Do you back opt-out organ donation>

[eleusis]

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/7051235.stm

I'm not sure how I feel about this. I appreciate they are trying to save lives and that is of course a good thing. But, I think people should have to give consent for their organs to be removed, not consent to have them left in tact. There's just something creepy out thinking my organs will be taken away the second I am pronouncec dead. But, if you asked me if I'd be willing to donate my organs when I die I'd say yes of course. I guess I just want to choice to be mine (or my next of kin).

I think it's should be opt out but I'm writing from the POV of a parent whose child might need a transplant in the future.

The problem with opt-in as things stand now is that you may be absoltuely committed to donating your organs but your next of kin can veto it. So really the choice isn't yours.

I'm all for opt out rather than opt in. It makes so much more sense really.

It is a bit controlling but the choice is still with the individual.

I think that once someone is signed up to the register/carries a card then the next of kin should have no "choice" to make. I can't help but wonder how many people that were signed up to the register had their organs wasted because their next of kin said no. I think that should be scrapped - if someone carries a card and is signed up to the register then that's THEIR choice, not their next of kins.

I don't like the idea of opt-out - I think the poorest and most vulnerable people in our soceity would be the ones who would end up donating organs without even knowing that they had a chance to opt out. Already this country struggles with getting information on basic rights across to vast swathes of the population - so what's to say that those same people would know about being able to -optout?

Actually I should correct my original post. Relatives don't have a legal right to veto but obviously if they are absolutely against it then the team will consider their wishes.

walnut - but how do you ensure that everyone knows that they are able to opt-out (or indeed make sure they know that they are automatically on the register in the first place?)

Dead people don't need their organs. Dying people often do but 50% of them will die waiting. 50%!

People should consider how they may feel if it was someone close to them needing organ donation and then work out how they feel about this issue.

Opt out! Opt out! Opt out!

The way I see it is that people who are still living but would die without an organ donation should get priority over people who are already dead. That's why I'm signed up to the organ donation register and back opt-out donation. But that's just my personal opinion.

I think there would have to be a long 'adjustment' period in order that those people were reached QOQ. Absolutely. But eventually it could become as natural as knowing that you need a licence to drive.

And if there are people who are unable to make the decision for themselves, for example those with mental health problems or learning difficulties then they should be opted out.

It's a difficult situation and my judgement is somewhat clouded.

Also we have to consider the angle of who approaches the NOK in a potential donation scenario. It can be really stressful for the family to have to make that choice at that time AND for the staff when they are doing their best for the grieving family as well as all the practical stuff with the patient.To then have to approach this delicate subject, is very difficult- SO many opportunities are wasted because of timing.

An opt out would relieve the burden of that, plus the NOK would know it is what the patient wanted. To over come the consent & knowledge thing every patient could be notified as they are seen at GP's/routine hospital appts. If a big enough advertising campaign were launched it should reach everybody.

I think we should keep opt-in, but make the wishes of the donor legally binding, tbh.

My MIL had a liver transplant 5 years ago for a genetic condition that resulted in chronic biliary cirrhosis. To say we were grateful to the donor and his family is a huge understatement. A few months after her transplant George Best was in the papers after going out on a drinking binge despite having received a transplant several months before, and as a result doctors reported that people were denying permission for livers to be used in transplantation as they were supposedly only given to alcoholics who didn't deserve them because they'd brought it on themselves.

It's a very emotive issue, mainly because it's directly linked to the death of a loved one, and it's hard enough to comprehend a sudden death at the time without having to make decisions about what to do with their body whilst their heart is still beating, albeit with the aid of a machine. Opt out organ donation is something I strongly agree with. Donating body parts isn't quite as simple as slicing the body up as soon as the person has popped their clogs. A series of very specific medical tests are carried out independently by several doctors to establish brain stem death, and even then individual circumstances have to permit that donation is a possibility. It has never been and will never be like a scene from an abattoir with conveyor belts of bodies having usable bits removed and the rest thrown onto a pile.

My personal belief (and please don't berate me for saying this) is that as far as I'm concerned, it's my body to do with whatever I wish even after death, and when I die, if possible, I want any usable part to be given to someone who can benefit from it, including skin and corneas, and the rest can be given to medical research for the next generations of doctors and scientists to learn from. It's not good enough for me to selfishly think that someone else can make the decision or that my son/mum/partner would be devastated at the thought of my body being desecrated after death - I would be devastated if my son/mum/partner desperately needed a transplant but died waiting for one because of the stigma surrounding death and the fact that we can't talk about it. When I'm dead, I'm dead, and I would far rather be remembered as someone who chose to help the living than as a plaque in the ground that people occasionally put flowers on.

But the bottom line is not enough people feel strongly enough to opt in.

Todays stats

Today is: Friday, 19 October 2007
Since 1 April 2007:

419 people have donated organs
an additional 1,002 people have donated corneas
1,355 people have received the gift of sight
1,240 people have received transplants
7,491 people are still waiting for transplants

As at 31 March 2007, 14,201,229 were on the register.

I think by that time that George Best received his transplant, he was already suffering from the effects of long term alcohol abuse, which affects the brain to the extent that what we perceive as normal thinking and reasoning, is impossible.

Had he been an NHS patient, he would probably have been denied the opportunity of a new liver.

I think he WAS an NHS patient-I'm not aware of anyone getting a private liver transplant in this country? Woudl be interested to know?

Seriously, this issue needs all the publicity it can get and I would encourage everyone to make their wishes known to their next of kin and sign up to the Register at
www.uktransplant.org.uk/ukt/.

I do draw the line at opt-out at the moment as I think it can sometimes be just too much for the family but I would rather that by widespread publicity that people make their wishes known.

Just spreading word through GP surgeries and hospital appointments would not reach a large percentage of people and healthy ones at that-most men in their middle years never darken their GP's door!

Please all of you think seriously about signing up. And spread the word. And if you feel emotional about the prospect of a part of your loved one being removed, please be assured that the donor cadaver is treated with the utmost respect and care, and that it's the loss of your loved one that hurts, they are gone no matter what.

May be my misunderstanding because the Cromwell Hospital is a private hospital.

Good post MrsArchie

I am a bit undecided on this. Both DH and I have organ donor cards and we have talked about our wishes for any organs to be used in the event of our deaths.

As QoQ said, the people opting out are more likely to be the better educated members of the public. It would be difficult to inform every single person in the UK about their right to opt out, I do not think that it would be feasible.

The question is, how do we encourage as many people as possible to sign up to the register, and carry a donor card? And, yes the wishes of the donor card carrier should be more important than the NOK.

With the new change in the law concerning Mental Capacity, Advanced Directives are now legally recognised and therefore helpful to specify in one of those if you want to be an organ donor as well.
I don't really understand the concern about better educated people-we need to reach everybody. I think everyone has to make their own decision about this, I am not aware that being better educated makes you less likely to want to be an organ donor-when you're dead, you don't need your organs any more full stop.What's the point of opting out realistically? I realise some people may have a distaste for this but I don't think that is related to education.
Anyway, I think George Best chose to have his surgery done privately but I'm betting he had a liver from the transplant program.

When I said educate through GP's & OPD appts I meant AS WELL as a huge advertising campaign. It would have to be over a number of years I would have thought as Sagger suggested to get it accepted into our way of life. Obviously it would be better to have EVERYONE doing it straight away as the need is so desperate but if we could have a voluntary phase with loads of publicity hopefully it would become routine/accepted.

With George Best, the donation was via the NHS, but he was operated on at a private hospital, but by a NHS surgeon.

I believe the register should be opt-out. If a person really has strong feelings towards non-donation then they should get off there arse and opt-out. I also believe the opt-out scenario would take pressure off loved ones at a very difficult time.

Organs are removed and retrieved in a very professional manner and are not whipped out the moment a person is pronounced dead.

DS has had 3 transplants in 4 months, if these organs hadn't been available I would no longer be able to feel my son in my arms or brush my cheek against the top of his head. During my current stay in hospital I have witnessed the deaths of 2 babies because organs have not been available. I hope to god I never have to see the pain I have seen on their parents faces ever again.

I am very biased, but I see no reason not to have opt-out.

Coley what an ordeal for you I hope your DS continues to thrive

Coley how's he doing? I bumped your other thread but you must have missed it.

i don't know how i feel about it tbh.i dont care what happens to my organs or my dps, but i just cant contemplate the fact that if one of my children died how i would feel at the thought of them being gone and having to deal with the fact that he/she was going to be cut up and have organs removed.i know it's selfish to feel like this but i think it is wrong to have the decision taken away from me when it comes to my children.

Should def be opt out, if people feel that strongly about not donating there could be a Non-Donor card

Yes, I back it.