So it's alleged nigella took drugs with her kids?

[Bradsplit]

In the trial prosecution evidence. Aha.

Sorry, NL, not NS.

Math - very good point. I knew I felt uneasy about this whole thing, but would never have been able to articulate it like you have.

BasilBabyEater - I do understand what you mean

mathanxiety Once again you are trying to define what others should feel like. No-one owns the thoughts of the 'domestically abused woman'. She is not one person who has a single voice or opinion. Because I have moved on from my experiences (I do not hate all men, i do not want to spend my day shouting down CS) that means that my experiences must have not happened at all? Thanks for erasing the most painful years of my life.

Unbelievably you have women arguing about domestically abuse saying "you can't have gone through domestic abuse because you don't say things I think domestic abuse victims should say!?"

Seriously we have other women agreeing with you on this? Please don't ever make your way on to the Relationships board is the politest thing I can say in response to that. Another attempt at personalising and derailing this thread. Just because I disagree with your opinion, please don't make assumptions about me. Ironically you are in a way trying to character assassinate (how on theme) to try and win an internet argument.

Furthermore, I can't see any person here claiming that a woman deserves abuse? Or because she does X that somehow justifies his behaviour? Is no-one able to criticise Nigella because he has allegedly acted inappropriately?

Once again you are attempting to derail this thread into a 'but he did X, what a [insert remark here]'. There are countless other threads for this purpose. She has taken class A drugs and she is a parent. This is the point we are trying to discuss (with varying degrees of success) here.

I think it's very worrying that taking class A drugs has been minimised the way it has been here and in the media.

I think it has been minimised because there are a surprisingly large amount of middle class mumsnetters who admit on mumsnet to taking them too. And dont see much if anything wrong with it.
So presumably it is ok for a daughter or son to see it too, and take them too? I dont know. It is a bit of a question that needs asking.

Mathanxiety thank you for posting that, you've really summarised my own thoughts perfectly.

BasilBabyEater - Top half of comment went away for some reason :(

I agree that in terms of wrongs in life - actions are worse than others. So domestic violence can't equal a driving fine, theft etc.

I think I was looking at it more from the daughters perspective. In this hypothetical situation (as we have no way of knowing for sure what the real facts are on this):

This is working on the presumption that -

• If a child has been brought up in a domestically abusive environment
• If a child has been brought up where either parent is taking Class A drugs
• If a child has been brought up where drugs are available in the house

I can only work off my own experience that being brought up in that environment has made me crave security, chase the wrong men, low self esteem, lack of direction, good crisis management but poor on consistency etc.

In terms of Class A drugs, I don't know enough on how that impacts the human mind, a person's behaviour to say whether that would have a detrimental affect or not. I have been around people who have taken lesser class drugs and there has been a notable difference in behaviour (paranoia, agitation, mood swings) and it affected my relationship with those people. It's a potential catalyst for conflict in any relationship - husband/wife mother/daughter etc.

That said, if you see your parents take one particular action then it might encourage the child to do the same. I don't think it's an accident that my grandmother was in a DV relationship from a young age, as was my mother, myself and also my sister. I don't think it's a coincidence that my sister and I share the same occupation as my father, or that I like or dislike things that my mother and father liked growing up, even as a young adult.

That's why I find it difficult to accept that drugs use is OK. For me it introduces the idea that drugs are an acceptable coping mechanism. Having access to them in the house just makes the temptation for that escapism worse.

I am grateful that my life long crutch has been no more serious than chocolate. i understand that at my lowest points a break away from everything would have been a serious temptation.

What stopped me was

• access, at the time I wasn't emotionally close to anyone who took those kind of drugs
• pressure from school that all drugs are bad
• no one who I actually respected took them.

If my parents had taken drugs that would have changed my attitude towards certain drugs. It could set up bad coping mechanisms that the daughter/etc will have to deal with for life.

Obviously I cannot speak for all people, maybe Nigella's daughter is much smarter than that. The potential short /long term harm is there and I don't think that deserves to be minimised.

Just finding out[if they didnt know before] that your parent has taken cocaine 7 times, and taken the occasional cannibis, may now mean that it increases the likelihood that they might take them too.
And they may also think that "hey, my parents are "successful" people. It didnt do them any harm"

Sorry for what you have been through plinkyplonks.

Agree with you Mathanxiety.

CS has clearly taken the opportunity to bring Nigella down - and it amazingly does look like she's on trial here.

I think he's failed miserably though in his attempt to undermine her integrity and puff up his own. Her sins don't bring her integrity down but his motives bring his integrity down - he looks vindictive and deceptive.

I admire the way she has bravely and honestly articulated her truths - and openly admitted her bad bits.

I believe she will recover and be fine after this - personally and professionally.

Golddigger - Maybe so. I understand that people have difficult, challenging and stressful jobs. My job is mentally hard work, I've had to find positive coping strategies (running, and the not so positive chocolate) to be able to wind down from that. Some people turn to drugs for that purpose or go out for night out with friends.

In the more upmarket parts of town, I was shocked to see people openly snorting coke in full view as if it was the most normal thing in the world.

Having extended exposure to something almost normalises it.

For me, drugs are still shocking. Even if people consider personal drug use a victimless crime, they should consider drug dealers. How many times do we see drug crime being reported - whether it being robberies to get drugs or money for drugs, drug related deaths, contaminated drugs, rival drug gangs fighting, dealers / clients owing money getting shot/stabbed/killed, never mind what this money is funding.

I think the she is and will be far from fine.

There is no evidence that NS took cocaine in front of her children and she hasn't claimed that it was justified, legal or good parenting. She has put it in the context of something she did during the process of her husband dying of cancer and her marriage to CS because she has been asked specific questions about the nature of her drug use which the defence think is relevant to their case.

I also think it's highly likely that Nigella's children will be delighted how their mum has stood up for herself in court - and stood up to him! It will be good for their own development - helps them to learn how important it is to speak plainly and to assert yourself in life - and have courage.

Golddigger - why won't she be fine?

Golddigger - Thanks - for me growing up that was 'normal.' My life experience now tells me otherwise!

Animation - It's unfortunately a consequence of them both being 'famous' and their emotional divorce is still in full swing.

Emotionally she was and is and will continue to suffer.
Professionally, who knows exactly? And that will bring her further uncertainty.

Also, her children now know for sure, and may not have known before, about her drug use. And her children's friends know too.
But it seems it is almost normal in some sections of higher society so that may not be so big an issue as it might be elsewhere.

Actually, it is quite possible for famous people to divorce without there being a huge court case. In fact CS and NL are already divorced and there is no need for them to have any thing more to do with each other, except for this bizarre case whose only purpose is to parade the dirty laundry of a dysfunctional household in public.

Since NL has made no claim for any monies, there is absolutely no reason for the details of their marriage and divorce to become public.

This has happened because the Grillos were charged with stealing from them and then (very late in the day) decided to add allegations of drug taking to their defence.

It's worth noting that the Grillos did not mention NL's drug taking in their defence until NL left CS.

I would also guess that their father's slow death from cancer had already put a bit of a downer on that part of the Diamond children's childhood, and learning the way their parents dealt with it is probably low down the list of difficult things they have experienced, particularly in comparison to the fall out from her second marriage.

Golddigger - Why will she suffer?

Why won't she recover?

And why won't she get a great new cooking series? Perhaps not as the domestic goddess anymore - she'll move on .. and reinvent herself. Why not?

merrymouse - Agreed there are lots of people who have quick, clean and quiet divorces. CS obviously feels wronged by NL. Them both being famous, having brands and images to maintain and manage, the financial implications etc - it brings a whole platform of ways to inflict damage or carry on hurting each other. As I said in response to Mathanxiety, there's plenty of threads to discuss this point. I understand the point that people feel she is on trial and the other points about their relationship, but we are trying if we can to use this one to discuss drug usage.

Well NL herself has admitted taking drugs, that it's not a good idea and not something she's proud of.

She also states she's not takling them now.

What more is there to say?

Haven't we all made mistakes, done things we wish we hadn't? We have to just move on.

How old are her children now? Aren't they at uni? I don't think it will have much of an effect on them. They move in different circles to most of us. Some things are acceptable. I imagine they've always known.

merrymouse - maybe so, I think for me it still reinforces drugs as an acceptable coping strategy. Also the idea that you can be a habitual user of Class A drugs doesn't sit well with me.

Animation. She doesnt seem to have recovered form the other things in her life. I dont think anybody could, could they?
Now with all this lot on top, cs, and public admittance of private matters, how can anyone "recover".
Unless your definition of recover is wildly different from mine.