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Is there a thread about the poisoning of Skripal? [title edited by MNHQ]

998 replies

OhYouBadBadKitten · 07/03/2018 13:41

I've not seen a thread about it at all, but surely there must be?

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StealthPolarBear · 10/03/2018 22:47

I think they are making the point

OhYouBadBadKitten · 10/03/2018 23:03

www.health.ny.gov/environmental/emergency/chemical_terrorism/nerve_agents_tech.htm says it can take hours to develop in some cases.

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OhYouBadBadKitten · 10/03/2018 23:11

I've been trying to find a bit of a timeline.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/mar/10/salisbury-poisoning-sergei-skripal-local-news-international-incident mentions attending people suffering symptoms.

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ohfortuna · 11/03/2018 01:25

why is it that when "they" kill Russian spies is always seems to be with some dramatic poisoning
it's a calling card

PrincessFiorimonde · 11/03/2018 01:51

Very interesting thread.

Fionne · 11/03/2018 02:16

So now they're looking at the possibility the nerve agent was administered through flowers and it has me wondering if these poisons ever die? Or do they just continue to exist? So if for example there was a trace of the poison on a grave stone would it always be there? Or would exposure to wind, rain, sun, snow etc eventually obliterate all trace of the poison.

mixture · 11/03/2018 06:51

What was the daughter doing there anyway? Was it his birthday? Reminds me of all of those 'Desmond Bagley'-novels that were so popular back in the 1970's.

Sostenueto · 11/03/2018 08:48

Why shouldn't she be there?Confused she's the only child he has left. His wife and 43 yr old son died not so long back.

happyvalley74 · 11/03/2018 09:03

I understand that the daughter usually lives in Russia

meditrina · 11/03/2018 09:18

"So now they're looking at the possibility the nerve agent was administered through flowers and it has me wondering if these poisons ever die? Or do they just continue to exist? So if for example there was a trace of the poison on a grave stone would it always be there? Or would exposure to wind, rain, sun, snow etc eventually obliterate all trace of the poison"

Yes, it would eventually degrade. That aspect of nerve agent performance is its persistence - ie how long it exists in form that can do harm before it breaks down. How long it takes depends on the type of agent (as well as amount present) so a stable, persistent agent could stick around for much longer, months (you can add thickeners to ones which would otherwise evaporate rapidly), and you need specialist cleaning to remove it for sure (decontamination)

My guess is that the people who fell ill were in contact with the primary source, or a very strong secondary source. Also, they have spread it - quite possibly by touch - to at least one other location. Which means that every location they had visited since they left their house needs to be checked and cleaned.

It's not quite like being infectious - they wouldn't have been shedding as one would a virus. But say they still had some on their hands, and they touched things, that might be enough for transfer. Especially if it was readily water soluble and they were sweaty/damp for any reason

OutwiththeOutCrowd · 11/03/2018 09:23

An audacious crime, designed to get a lot of attention.

Aside from some of the theories appearing in the media, I was wondering about a contaminated front door handle or car door handles, something the Russian couple would be sure to touch outside the home, the former being a possible source of contamination for the police officer too if he entered the house without protective clothing on in the early stages of the investigation.

Since traces of nerve agent were found at Zizzi where the Russian couple dined, two hours before they were on the bench, it would seem a relatively slow acting substance was involved.

It’s almost impossible not to speculate whilst remaining mindful that there are real people involved, people who are gravely ill.

OhYouBadBadKitten · 11/03/2018 09:26

I think anyone that is worried by this can be reassured that if contamination were to have happened beyond where they are focusing decontamination, then it seems likely that this would have already happened after a week of people going about their daily lives.

What I'm trying to say is that I would still go to Salisbury without being worried about being contaminated.

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OhYouBadBadKitten · 11/03/2018 09:27

Out, yes we do need to remember that.

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Sostenueto · 11/03/2018 09:48

So the daughter lives in Russia. Surely she can visit her father whenever she likes without people questioning why she was thereShock

eloisesparkle · 11/03/2018 09:51

All I can think of is that poor policeman so ill.

BoreOfWhabylon · 11/03/2018 10:22

Interesting discussion on Radio 4 Broadcasting House this morning

www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b09tyzh0

One of the contributors was Bill Browder, British/American financier and persona non grata in Russia. His friend and former lawyer was the murdered Sergei Magnitsky. Puts a lot of the background to this into perspective. He also has a piece in the Mail on Sunday

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5486489/BILL-BROWDER-hit-Putin-hurts-wallet.html

He says that all those at the top of the pecking order (ie close to Putin) in Russia have properties and vast investments in Britain. He thinks they should be confiscated, would send a far stronger message to Putin than boycotting football matches.

I'm inclined to agree with him.

thecatfromjapan · 11/03/2018 10:57

It's increasingly looking as though the persistence of the nerve agent was very much underestimated initially.

It seems that diners (at Zizzi) and pub vistors are now being asked to wash their possessions.

Does that (further) point to a tweaked/new nerve agent?

ohfortuna · 11/03/2018 11:10

How very alarming for everyone in the vicinity

Rumpledfaceskin · 11/03/2018 11:13

Just what I was thinking. We’re not too far from Salisbury but I certainly wouldn’t fancy popping into the town right now. Just awful.

thecatfromjapan · 11/03/2018 11:17

I don't think I'd panic about visiting Salisbury.

It seems to be more the case that people who were in very specific locations, in a period of time afterwards, are being advised.

ohfortuna · 11/03/2018 11:17

Last week Putin was bragging about Russia's new advanced nuclear weapons technology, here he appears to be letting us know that he also has developed new chemical weapons

Emboldened by his successful interference in the US election he's doubled down with the megalomania 🤤

PatriarchyPersonified · 11/03/2018 12:23

The advice to wash clothes if you were in the area is a worrying development.

I'd read that as the authorities still being uncertain as to the full method of contamination and taking extra precautions as a result.

It's too broad a piece of advice to be related to specific information.

thecatfromjapan · 11/03/2018 12:28

Really, Patriarchy? As in, the authorities still don't specifically know what this is, how it contaminates, how it becomes inactive?

meditrina · 11/03/2018 12:28

"Dame Sally said after "rigorous scientific analysis" there was some concern that prolonged exposure over weeks and months could cause health problems"

That suggests it is very persistent.

PatriarchyPersonified · 11/03/2018 12:35

I think they know what it is,it's the contamination method that might still be uncertain. Telling everybody to wash their clothes is a big shout and would imply that they don't have a 100% clear understanding of exactly where that has and hasn't been contaminated. There may even be concerns about the size of the initial cordon etc.

Medit

Agree with you about persistency. That profile would indicate the most persistent type of agent, that had then gone on to be thickened/polymerised to make it last even longer. I mean, months?!

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