Priests to control school admissions: Discuss

[TheKingIsInTheAltogether]

So the Catholic Education Service has devised a new admissions process for its schools putting the decision on whether a family is considered "practicing" or not in the hands of its priests. The priests will grant a Certificate of Catholic Practice to families who they deem to be following Canon Law, but are able to apply some professional discretion.

Families will need one of these certificates if they want a place at an oversubscribed catholic school.

However the Schools Adjudicator has thrown a spanner in the works by declaring the new process in breach of the Admissions Code, and that decision is going to be challenged in the courts ...
www.theguardian.com/education/2016/nov/20/catholic-church-court-priests-faith-school-places

It seems to me that the Catholic Church is actively promoting its schools as academically desirable and using that as a carrot to coerce all Catholics into following Canon Law to the letter. In areas where schools are very oversubscribed, families will inevitably need to compete for these certificates and the bar for obtaining them can be raised at the priest's discretion. Families won't dare miss Mass in case their faith is considered questionable.

I can't believe anyone would think that an acceptable admissions system!

I don't think race has anything to do with this at all Supper

If Canon Law that says Catholic parents have to give their dc a Catholic education, and the government decided to no longer fund faith schools of any type from public funds, would the RC church have to step in and educate all those children?

It seems somewhat desperate to need to force attendance at church to guarantee a school place.

Within any admission category, if it is oversubscribed then distance should come into play not merit badges. Therefore the child of the busy gay couple will get a place if he or she lives nearer than the child of the cleaning/flower arranging SAHP. Hopefully this new 'proof' will make things more transparent to future parents. Will families moving to the area be able to use their previous priest's evidence?

blimey maybe it does, because almost all the African-Caribbean people I know that practise a faith attend Seventh Day Adventist, Pentecostal, Baptist, Evangelical, or mormon churches.
Incoming Poles tend to be Catholic, and white.

But the important fact is whether they are are practising, contributing to that faith. Not their skin colour. Part of the baptismal promises is to bring your child up and educate them in the faith.
I don't know if this is the case in all schools but in ours the sibling rule comes very high so in a high sibling year (when sibling in the school is only baptised for purpose of getting into the school) those practising Catholics with no siblings have no chance of getting in. It's very frustrating for those genuinely wishing to educate their children in a Catholic setting.

Or indeed for those whose children are excluded because they aren't Catholic.

Also if those families are of those denominations then why do they want to go to a catholic school? The catholic education is part of going to a catholic school not just the academic success.

It's very frustrating for those genuinely wishing to educate their children in a Catholic setting.

Well there's a simple solution - the Catholic Church funds the education of the children of any family wishing to send their child to a Catholic school.

I'd homeschool my kids before letting them attend any religious school.

What I don't understand is why they have to be 'educated' (in the Catholic way) in school hours. If they don't get a place and unfortunately have to go to a school with non-Catholics, why can't the religious aspect be dealt with after school and at weekends? Won't they get more work done if they are not continually traipsing off to prayers? I assume that your lifestyle is geared towards Catholicism so not being immersed in it for a few hours a day during term time won't have adverse effects. Unfortunately not getting a place at your desired school is something the rest of the population deal with all the time.

You don't go up the admission criteria because of being 'more catholic', it is based on distance in a tie break, just like any school.

As for priests signing to say the family is practising, that has always been up to the priests discretion, as far as I am aware.

"I assume that your lifestyle is geared towards Catholicism so not being immersed in it for a few hours a day during term time won't have adverse effects. Unfortunately not getting a place at your desired school is something the rest of the population deal with all the time."

I think the aim is to stop the children from realising that non Catholics are human beings who are capable of kindness and being good. It's far easier to demonise people you haven't met.

those practising Catholics with no siblings have no chance of getting in. It's very frustrating for those genuinely wishing to educate their children in a Catholic setting.

I can't say I have a whole lot of sympathy.

Specific religious education should be done outside of state schooling.

I believe state education should be secular.

hippyhippyshake I suppose part of being catholic is being immersed in it.

So praying at the start & end of day, grace before meals, mass on feast days, these are all part of everyday life. Having them as part of school life is important to a lot of catholics.

You don't go up the admission criteria because of being 'more catholic', it is based on distance in a tie break, just like any school.

You do with some schools.

I think the aim is to stop the children from realising that non Catholics are human beings who are capable of kindness and being good. It's far easier to demonise people you haven't met.

😂 Yep, that's what they teach them in catholic schools. Definitely.

Wow, must be a very oversubscribed school I imagine, SoupDragon. Oratory or similar?

I'll change my statement to 'other than in one or two..'

And yet..... as soon as they leave school, what, do they do it at work? college? uni? I doubt it, that's why it doesn't make sense it should only be important during those few years while they are gaining qualifications.

This one even has a point scoring system to work out how Catholic you are

Oversubscribed, yes - neither admit outside of the top catholic criteria. these are just two local schools off the top of my head.

Just ridiculous - can't see how adding 'how popular you are with the priest' into the mix will help either.

A third one I looked at, which I do not believe to be as popular, also explicitly ranks applicants by "how catholic" they are.

I can not believe these are unusual.

For completeness, the only other local catholic school I can think of also ranks according to commitment to the catholic faith. It has an ofsted of needs improvement as is not, as I understand it, oversubscribed.

I don't know, soup, I'm in East/Central London & all the Catholic schools I've come across just say "practising catholic" - and some of them are incredibly oversubscribed (as all schools in the area are, to be fair). I guess it's regional variations.

But those criteria are clear soup - you can quite easily ascertain which category you fit in. You can make a decision as to whether it's worth putting on the form based on the criteria.

Leaving the priest to decide means no one can objectively know whether they stand a chance, and leaves them wide open to appeals, bribery and bias.

Not that religious adherence should ever come into admissions criteria at all...