Charlie Gard 10

[user1498911470]

Hi guys new thread.

Let's try to keep this one as sensible and measured as the past 7 threads have been.

Please note the MNHQ comment on thread number 7.

"Hi everyone,

..... We had to remove several parent-blaming posts, so we'd like to ask folk not to do this. We think we can all agree that this is a truly awful time for all involved and we just wouldn't wish it on anyone. If there's anything we could do with more of, it's support. We'll continue to remove reported posts that break TGs (if we've missed something, do feel free to let us know).

If we have to make too many deletions, we will need to look at removing the thread; which is the last thing we wish to do.

Thanks all"

Starting now as 9 will fill up quickly.

@Neonrainbow

The vast majority of the posts ive seen quoting CA is in a "can you believe how stupid these people are" kind of a way. Sometimes accompanied by a comment to that effect. Its just unnecessary.

I won't pretend to have kept a post count or done a textual analysis of everything written, but my own feeing hasn't been "how stupid" but "how convenient and self-serving and whipped-up" and I've seen that reflected here.

It's interesting that @Umpteenthnamechange finds the populism involved significant from an academic standpoint because it's certainly been something that's jumped out.

Why is bold going squirly? Not helpful.

I guess I will now be called a troll or told to jog off

Completely unnecessary and provocative comment.

@Neonrainbow

"The vast majority of the posts ive seen quoting CA is in a "can you believe how stupid these people are" kind of a way. Sometimes accompanied by a comment to that effect. Its just unnecessary."

I won't pretend to have kept a post count or done a textual analysis of everything written, but my own feeing hasn't been "how stupid" but "how convenient and self-serving and whipped-up" and I've seen that reflected here.

It's interesting that @Umpteenthnamechange finds the populism involved significant from an academic standpoint because it's certainly been something that's jumped out.

(There. Fixed.)

Umpteenthnamechange a thought provoking post.

The irony of Charlie's Army (a group which will only accept you in their ranks if your mindset matches their own) calling anyone fascist is not lost!

Rabbitnohare - perhaps you're right and my choice of words wasn't intended to be provocative. But I was actually nervous about posting something that disagreed with others and I don't think people should be afraid to express their opinions. I'm probably expressing this badly too....

For me it is only about Charlie and his best interests. Just my view and I know others will disagree

yes of course, you are the only person in the world and on this thread who has Charlie's best interests at heart.

No smugness there...

Oh dear, I do hope these threads are not about to descend i to arguement sand name calling, they've been so informative and interesting so far.

For my part I have been following the threads as this is a ground breaking case, I do believe it will be referred back to for many years to come. I'm also interested to hear from the medical professionals on here who have been far better at explaining procedures/terminology/standard practice than the MSM.

The CA stuff is secondary to me, though I confess that I am shocked that a large group of people can be so ill-informed and closed off to debate/discussion. Perhaps we really haven't come that far after all, in some ways it is reminicesnt of Witch Hunts with the mob baying for blood.

Anyway, that's my tuppence worth.

"words) 'CA probably wouldn't be able to afford private healthcare anyway' are unnecessary. Because we disagree with their comments and consider them stupid they must be poor? That is not reasoned debate."

I can't remember who posted that, but wasn't the point that private healthcare is unaffordable to MOST now? I think it was regarding NI contributions and whether they should be optional.

I think it must be true that 90% of the population couldn't pay for could private health cover by withholding their NINOs. That's not a sherry point. In fact it mirrors what the family's spokesman said yesterday about "If they were rich..."

Rabbitnohare I didn't intend to be smug. Not at all. I only meant that I'm interested in Charlie and his case not the opinions of CA. I now wish I'd never posted as I knew I would be saying the wrong thing. I wish I'd not said anything. I'll leave the thread

I think we need to not all fall out over what is being posted and try to remain focussed on Charlie and what is the best thing for him. I would say the posters on this thread fundamentally disagree with what CA say and how they go about showing their support but we shouldn’t be nasty or feel morally superior because we have a different viewpoint.

I enjoy this thread mostly because i can get all the information i need in one place and in general there is a compassionateness and level headedness to all the debate. We need to continue in that way.

ChristopherWren sorry cross post but words such as 'stalking' I do find provocative.

I do know people in real life who support CA.

It pains me because of the abuse to the GOSH staff, I posted on another thread that we had a wreath sent to our house with my dc names on due to my dh job and some online comments.

The GOSH page is still removing threats towards them.

With regards to CA, I think it's fair game to pick apart their comments and mob mentality.

These are the people who are protesting outside GOSH, where parents and their sick children have to walk past and hear them calling the HCP inside murderers. These are the people who are 'thunderclapping' ridiculous statement and untruths about the HCP's etc. These are the people who are trying to undermine our legal system etc.
They are deliberately trying to bring down GOSH. It's sickening.

And some of us have had our email addresses fraudulently used to sign that dreadful petition than has a paragraph calling GOSH murderers.

It's definitely fair game to take the piss out of these people.

Sherry point? SNEERY point.

The direction and scope of threads does drift and it's ok to put forward your view, Christopher Wren

@ChristopherWren

"But I was actually nervous about posting something that disagreed with others and I don't think people should be afraid to express their opinions. I'm probably expressing this badly too...."

No that's completely fair enough. You SHOULD be able to express an opinion or disagree here. We all should.

Some friends have been gobsmacked that emails have been used fraudulently. Without threads like these with posters saying it has happened it wouldn't be known about.

I am sad that a thread I find so interesting and informative has been derailed be vague existential critique.

I have personally found this to be the sanest corner of the internet n the issue of Charlie Gard.

Can we get back to discussion of the case and the issues that surround it? Yes, that includes in the influence of SM and CA. They are now (tragically) inseparable from the issues in this case.

"I think we need to not all fall out over what is being posted and try to remain focussed on Charlie and what is the best thing for him"

Yes.

And what will be right for the next child who ends up in a tragic medical situation and how that is decided and by whom.

I think,if I may say one more thing before taking a break, that I in no way object to a different point of view.

If someone supports the treatment and comes on here to discuss that in a reasoned way, that is to be welcomed.

What I do find puzzling and a bit provocative is posters coming on simply to critsize the existence of the threads or how they develop.

It feels rude, as if in RL someone comes up and interrupts a flowing conversation and then walks off again.

@Sostenueto your posts across these threads I've found have been measured and thoughtful. Hope you're ok.

Completely agree @rabbitnothare

Totally agree with that, rabbitnothare. And in rl it's better just to ignore and carry on, not engage them in a debate that takes you waaaaay off the point and gets nasty. If people want to bitchplop rather than discuss then let them. They'll get bored and wander off if not answered.

Rabbitnohare - I haven't simply come on here to criticise. I posted on earlier threads about my own experience in hospital with a close relative where we had to make the decision to switch off life support.

I don't wish to cause any disagreement and it was never my intention to derail the thread. I apologise.