Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
News

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

Women's safety in Europe after Cologne

999 replies

DavidTCDaviesMP · 08/02/2016 09:38

I have been invited onto Mumsnet to discuss the situation for women in Europe following the attacks in Cologne, and the challenge we face in Europe in trying to help millions of mainly young men, who are arriving in Europe from cultures which treat women very differently. I believe this is an issue which needs open discussion by political leaders yet is swept under the carpet. David Davies MP

OP posts:
Thread gallery
5
AnnaForbes · 08/02/2016 13:59

(some countries in the ME actually imprison rape victims) - and in NA countries too, including children who have been raped.

'Ill add mine to the disappointed with MNHQ voices. Just as with the Guardian and Women's Equality Party. None of them are championing the safety of women and girls.

MariscallRoad · 08/02/2016 13:59

Mr. Davies do you get feeling we are regressing? Would perhaps women find better migrating to USA Canada to keep their rights?

HaveIGotAClue · 08/02/2016 13:59

By control, I mean assessment of risk, needs, country of origin, skills base, language needs etc.?

Original poster
DavidTCDaviesMP · 08/02/2016 14:01

it has been a pleasure to do this and to learn that many of us have the same concerns. I am going to leave 3 links:
one is the visit I made to the Jungle camp in Calais - note almost all are young men. One is the speech made in Strasbourg (only 3 minutes) lastly the petition. Thank you very much for giving me a hearing.

petition.parliament.uk/petitions/119385

OP posts:
januarybrown1998 · 08/02/2016 14:01

Thank you. Antwerp has become even worse in parts.

Sofia Peeters was accused of racism and the debate was lost as feminists across Europe insisted it was a socio-economic rather than cultural issue.

Despite the film evidence.

Anyway, thank you so very much and with great sincerity for coming here today and reassuring me, at least, that the emperor is indeed absolutely butt-naked.

BungoWomble · 08/02/2016 14:01

Thank you for giving us a hearing.

Original poster
DavidTCDaviesMP · 08/02/2016 14:01

once again many thanks I have to go back to work now.

OP posts:
MariscallRoad · 08/02/2016 14:02

Mr. Davies your visit is heartening. A big Thank you.

AnnaForbes · 08/02/2016 14:03

Thank you so much for giving your time and thoughts to this issue Flowers. You give me hope.

I shall link this thread in another email to my MP and invite him along we may be waiting a long time.

vladimirsoftless · 08/02/2016 14:04

"How many subjects have had 9 threads - that's >8,000 posts on mumsnet...ever....and still MNHQ are too timid to grab this issue and run with it so we can get some publicity and get it discussed. ."

to be fair, MN is a business not a civil society organisation. They have business interests and would be torn apart by the media if they got entangled in issues about migration, ethnicity. It is pretty darn cool that they let the threads stand and the threads speak volumes. Thank you MN.

Inkanta · 08/02/2016 14:05

Yes I feel better for that. All our concerns have been pretty much validated Thanks

This feels like progress everyone!

unlucky83 · 08/02/2016 14:07

I know I'm too late... but I'd like to say thank you to Mr. Davies for being brave enough to speak out.
I am disappointed in MN.
I completely understand concerns that the issue could be hijacked by the far right - but I can't understand how intelligent liberal thinkers are unable to realise it is the silence that is leaving a void for the far right.
I admitted to being too worried to put my (quite identifiable) name to the petition.
I feel slightly despondent - wondering just what it will take for us to realise what we stand to lose and be brave enough to stand up.
I think this highlights as well that the political system is broken. The majority of us will have no-one to vote for ...no-one that we feel will speak up for women's rights.

januarybrown1998 · 08/02/2016 14:09

Thanks all you fellow concerned MNetters.

I have to get back to work for a few hours but will check in later. Please PM me if there is any immediate action/emails/awareness-raising etc that I can help with.

I have participated this lunchtime sitting with a very reluctant co-worker who has told me that in the past she agreed (with the press) that the issue was racist.

She is going to comb the thread for proof of racist tendencies in the participants.

I wish her luck.Grin

gleam · 08/02/2016 14:09

Have Mumsnet actually said why they won't campaign?

BrittEkland · 08/02/2016 14:10

Cheers for HelpTheAnimalsFirst who put her name to our petition.

JoMackl · 08/02/2016 14:13

I agree that was heartening in a number of ways, and I'm really grateful for his time and support, but our DDD (see what I did there?!) is only one man. (If only we could clone him.) What scares me most is what unlucky says above ^ - there is simply no one to vote for/ appeal to. The parties that used to speak for women's & LGBTQ rights - i.e. defend minorities/ the vulnerable have been hijacked by the multiculti agenda and refuse to accept that there is a massive clash of interests between these groups. The tiny number of people willing to deal with this is our major problem. DD didn't answer my second question (I know I was greedy) about the amount of support he'd received for his speech /number of like-minded MPs/ MEPs he'd found. I would guess the number is vanishingly small.

BungoWomble · 08/02/2016 14:15

No. Like I said I asked - reported one of the early posts on an early thread asking about their potential involvement as the quickest way of getting their attention - and they said they'd look into it and see how mumsnet could support the situation, never heard anything more. Like Vlad I think they do have other priorities and it's not a simple question; and it is a very fine line to walk between the racist callers and the right wing so I didn't push it.

Is there a point to starting a thread in chat similar to the one about Olympics & transgenderism in hope of getting enough people to change their mind? I'm not sure if most posters would be willing to jump one way or the other either.

BungoWomble · 08/02/2016 14:15

That wast to gleam btw.

LumelaMme · 08/02/2016 14:20

Help got banned by MN.

Jan, I think your friend will find very few posts that are actually racist. There are a number which generalise far too widely across a range of cultures, but there are an awful lot which are just worried.

I've seen racism in action and it isn't pretty. But opposing an ideology - or an interpretation of an ideology, if you prefer - which oppresses women, outlaws homosexuality and makes life difficult for members of minority religions is NOT racist.

It's just sane.

I'd be getting just as agitated if we had, say, the Puritans running around again, banning Christmas and telling women to back indoors and have babies.

LumelaMme · 08/02/2016 14:23

But then, anyone trying to ban Christmas would have the whole business lobby screaming that it was the end of the High Street so we wouldn't have to worry...

rumbleinthrjungle · 08/02/2016 14:32

Jan, I think your friend will find very few posts that are actually racist. There are a number which generalise far too widely across a range of cultures, but there are an awful lot which are just worried.

On that note I'll correct myself as I was answering at speed to keep up with the discussion and this was badly phrased:

As many women here have commented in the thousands of posts on this subject, none of them felt they could be educated into accepting misogyny and patriarchy through a short training course, so it is hardly likely that migrants could be educated into liberal beliefs.

That should have been 'migrants could be educated into liberal beliefs that go against their values and culture'. Which in the context of the discussion I would hope was obvious, but I understand it is necessary to discuss this extremely sensitively with all possible riders in order for it to be socially acceptable to discuss at all.

My point was that brief education courses do not immediately outweigh a lifetime of beliefs and internal values for anyone.

seeThereWeAreThen · 08/02/2016 14:33

Why was help banned?

BungoWomble · 08/02/2016 14:35

No, but a course giving information on law coupled with enforcement of that law should be enough in the public space. I think the focus on informing women is a good one.

rumbleinthrjungle · 08/02/2016 14:35

Help was banned over posts she had made on the thread that were perceived as racist.

BungoWomble · 08/02/2016 14:38

That is, of course, for as long as women have some say in the law and more so than rich or vocal men.