Rebecca Minnock - on the run with child after court battle

[BreakingDad77]

Is this one of those cases we wont get to the bottom of as to whether she is someone with MH problems or scheming father driving her to them?

rale,

I would agree with everything you say apart from your statement about people pushing feminist/men's rights issues.

Apart from Spero's comment about MRA's, I fail to see that, on this thread, that this case can be used to push a 'MRA/Fathers rights' issue but only an opportunity to push an awareness of a situation that is commonplace within the family courts and is above all devastating in the long term for the child, regardless of gender.

Its not just mras its feminists as well. I saw a comment on the lines of 'courts are pandering to mra groups like f4j'. I think both groups have a bad habit for blaming all there problems on the opposite gender and courts treatment of gender when in reality its the result of courts trying to judge very complex issues not them hating mums or dads. Its a very annoying simplification that people are using to knock judgments against people in there lives (whether themselves or friends).

Sabrinna,

"The burden of proof in court is high"

That is untrue, in a criminal court the proof must be beyond reasonable doubt, 100%.

In the family court, Fact finding, is based upon a balance of probabilities, which mean by default one must only be 51% guilty with little or no evidence.

Primary carer is pretty much a 'I get the child benefits and tax credits' card, in reality it means fuck all.

Does anybody know why an online petition/Facebook support group for the father is easily found when 'googled' but the one for Rebecca can't be...I know there is one for the mother but no results are found...

I'm very sceptical of the justice in this case...Yes, legally I'm sure the father won the case and is claiming his rights over the child like he can but if allegations were made by the mother, without proper legal support it means nothing. The law is a game which if not played properly by following the rules (buying into the system/employing a lawyer) is risky to say the least. Doing the right thing morally is not enough, in fact very often it means nothing...

Anyway back to my query, where is the link for either the Facebook page/petition for Rebecca?Scarily, I almost signed the fathers4 justice one...

I've no idea why no-one has started an easily discoverable site of the type you seek.

"allegations were made by the mother, without proper legal support"

She has only been without legal support during the period she was in hiding. She has been represented by cousel throughout all the earlier proceedings.

My guess is she never planned to be on the run long-term and it was for dramatic effect to martyr herself.

Shortly before he was found guilty on contempt of court, a family member confirmed in court today that Rebecca's motive for "running away" was to attract media attention for her case. He also confirmed that it was planned the day before had.

She, however, stated in her interview with the DM today that it was a "spur of the moment decision on the morning of the court case".

It appears that the media is still being manipulated by someone.

£20k to fight lies of my ex to win my children back through court.

Probably controversially I disagree that considering the child's best interests is the priority here- the mother must be brought to justice as a priority and I really hope she is prosecuted. If she goes to prison that wouldn't be great for the child but as a result of what she's done, I think she deserves it. She shouldn't get away with this because we're putting the child's best interests first is the point I'm making.

I'm very sceptical of the justice in this case...Yes, legally I'm sure the father won the case and is claiming his rights over the child like he can

Actually, if you read the judgements, you'll see it not quite that simple.

The case brought to court by the father enforcing a former contact order resulted in the court ordering a series of reports by professionals, including Social Services, into the suitability of each parent.
Their report recommended that the court did not continue with the case as applied for by the father, because they deemed that Ethan was at risk of harm from his mother through her behaviour towards and regarding him.
It was only when Rebecca failed to turn up in court, that the court placed Ethan in his fathers care, so allowing the court to take the subsequent action to trace Rebecca and Ethan.

The report written by social services did not compare Ethan's parents against each other. It deemed Rebecca to be a risk to him.

In this case it is the mother that is manipulative, and attempting to manipulate those around her.

CalypsO,

I raise you 80 grand.

Mathmo,

It is a very delicate issue, I firmly believe that the mother in this case should not serve any kind of sentence.

I hope that in this case, mum can be educated and supported to enable her to understand that regardless of having two loving parents with two homes and that the pair of em' can support and encourage their child to be the very best of their own selves in order for their child to thrive in life.

It can happen.

Sonnyson, I completely agree that a child can be brought up by parents living apart. The child can have a wonderful childhood and be fully equipped for life ahead.

However, if the mother has committed a crime punishable by a prison sentence,I think she should serve that prison sentence.

Mathmo,

With respect, in cases such as these, Mum serving a prison sentence would do little to help.

The child in question just needs a mum and dad and I sincerely hope that this will now happen.

the Maypole link, be feckinjeswas, unbelievable bullshit!

Wow what a manipulative piece this woman is! A video interview on the Daily Wail no less. I can see that going down well with the judge! ;)

Poor father and poor child. Hopefully he's young enough to forget his mothers vile behaviour.

I was with a friend the day his ex abducted their daughter and disappeared for 4 years. That man went through hell as did the child. Thankfully she's now with dad.
The mothers hate for the father was horrendous and unremitting. She told terrible lies to anyone who would listen. had online campaigns against dad and judges etc. People threatened the father. judge etc. She ended up in prison.

There are plenty of threads on MN from adult survivors of abuse from controlling narcissistic mothers.
Being a mother doesn't rubber stamp you as a paragon of virtue.

I feel so sorry for the father and child in this. Hopefully they will be swiftly reunited and the courts will call the mothers media attack dogs off.

It's good that we're waking up to find Rebecca has handed herself in.

Rebecca seems to be utterly deluded.

She has said that she hopes the publicity surrounding her now will mean that the case will be reviewed and the decision to put Ethan with his dad be looked at again.

Daft woman. Can she not understand how much worse she has made things? She seems immature in the extreme. I sincerely hope that the court's decision to make his father the resident parent stands.

Rebecca has handed herself in, I don't have any sympathy for her as she deliberately planned this in an effort to gain more attention and publicity. Anybody who makes false allegations about their partner in an effort to obstruct contact deserve whatever punishment the court hands down.

I am glad she has done the right thing.

I remain however perplexed why she or anyone else could possibly think that this will have the effect of making the courts 'look again' at her objections to the father. they will indeed 'look again' but the focus will be exclusively on how this behaviour has increased her level of risk to her son's welfare.

I agree that putting her in prison won't help her child BUT it is also important to send a message that what she did was very wrong.

there seems to be a widespread ignorance of/refusal to accept that the court operates on EVIDENCE. i.e. it doesn't matter how long or loud you shout that its 'not fair/not true' - if you haven't got the evidence, you can't make your case.

I appreciate that lack of evidence doesn't mean you are lying BUT I have asked repeatedly on this thread -what alternative do you offer other than trying a case in a court? Asking 100 representative mumsnetters how they 'feel' about a case? Seeing how many neighbours sign a petition?

Unsurprisingly, no one has given me an alternative to the court system. It's not perfect, far from it - but it's all we have got.

I agree Spero - and I feel very uncomfortable watching the cameras flashing away while she sat cuddling her son.

He has had no say at all in the media circus his Mum has created. I wonder how he'll feel when he's older and looks back on all this.

This is interesting:

"a group of Mr Williams’s neighbours yesterday called for Miss Minnock to be given custody of Ethan. They made a series of allegations against Mr Williams and his conduct during the time he was with her and their split. In an open letter, the seven residents criticised the ‘unfair’ custody battle which left Miss Minnock with no right to see her son and said she ‘has been served an unforgivable injustice’."

I haven't seen any videos but your description makes me very uneasy and reduces further any sympathy I have for her.

Ethan should emphatically NOT be exposed to that. He isn't some pet. He isn't some prop for her media drama.

That empahsises for me how little understanding she has about his needs and does make me snort in derisory way about that Maypole piece on the supremacy of the mother as primary carer. Having a vagina does not automatically endow you with qualities of nurturing and compassion.

The video came out at about 10:30 last night and has been fairly widely broadcast, at least in part.

The Daily Mail seem to have let her dig herself an even bigger hole and jump in it publicly.

The neighbours letter sounds wrong. At no time, before she went into hiding, was she denied contact.

It looks as if the "neighbours" are actually friends of Rebecca Minnock. The fact that they think she was left with no right to see her son demonstrates how very little they know about the case and does rather suggest that they have been incited by her or her family.