this still isnt long enough for them

[AnAngelWithin]

as far as i am concerned

here

No, as a society WE don't deserve anyone having lawless retribution visited on them.

Perhaps I have a picky, twisted notion of civilisation.

I wholeheartedly agree with Pann on this occasion - much as I loathe what these people have done, it's imperative that the basic fabric of civilisation isn't ruptured because of an emotional reaction. I don't want to live in a society which condones - or turns a blind eye to - bullying, torture, vigilantism. That would make us morally indistinguishable from the perpetrators of this horror. That's my main argument against the death penalty - it's not some wishy-washy squeamish pity for the monsters who end up facing it, it's concern for the rest of us and for society at large. State-sponsored/tolerated violence is a renegade step. I don't want my children to grow up in a society which features legalised brutality and murder.

I do feel sick when I think about this little girl's suffering though - I'm not a fan of these threads as a rule, but this one really upset me.

they are just sickos imo

not even worth wasting a thread on

Surely ss should have been very suspicious if the parents were preventing them from seeing the child? There must be procedures in place to deal with parents who try to evade sw visits. And if not, for heaven's sake, why not? Seems ridiculous and an easy get out for truly abusive parents.

Good God, I'd hope a court would hand out a swift order to the parents to produce the child if you have parents who are under reasonable suspicion and prevent access.

not wishing to extend this anymore than it is already, but we aren't wasting a thread "on them"..it's how we react to it that is moote.

'nuff said, for me.

I think it is important to find out what went wrong so that it can be prevented. Having read an article in the Telegraph today it seems that there were significant failings by SS. The judge even condemned their lack of action and yet as usual SS have closed ranks and no explanation is forthcoming. There are comparisons being drawn with the Victoria Climbe case as well.

Personally I am terrified of having dealings with SS. Not because I have anything to hide but because there seems to be rampant inverse snobbery in SS dealings with white, middle class parents. I am not saying that this is the case, just my impression.

I also think that we are all so scared of this sort of thing happening to our own children that threads like this are almost a cathartic experience. It is human nature to talk about our fears.

Cant stop crying every time I think of this little girl.

The "mother" if you can call her that, is now pregnant.

I saw that in today's Observer, WB. It said there was no way she was getting a place in a mother and baby unit and the baby would be 'considered' for adoption or fostering (well, duh, if she's not in an M&B unit it will have to be fostered).