CROWDS going into KENSINGTON TOWN HALL ..... BBC NEWS now

[RTKangaMummy]

They were outside but now the crowds have all entered the civic centre town hall

I am not surprised that this is happening

Oh and the £10 million to refurb signifying residents being 'heard' 😂
It was to make them pretty.

Fire systems like sprinklers weren't implemented. Fire escapes weren't refurbished. Fire breaks were removed. Gas pipes weren't boxed in. Fire containing concrete ceilings were removed and replaced by floating ceilings. Has nobody read the blogs from the resident committees begging to be heard with fore safety concerns?

Nice, pretty, non fire retardant cladding was put on, though. And cheap bathrooms and kitchens.

Only a utter cunt had to say that.

fore fire

Dry risers were unusable, too. Apparently the emergency lighting in the fire escape also didn't work. Fire alarm didn't work or was inaudible.

This ahs been going on for many many years too. My DM lived in high rise in Glasgow in the late 80s. Council came and fitted windows that only opened an inch. Everyone complained. They're still there. With cladding outside the building.

Some schools have the same cladding , too. If you don't believe it's all about reducing costs you are deluded. LAs think they get rewards for doing this. Tory councils think they are Doing The Right Thing.

Would you agree wholeheartedly to sprinklers if you believed you were in a safe building and didn't need them?

The key there, ButterflyFree is the swift evacuation, not an option available to the residents Of Grenfell Tower. It should all have been factored in, a risk planning that included every contingency.

The protest are needed, their anger needs to be seen.

No use sitting quietly. Theresa May only released 5 million after the protests tonight. More protests are needed urgently to ensure all families get rehoused in safe suitable accommodation asap. And to ensure that those responsible will be prosecuted asap. No longwinded public enquiry please, treat this as manslaughter off to the police and courts. Now.

This is an utter tragedy which needs addressing by central government. Councils have had their budgets slashed by about 40% since 2010. They are going to go with the lowest bidders.

There are demonstrations outside my local council offices all the time, people pissed off for so many reasons, their local skate park closing for example. The fact is, there is no money and that is the fault of central government. Where does it come from other than council tax and business rates which no one wants. Pot holes aren't getting filled, old people aren't getting looked after properly (which is only going to get worse) and the right focus on safety may not be there.

This LA may have made a monumental fuck up by focusing on exactly the wrong kind of refurbishment but the bigger picture has got got to be addressed. This has killed people.

Oh good grief. Given what I said earlier as an example of business and the consequences of capitalism. If this is true.

Peaceful sit down protest in Oxford Circus too now

Plumbhead stop inciting violence.

I would take anything the Daily Mail shite reports with a pinch of salt unless
Verified by another legitimate news source. Although I wouldn't be surprised if the truth is that awful.

Protests are not by their nature violent.
Despite all the 'rent a mob' type comments earlier no damage was made and no one was hurt inside the town hall.
Protest is an important part of democracy. Stop trying to shut down democracy.

'I have read - and I have no idea if this is true - that the residents voted against sprinklers and there have also been reports that rubbish was left to pile up in the corridors.'

Where have you read this? It sounds like unsubstantiated gossip.

I'm so angry on behalf of these people. I work, I rent a property and even if my property with my 2yo daughter was unsafe to live in because of my landlord's incompetence, I couldn't afford to leave. I couldn't afford to move. This is so common. This could happen to such a massive percentage of the population.

How can anyone say this isn't political when the tories blocked a law saying landlords shouldn't have to make properties fit for human habitation!?

That five year old boy that got separated from his family in the smoke and died? Their fault. The poor boy who carried his disabled mum down countless sets of stairs to safety, but their dad is still missing? Their fault.

One of the protestors said victims are sleeping on the streets tonight. I wouldn't be surprised if that was true. No it's not reported, it's only because the interview was live that it was said.

I'm so angry for them. I've sent my clothes and my child's clothes and nappies and toys and books. But I feel so helpless.

And it might not be useful, and it might not be rational. But if my friends or my family were in that building, I'd want to riot too.

Fuck the people that did this. Fuck the people who treat the poor as a different species. Because that feeling is growing and growing, amongst the poor and especially amongst the young poor. Fuck this inequality. People are dying.

A protest would, I think, carry more weight if the immediate urgent needs of the people actually involved in the disaster were tended to. Why the need for a kneejerk protest? I don't understand that. The complaint is absolutely valid and it will still be valid next week, next month. The benefit of letting the urgent matters be resolved is that more will be known and people will have had a chance to say goodbye to their loved ones and start grieving for their loss without having to make way for protesters.

I can't believe that somebody has actually suggested that due process not be followed, ie. no enquiry and that somebody else has suggested that procedures be bypassed to 'speed up' the identification process. This can only come from ignorance because if you'd been at the other end of those processes you would want due deference and professionalism to prevail rather than mistakes to be made.

Talking of mistakes... it's not so long ago that asbestos was lauded as a marvellous fire retardant material. It still it, it just happens to be inherently dangerous in its own right. Research and professional 'best judgement' are what they are, the best available techniques and knowledge for that time. It's all very well for an uneducated public to hop up and down but we all do put our trust in professionals to do their jobs with utmost care and diligence and, since we don't possess that prior knowledge ourselves, we're not really in a position to judge. Hence the need for an Enquiry, not a circus or a knitting circle around the guillotine.

Article about the cladding here, including interesting expert viewpoints. It was well known not to be fire retardant and a cost saving choice was directly made:

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/jun/16/manufacturer-of-cladding-on-grenfell-tower-identified-as-omnis-exteriors

the residents voted against sprinklers

What the fuck has that got to do with anything

'Hopkins et al are going to be ALL over this'

Well she is firmly siding with the protestors on twitter at the moment.

I don't blame people for trying to get their voices heard whilst all attention is on them, they will go back to being ignored and marginalised soon enough.

I don't believe that either, Rufus. I can't see that residents would have any kind of veto over a fire safety installation if it were planned.

Lying, the firm used non retardant cladding as a cost saving exercise. This is not due process being ignored, this is a fact.

*They have lost everything.

They have been ignored, belittled and threatened with legal action for years. They warned about this and their concerns were brushed aside.

And now their lives loved ones are dead - quite possibly for the sake of saving £5000.

How people can expect calm, rational behaviour from them is beyond me.*

This. I expect there will be rioting tonight.*

I fucking would be. It's a fucking disgrace.

Hahahaha at trusting the professionals to do their jobs.

That didn't turn out very well for the people who died did it?

The 'uneducated people' fucking knew it wasn't safe in that block of flats. But fuck them, Eh? What did they know.

Well of course they wouldnt lying

I had to have a fire door fitted in my house

I didnt want one

But we had to have it and we were inspected after the build to make sure we had put one in

Ridiculous fucking comments...why dont people think

'The residents voted against sprinklers'

Bullshit. Some were anxious about having boilers and hot water and the work not being delayed. Do you seriously think a vote was taken and residents deliberately chose not to have something that would make them safer? And since when would tenants be given the power to veto safety measures anyway? What a load of offensive nonsense.

That's not what I meant about 'due process', Dawndonna. There is always a balance between cost and quality and it's endemic in every aspect of business. Mostly nothing bad happens. Still the same risk taken though.

Posters advocating for riots.  You're truly <span class="italic">frightening</span>. <img loading="lazy" class="inline-flex mumsnet-emoji" alt="Hmm" src="https://www.mumsnet.com/build/assets/hmm-PR4o6B1t.png">