Scarlett Keeling

[lemonstartree]

Anyone else give a litle gasp of horror when it was revealed that Scarlett was left by her mother, for 'several weeks' in Goa whilst mum went off with her new boyfriend and 5 of her 8 children ????

Am amazed no one else has posted this given the outcry wrt the McCanns!

Cote its a poor analogy. The liklihood of a car coming down the motorway in the next 24 hours is 1. The liklihood of a 15 year old getting raped is what? 1 in a million?

that's a proper risk assessment.

of course Bramshott, just like the mcann case. An abduction takes place in portugal, but only 2 people are suspected...both english. Hmm. More critical thinking needed here!

The night she died, Scarlett had taken ecstacy, cocaine, and LSD. You can use cocaine or marijuana in moderation without anyone noticing, but it very difficult to act normal with ecstacy, and it is flat out impossible to hide it when you are under the influence of LSD, the effects of which last about 10 hours.

If Scarlett knew that she would face her mum when she returned from her night out, she would not get so wasted on a spectrum of powerful Class A drugs. That is, she would have been more able to take care of herself and ask for help when attacked.

Assuming, of course, that her mother was not OK with her teenage daughter getting high on recreational chemicals...

Microwave - Err.. no.

The likelihood of a pretty blond teenage girl on drugs getting into some sort of trouble when alone in a foreign place that is renowned for drug abuse is FAR higher than "1 in a million".

If there was a statistically significant universe of mothers willing to leave their daughters alone in such places, we could see what percentage actually made it out alive. But we can't. Because they don't.

Blimey Cote, I admit I have never been to Goa,but it sounds like a vice filled den of iniquity. Is it really that bad???

In which case I agree 1 in a million has to be reduced. But I would be more worried about the drugs full stop. I would still assume a rape was less likely..not that that is any better granted. Either way a nightmare.

'Blimey Cote, I admit I have never been to Goa,but it sounds like a vice filled den of iniquity. Is it really that bad???'

and the thing about respecting those who 'don't live their lives wrapped in cotton wool' the ignorance in these posts is truly terrifying.

FWIW, noone that i have read here has blamed the mother for her daughter's rape and murder. Many have said that her actions are woefully irresponsible and show a severe neglect of her child. Why the hell is a 15 yr old doing so many drugs in the first place? and then you leave her with the 25 yr old who you think is 'not quite right'. noone thinks the time might have been better spent trying to help Scarlett sort her problems out?

anyway, she is not to blame for the girl's death. but she let her down badly way before this tragedy

yup, the ignorance in that quote is terrifying. there is a lot of drugs in any tourist resort irrespective of how respectable or less so they seem on the surface. you only have to mention your interest in it to one person, eg a bartender and dealers will be there like vultures.

the death penalty for trafficking is not so much of a hindrance either.

I haven't been to Goa but know that is revered as a drug/party heaven. Like Ibiza, but more hardcore. I wouldn't even allow any child of mine to go there with friends, let alone leave one there with strangers, one of whom a young man bonking her

Just to give an idea, there is a kind of music called Goa Trance. I challenge anyone to try to listen to it for more than a few minutes without drugs.

is it

it was rather lovely when Iwent there in 1994

anyone can explain to me the stylistic differences between Goa Trance and Rave? (mind, I could only hack 10 secs of the clip.)

Rave is an all-night, usually open air, drug-fuelled party. You could talk about 'rave music' as in music you expect to find in a rave, but it's not a genre like house, techno, trance, etc.

Goa Trance has higher BPM (beats per minute) than trance and much less percussion. It is very fast but all melody. It is made for and generally listened to by people on LSD who have little interest in dancing non-stop (like ecstacy takers) but nonetheless have nothing to do with sleep and hallucinate for hours.
Disclaimer: My knowledge on this subject is not up to date (domesticated mum emoticon)

This thread is incredible.

Some of you have absolutely not one ounce of shame.

Regardless of the circumstances, this woman lost her daughter in horrific circumstances. She then had to photograph and examine her daughters' corpse to force the local police force into opening a murder docket.

Whatever the circumstances, this poor woman is devastated, absolutely devastated.

This thread should be deleted. It's an insult to that poor, beautiful girls memory.

Agree completely with dejags et al.

Hope all you judgers never make a mistake with your children at any point during the next 18 years, never misjudge anyone, never trust someone you shouldn't trust.

After all, only stupid, hippy, New Age, caravan-living women would do that, right?

Sleep happily in your beds tonight, ladies, safe in the knowledge that this stupid, hippy, New Age, caravan-living woman has got her rightful comeuppance by having her beautiful daughter raped and murdered. Hooray! Now, on to the next sinner. Gosh, we seem to have run out of stones round here.

krang concur fully I said that earlier. Outraged.

Piffle, dejags, et al - Would you leave your teenage daughter, say, in Ibiza, with an older man bedding her, and go off somewhere else?

If not, I don't understand what you are so "outraged" about.

Yes, it is very sad. Yes, her mother must be devastated.

And yes, we can still be shocked at her 'parenting'.

Cote,

I wouldn't go as far as saying I am outraged, but I do think it's shameful, that people could say such hurtful things about a mother who made a mistake. She has paid for her mistake, in the most uncertain terms.

None of us were there, we do not know the exact circumstances. Therefore, we are not in a position to judge or comment.

What I would or wouldn't do in similar circumstances simply doesn't have a bearing on the situation.

Kicking somebody when they are down is simply not on, especially when it involves the death of a child. Could you imagine that poor woman's horror if she found this thread?

It appears to me (by the tone on this thread)that the fact that young woman has been brutally murdered and that the lives of her family have been shattered has passed by some of the more judgemental and opinionated posters on this thread.

her daughter has been raped, possibly drugged ( maybe she was willing but do we know) maybe her own mother knows her daughters situation and abilities better than we do huh?
When was 15 I answered personal ads from older men, gave full address. Got followed one day and nearly got in. Teens think they're superman and her mothers idea and expectations of who scarletts was staying with compared to a cunning teenagers plans... Well I am the mother to a teenaged boy and he knows plenty of girls who lie to parents to get out on their own. One girl nearly died of drugs overdose and anal injury. Yet her parents left her with family friend while they were working away for a week rather than disrupt her schooling!
They received nothing but sympathy from the community.
ok so here is not Goa, but are you suggesting she fully expected scarlett to meet a sticky end? Because the responsibility lies with the fucker that killed her. Not with her mother.

we only 'know' this guy was 'bedding' scarlett from reports in the likes of The Sun etc.
(so, fuck me, living in a caravan means you 'deserve' for your daughter to be raped and killed does it?)
NO - I would not have left MY daughter, however,i did'nt know scarlett, i don't know what kind of person she was, i don't know the way she was bought up, i don't know the moral framework she operated under.

her mum seems an intelligent lady, who has been fighting for scarlett against all the odds - she has my admiration!

Yes, we do know Scarlett willingly took those drugs. Scarlett told witness that she had taken three drops of LSD, two Ecstasy pills and cocaine.

Even without witness statement, here is why I would think Scarlett took these drugs herself:

(1) You can't spike someone's drink with cocaine, because it doesn't do anything when ingested with the possible exception of burning a hole in your stomach. And you can't make anyone snort something they don't want to.

(2) You can hardly spike someone's drink with ecstacy because it is VERY bitter and would render any drink seriously, unbelievably undrinkable. Even if your victim drinks it, effects kick in about an hour after ingestion (I think. Not sure about exact time, but no less than half an hour).

(3) You would be able to spike someone's drink with LSD, but that would be rather pointless for rape in the short term because effects kick in about two hours later (again, not sure of exact time but definitely more than 1.5 hrs)

Actually we know he said that she did! He witnessed her being attacked and legged it?
what a guy to believe.

I never said spiked, she was 15, possibly rebellious experimental and game for the thrill. Whoever offered her the drugs is also culpable imo. I'd take any published"witness" statements with extreme caution indeed

I never judged the McCanns and certainly don't want to judge this. But I do think that when you have a child of the age of a child in any awful case like this, you can't help but imagine what you would do.

My DD2 is 16 yrs and a few months and I cannot, for one minute, imagine leaving her in a foreign country whilst going off travelling. this is not meant to be judgmental but I can't help think of it cos of the age of my child. I am sure it was the same with the McCanns and parents with children of a similar age.

I have a problem leaving my DD2 (DD1 is away) for a night on her own here at home. I have done it and do do it on occasions but I do feel uneasy about it sometimes... daft maybe but there you go. So to say I am gobsmacked at leaving her in a foreign country is an understatement. BUT I know everyone isn't like me.... different parents have different parenting styles and it does depend on the child.

I feel desperately sorry for the mother cos she looked such a beautiful girl.

It looks like Fiona MacKeown is being charged with negligence BBC Link

oh that'll learn her and take some of the heat off the
Keystone cops charading as law enforcement...

Been to Goa

Not somewhere to leave an unaccompanied minor

Not the same as leaving 3 under 3 home alone though, IMO