hadn't been invented.

I really think that some parents would rather give in for a quiet life.

Not me. Ds won't be getting a television/games console/mobile phone any time soon.

Child has bds, not teacher! Hmm... but maybe that would be an interesting teaching requirement!

i work with children and i really like them, but i am reaching the end of my tether with it.

my neighbour was a secondary school teacher in one of the less desireable schools in town. One day a child told her to fuck off and was given detention and the parents were informed. The father came into school and said "well I told him he did well for sticking up for himself."

Agree WannaBe.

The phones I confiscate are considerably more sophisticated and pricey than mine

Oh gawd Wannabe, with a father like that, what hope does the child have....

enjoy the chocolate

My mum is a recently retired head teacher. Many a day she had to remove her glasses for meetings with some of the parents, so that if they did hit her (perfectly possible), there wouldn't have been so much damage done!

NN, I sympathise with your situation. I was a single parent to four dcs too - it was damned hard going! I don't think you are doing anything wrong, and fwiw, I don't think the other posters mean that either.

My children ask to watch TV. Without a doubt DS (7) will be in my bedroom in the morning sometime after 7 (he is not allowed up before then) asking to watch Match of the Day.

But now I see this is a problem and will cause DS trouble later in life.

I don't think that this is a TV issue per se, any more than it is a SAHM vs WOTH.

Bozza you son obviously has boundaries. You don't let him get up before 7, he realises this is a rule and sticks to it. What we are talking about is parents who just give in for a 'quiet life' and don't set any boundaries while the kids are younger. they then go on to spend the kids teenage years making endless excuses for their kid's bad behaviour.

I'm teaching ever larger numbers of kids who never take into account other people's needs, because they think that the world revolves around them. If they don't like, say, RE they muck about in the lesson, ignoring the fact that other people in the class may well want to study.

I well remember a conversation with a parent who told me that his son messed about in RE because he didn't like it, and that he, the father, had done the same. He was honestly very surprised when I told him that while his son may not like the subject, it didn't give him the right to misbehave, and wreck the lesson for others. The father and the son simply didn't think of the needs of others.

It is a shame about the SAHM statement in that article. It is obviously nonsense and is distracting from all the other very important issues raised by this report.

I really don't think it is a SAHM thing.

I would bet next months pay that for every pair of WOTH parent who don't have enough time for their kids , there are SAHP who are living through their kids to a harmful degree and think that they sun shines out of their cherubs bottoms!

It is about the lack of effective parenting

Just a little fox among the chickens here so to speak: What example do parents set? Do we sit in front of the computer for hours and hours? Do we engage in creative activities which inspire our children? Do we watch tv till late at night? I am certainly not a good example.

So if we ourselves do not show self control and boundaries in our own behaviour, how will they learn? (This is just another angle on top of all the other good points

I think that children need to learn that there are things that they cannot do because of their age.

In much the same way there are things that I can't do , because of my age! I can't retire, get a bus pass and I'll look a bit daft in the soft play area!

I'm not going to start going to bet at 8, because in general I don't need to do so. But my children do. Because they are childrem ,are growing and need more sleep than an adult

They need to do their homeowr. I don't. However I do need to mark homework!

I don't think you have to live as a child to show them a good example, you show them that you have other, different calls on your time

I agree with the importance of setting a good example.

I know a young girl who was in a very bad situation and as a result her behaviour was atrocious. She's with another family now and her attitude has improved so much. She rarely swears, she's able to communicate better, she has acquired life skills and has a job. She needs to improve in some areas, but she has done SO well.

Parent do have a lot to do with it.

I think it is a lot to do with what society expects from people.

In ex h's country, children are the centre of the universe. But adults REALLY have to conform to a standard of behaviour, much higher than in the UK. So chidlren learn confidence when they are tiny, and behaviour as they grow up. This system works for them.

In France and Germany, there is more pressure from the community to behave yourself than in the UK. Higher standards are expected,and in my experience, your neighbour won't hesitate to wade in and tell your chidlren to behave themselves. The community is set up in Germany in such a way that people have to behave - there is no alternative. You are registered at the town hall. Absent parents can't just disappear unless they leave the country, and they are pursued for maintenance. Everyone talks at length about everything. Children get lessons in being part of the community.

In the UK, by contrast, society doesn't really exist any more, outside the smallest villages. There are few common interests that draw people together. People don't know their neighbours. Anyone can do anything and get away with it. Life is anonymous. Children are on the sharp end of this.
I also noticed about 10 years ago, that on a very bad local estate near us, the people had a sort of warped view of honour and dignity. They had taken these ideas, but didn't know how to apply them. So it came out as stuff like "How dare you give my son a detention" or "I'm standing up for my friend" when said friend was behaving like shit.

I also know somebody who bought their 14 year old a budweiser fridge for christmas....

Might as well say "Oh, why don't you go out and drink darling?"

What's wrong the fridge in the kitchen?

NN, I agree with you.

NN excellent post

NN excellent post. A wise MNetter talks about 'It take a village to raise a child' and they are quite right

this is scary for me, ds off to school next year
in our nursery there is a mum who says this to me 'oh i cant say no to her, you know what they are like' and to her, now, I say NO is big part of it all..
it is hard to feel you are being negative all the time but if you say it in positive way,
yes but not now later on/ after dinner / next weekend..
good idea wrong time sorry love
and give them chance when appropriate to choose

its not all about them, or you!
but this lack of general parenting and making them aware of consequences their actions have in the wider world is top priority imho
for their safety & progress
and for general respect for others

This so-called 'news story' is a load of cobblers. There have always been some over-indulging parents think Veruca Salt in Charlie and Chocolate Factory, Jo Jones in Enid Blyton's Last Term. The original report says that on average there are just 3 or 4 such 'unruly' children per school that works out to about 1% of the school age population. They aren't talking about kids in MBishop's conversation who resist doing what they're asked, they're talking about kids who still won't do it when they're told they must. The unruly kids problem is worse in bad areas with other social problems, and less in relatively affluent neighbourhoods -- which frankly, is where MNers tend to reside.

I can understand teaching union publicising the report, but it was only picked up by the media because they hoped to stir reactions on a slow news weekend. Bring out all the judgmental, "It weren't like this in my day" prejudices .