I despair at Israel sometimes

[AndHarry]

Well, often really. I have family out there who have a bomb shelter in their house and have had to evacuate for weeks at a time so I have great sympathy for ordinary Israelis trying to go about their lives. What happened to 3 sch

i was thinking this morning (sorry for mad multiple posting) about how the northern ireland conflict would have looked if we'd handled it israeli style.

we'd have hearded all of the catholics (actually the non unionists, many of whom would be about as catholic as i am) into a 25mile strip of land and put a fence around it and not allowed them in or out, had military troops patrolling and killing children for throwing a stone, etc and ocassionally had a few days 'fun' throwing missiles into the prison camp whilst all enjoying live coverage on tv, or better yet getting the deckchairs out for a live fireworks show.

we had nail bombs, people killed, political conferences bombed etc yet never once did we airstrike northern ireland or retaliate in the ways israel calls 'self defense'.

the other thing that i was thinking is that israel has made the error of being so hard and extreme so early that there is nowhere left to go - deterents only work if you have anything left to lose. if you take everything from a people and turn their lives to absolute shit they become the proverbial rat in a corner and everyone knows you don't corner a rat. because israel's treatment of palestinians has been so extreme and brutal there just are no more sanctions or anything that they can effect because they showed their whole hand already and played all their trumps in one go.

so palestinians have nothing to lose and israelis only have continued murder and brutality left to play and presumably palestinians live in hope that as israel shows the world more and more of their brutality the world will have to react. i would say that is probably the likely reason for a group like hamas firing rockets that do no real human damage - to draw the worlds attention. to stop the world going back to sleep whilst their people are trapped in the most dangerous prison block in the world.

a ceasefire as in stop resisting being kept in a lethal prison camp and we'll stop slaughtering you for a while?

would those be the terms?

No, Egypt are trying to broker a peaceful solution and I believe too figureheads from both sides are due to meet to begin talks.

Please don't make things up honey badger.

*top not too

There was no ceasefire. Once again Israel 'offered' palestine the chance to stop resisting and funnily enough it was rejected.

Karen have you seen the photos in the press and all over social media of Israelis on the beach/in coffee shops/ on hilltops cinema style strolling casually to bomb shelters after a siren? And let's face it, with the dome it's unlikely any rockets are going to hit.

Meanwhile in Palestine international volunteers have surrounded al wafaa hospital as a human shield to stop Israel murdering vulnerable citizens. And yet more women children and men are being slaughtered mercilessly.

oh so i've made that up kareninsgirl? so israel are going to stop oppressing them and let them out of the refugee camp then? oh i'm so pleased to hear that

There will be a ceasefire soon. Let's face it, how long can Israel bbomb to death a captive population and it's hospitals, homes, occupants, sanitation and water supplies whilst citing self defence?

The red cross, the UN, Amnesty International, populations across the world are refusing to tolerate Israel's latest ethnic cleansing genocide.

www.israelnationalnews.com/wap/Item.aspx?type=0&item=182927

Also reported on BBC.

It is a ceasefire brokered by Egypt but ignored by Hamas.

I will not get into personal attacks honey badger or use sarcasm to try and be clever. I am looking at facts.

I pray for the end of all bloodshed on both sides. I hope the ceasefire does indeed lead to peace.

Karen - please get your facts correct. Hamas have not ignored the ceasefire. They have rejected it on the basis that Israel agrees to end the siege and open the border crossing.

Israel is done killing for now. Hamas is perfectly within its rights to demand that the ceasefire is conditional.

Perhaps getting round the table and talking might lead to some kind of agreement.

Hamas would agree to stop firing for now and discuss things if they were really interested in peace.

Can you blame them Karen? Israel has committed genocide against the palestinians many times and having satiated it's thirst with enough palestinian blood this week it has decided to cease fire. Forgive Hamas for wanting a little bit more than that and trying to reclaim some basic human rights for palestine.

You are right, Hamas are not interested in peace now. They want a right to return and for Israel to be held accountable for murder. And who can blame them.

Define 'peace'. Does it mean the same as 'oppression' by any chance? Great terms. Carry on suffering in a prison camp with only the occasional murder of a teenage boy shot dead for no reason that the western press roundly ignores.

So they think the way forward is to continue to fire rockets at Israel instead of talking? And you don't blame them?!

Isn't the whole point, as you have been pointing out, that Hamas want to be listened to and a solution to the status quo? Isn't this what Egypt are trying to mediate?

Who has said peace means oppression? What an odd thing to say.

Israel's offer of peace does mean continued occupation and oppression. It refuses to address the root cause which is its continued invasion of palestine and it's genocide of its people.

Do you believe the palestinians should be awarded basic human rights and that Israel must end it's siege and reopen borders?

How do you know this? Are you party to what will happen during peace negotiations?

I believe both sides need to work towards a resolution.

Sweeping generalisations are not helpful.

I know because that is what Israel is agreeing to. Cease fire if Hamas stop firing rockets but no concessions regarding reopening borders and ending the siege.

Karen can I ask you again, do you think Israel should end it's siege in Gaza and reopen the border crossing? Or do you agree that the palestinians should remain caged in?

I think both sides should make concessions. I think the settlements should be dismantled and no further building should take place. I think Hamas should recognise Israel's right to exist and the jew's right to exist. From there, further progress can be made.

I still believe there can be peace one day.

And ceasing fire seems the first step on the road to peace. This will not be resolved overnight and it is naive to think otherwise. But ceasefire is paramount.

Yes a ceasefire has to be the first step. And hopefully the first tiny step on the long road to freedom for the palestinians.

Personally I hope that the anti Israel momentum is not lost (that is criticism of zionism and israels illegal expansion and not Jewish people) and that from here palestinians are given the right to return. When all this is over I know that I will not have been complicit in this holocaust and will not have been an apologiser or bystander.

From the BBC news website:

"There have been no Israeli air strikes into Gaza since the 09:00 ( 06:00 GMT) truce, but Israel says more than 20 rockets have been fired from Gaza into Israel after the deadline."

Why is Gaza allowed to continue?!?

(I mean continue firing rockets)