Dominic C Covid evidence 2

[Newtonianmechanics]

New thread for if old fills up.

Professor J Van Tam has given evidence about how tough the job was. Death threats to family, advice to move, horrendous work load ... as he says, who will want these roles in the future if they are so awful? At one point he thought about resigning.

And I'd argue (much of the present company excepted) in terms of voices on MN, too, certainly re fear about Covid (often scorned), vulnerabilities (generally told to weight those up/ compare to risk from bus {Harries herself did that which led to it being parroted] do the maths oneself etc), shielding (just stay at home and let the rest of us crack on), long Covid (don't be silly), disabilities (see above), bereavement (they probably would have died anyway).

Has anyone else visited the Covid Wall.? It's heart rending.

DH is disabled. He and others i know were royally fucked off at being used as a tool to emotionally blackmail others when people dont give a shit the rest of the time.

And now of course its back to the default setting.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/nov/21/disabled-people-work-from-home-laura-trott-benefits?CMP=twt_b-gdnnews

Prof Sir J Van Tam now onto the autumn. 'It was clear we were losing control of the virus bit by bit over the autumn'. The tier system was riven with delays.

The October tier system - delays between epidemiological data being issued to local authorities and their receiving the financial support packages. Plus, people travelled 'around' tiers eg Liverpool/Manchester for pubs/clubs.

EOTHO - were you consulted or involved? Absolutely not. 'First I heard about it was when it was on TV.' 'It didn't feel sensible to me.'

On 4 Nations approach - 'I heard some complaints about communications'.

I had to go out, so just starting JVT now.

Samuel Jacobs, barrister for TUC on funding for self-isolation.

'Enormously difficult for some people' without well-paid, suitable jobs to cope without a package of support, but the policy on that was 'way above my pay grade'.

JVT not aware of any planning for the funding for lockdown, but had authored article prior about low-paid care workers and influenza spread. Epidemiologically not a good idea with a respiratory virus circulating to put care workers in a position where they go in for shifts.

Hugo Keith KC is allowed to come back and ask if JVT warned in this article that this could cause 'explosive outbreak' in care homes? Yes - but about influenza.

Baroness Hallett expresses sympathy about threats directed at Prof VT and thanks him for his service to his country.

Ends.

Resumes 9.30 am tomorrow.

Catching up a bit

https://x.com/Kit_Yates_Maths/status/1727363214332301449?s=20

JVT says that while mass gatherings - particularly outdoors - are of "very limited epidemiological effect", it's the things "around" those gatherings that are "more concerning", such as attendees going to pubs, bars or restaurants.

A super important-point which is often missed.

He always said that at the time. It was the big argument about the football.

Has anyone ever asked about that time when Boris announced a lockdown in advance so that everyone could go out and get pissed before it?

Hang on. I thought we all had to go to pubs, bars and restaurants to eat out to help out. I am sure I was told that.

I'd forgotten that.

Was that when he pre-announced that he was about to put London into Tier 4 for Christmas so thousands of people crammed into every train out of London to get out before that happened?

Oh no, that was a whole different time!

Called Tier 4 cos they didnt want to call it a lockdown

That was such a mess, those tiers before Christmas. We were in the lowest tier surrounded by highest tiers

It was awful. We had to cancel my mum and sister coming round for Christmas as they live together and so we couldn't be a 'bubble' and everyone raced to the local shopping centre to get presents etc.

Today, we will hear from two witnesses: Professor Dame Angela McLean and Kemi Badenoch MP.

Watch live from 09:30 (with a three minute delay) on our YouTube channel:

Next week's timetable has been published

Gove, Harries, Raab and Hancock as well as the mayors Burnham, Khan and Rotheram

https://covid19.public-inquiry.uk/public-hearings/module-2-public-hearings-timetable/

God I can't wait for Badenoch to be over. Self righteous and patronising, and I expect we will learn absolutely nothing.

I can't watch today and so far live updates are very hard to find

Part 2 of Dan Goyal's thread on WHitty's evidence

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1727626448716832960.html

Summary from the BBC

This morning we heard evidence from Dame Angela McLean, the government's chief scientific adviser.
She was named as Sir Patrick Vallance's replacement earlier this year after serving during the pandemic as the chief scientific adviser to the Ministry of Defence.
Throughout that period she also sat on the Sage committee of scientific advertisers, and co-chaired the influential SPI-M group which modelled the spread of the pandemic.
Giving evidence this morning she said:

• With the benefit of hindsight, the UK should have entered the first national lockdown on 23 March 2020 "two weeks earlier" but we "didn't have the data"
• There was litle choice but to put in place a mandatory stay-at-home order, she suggested, after data showed voluntary restrictions were not effective enough at stopping contact between individuals
• She said Sage and SPI-M were not consulted about the Eat Out to Help Out scheme in the summer of 2020 and suggested there were "other ways" of stimulating the economy.
• At a key Downing Street meeting on 20 September 2020 she advised the Prime Minister to put in place a full lockdown in England, while keeping schools open
• She criticised the decision not to take that advice saying she "couldn't understand" why ministers were not "doing things to avoid an autumn wave"
• She said a series of circuit-breaker lockdowns should have been used in autumn to reduce infections heading into the winter
• She described the eventual decision to order a lockdown, on 31 October 2020, as a "terrible moment".
• "It felt like March again... We delayed a decision and then had to slam the brakes on as hard as possible with the attendant social and economic costs," she added
• She described the detection of the Alpha coronavirus variant in Kent in December 2020 as a "triumph for science" which meant the spike in cases in Kent could be quickly detected and explained

That's going to be full on: Give, Raab and Hancock.

Oh what fun

Joanne Cecil, "In July, Eat Out To Help Out. Were SAGE consulted?"

Angela McLean, "No"

JC, "Was SPI-M consulted?"

AM, "No.

JC, "Are there any references to EOTHO in SAGE or SPI-M documents?"

AM, "No"

JC, "Do you have any knowledge of any science behind EOTHO?"

AM, "No"

JC, "What would your advice have been?"

AM, "Could you not find some other way to stimulate the economy?"

https://x.com/implausibleblog/status/1727696766412194121?s=20

BBC

We've been listening to Kemi Badenoch giving evidence to the Covid-19 inquiry, as lawyers focused on her role as equalities minister during the pandemic.

• Badenoch told the inquiry that fear and conspiracy theories undermined many of the measures her team had put in place to identify risk
• On the spread of misinformation, Badenoch said the government does not yet have "a handle" on it, as she doesn't believe the UK has adapted to a social media age
• She said additional funding would not have stopped ethnic minority groups from being disproportionately impacted by the pandemic, as the equalities minister claimed the propensity for infection correlated with other health conditions rather than ethnic background
• In response to questions from Prof Leslie Thomas KC, Badenoch said there was "no silver bullet" to fight structural inequalities - "we can't remove poverty," she told the inquiry
• Having a record of ethnicity on death certificates was identified by Badenoch as something that should have been done to understand ethnic disparities. "If we had had that, we might, not certainly, but we might have been able to spot the disproportionate impact a little bit earlier," she added

@DuncinToffee thanks for the link I agree with the conclusion that the scientists don’t get the gmt off the hook. All of the sessions I have watched show the calibre of the scientists and whilst they didn’t always agree they dealt with this like the professionals they are. This meant unified messaging.