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George Osborne Gets Booed Handing Medals at the Paralympic Athletics Medal Ceremony

579 replies

ttosca · 03/09/2012 21:28

The nation boos at the Tory scum:

OP posts:
sammypaws · 06/09/2012 10:57

I do not have a problem with the genuinely disabled getting the support that they are entitled to - what language do I need to write this in to get you to understand.

LurkingAndLearningLovesCats · 06/09/2012 10:58

Perhaps if you didn't use the term 'genuinely disabled?' Hmm

FoodUnit · 06/09/2012 10:58

"Now - would you like to point out where my 'head start' was?"

Here:

"both my parents were keen on was education and they made sure that I stayed in university until I achieved my masters degree which enabled me to get my six-figure salaried job."

sammypaws · 06/09/2012 11:01

Well, foodunit I would say that there is a fair proportion claiming benefits saying they are incapable of anything when they are probably capable of something with support - or are you telling me that the population has become substantially sicker since the introduction of these benefits?

sammypaws · 06/09/2012 11:02

So foodunit because my parents cared about me, that was my 'head start'? If you truly feel that then I am really sorry because you must have had a very miserable start.

LurkingAndLearningLovesCats · 06/09/2012 11:03

So parents who can't afford a certain type of education or are forced to send their child to a crap school don't 'care' about their children?

Wow.

sammypaws · 06/09/2012 11:04

lovescats - what term should I use to differentiate those obtaining disability benefits who are not entitled to them to those who are?

OwlLady · 06/09/2012 11:05

If you are going to support carers with respite so they can work, surely it is going to cost more money? which is the point most of us are making Confused Under the 1984 carers act, social services are supposed to support carers to continue with work buy providing suitable care for their loved ones, but I know of maybe one or two people who have ever managed to get that support

FoodUnit · 06/09/2012 11:06

"I would say that there is a fair proportion claiming benefits saying they are incapable of anything when they are probably capable of something with support"

So where do you get this judgement that its a 'fair proportion from? How much will this 'support' cost and what form will it take?

sammypaws · 06/09/2012 11:08

Who said my parents paid for my education - state school and then a scholarship for me.

FoodUnit · 06/09/2012 11:13

"So foodunit because my parents cared about me, that was my 'head start'? If you truly feel that then I am really sorry because you must have had a very miserable start."

You had a stable home (no dead/divorced/life-threatening violence) with parents both able to work together to effectively support and care for you. This is not the case for everyone. Count those blessings.

sammypaws · 06/09/2012 11:20

Did you miss the part where my parents separated (which was in fact due to domestic violence). The fact that they patently didn't care for each other did not prevent them from caring for me - although my mother spent a significant amount of time in court arguing about/ chasing for maintenance .

FoodUnit · 06/09/2012 11:21

sammypaws also if you dig a bit deeper into the stories of these 'scroungers' you hate so much you'll find chaos, trauma, misfortune and a genuine pattern of disadvantage - not people with a lucky start like you deciding to put the brakes on and think "f*ck it - I can't be bothered to make anything of my life"

FoodUnit · 06/09/2012 11:24

The fact that they patently didn't care for each other did not prevent them from caring for me

How did they support you to university then? There must have been cooperation there.

LurkingAndLearningLovesCats · 06/09/2012 11:28

I'd like to point out people from healthy backgrounds rarely say 'fuck it, I'm giving up' unless there is something wrong. Perhaps that should be addressed?

sammypaws · 06/09/2012 11:35

Of the ten people that I know/ knew that claimed these benefits I would say five actually needed help (cerebral palsy, schizophrenia, diabetes and blindness, spinal problem, severe learning difficulties) - some of the rest might have needed a little support but not to the level they were receiving, and I am sorry, but something really grates with me about the state giving alcoholics more alcohol.

There were definitely a few that were not entitled and were only getting help because they knew someone who knew what to write on the application forms and had a complicit GP.

I am sure that this is not an isolated or unique occurrence.

sammypaws · 06/09/2012 11:36

I had part-time jobs from I was 16, and all through university. By the time I was studying for my masters I was also working 20 hours a week doing shift work for BT on 192.

sammypaws · 06/09/2012 11:40

I never said that I hated anyone. I also have never referred to anyone as a scrounger - a particularly ugly word to use.

sammypaws · 06/09/2012 11:41

Perhaps foodunit you should get that chip on your shoulder seen to.

Xenia · 06/09/2012 11:45

Even if there were money to burn and tax payers even on £25k a year were falling all over each other to pay 60% tax and 12% NI, we still do not want those who are not really disabled making claims as there is less money for those who are genuinely disabled as it is not fair on hard workers.

The biggest increase is in "stress" and things that are dead easy to fake and hard to disprove.

Now it may be diet too - as people eat a much worse diet than in WW2 with lots of sugar depression levels increase. Perhaps we should be banning unhealthy foods and then depression and fitness levels might increase.

Looking at this below for DLA it looks really easy to fake.

"Introduction to Disability Living Allowance:

You don't have to be 'disabled' to claim disability living allowance, as Steve Donnison and Holiday Whitehead explain.

Disability living allowance (Disability Living Allowance) can make a big difference to people's lives. Awards range from £15.15 to £97.15 a week. Receiving DLA can lead to additional payments of benefits such as income support housing benefit, council tax benefit and tax credits.

If someone provides care for you, your award of DLA may also entitle them to claim carer's allowance. In addition, Disability Living Allowance is tax free and you can spend it on anything you want. Yet the government have estimated that fewer than half of all those who are eligible actually claim. Why should that be?

One problem is the name. Many people with MS, for example, don't consider themselves to be 'disabled' and so never consider claiming the Living Allowance. In fact, you don't need to be disabled. Thousands of people with long-term health conditions get DLA simply because peeling vegetables is often difficult or painful for them.

Other common misconceptions are that you can't get DLA if you work, claim other benefits, have savings or haven't paid national insurance contributions. In reality, none of these things matter.

So, if you're under 65 and your living with MS and it affects your day-to-day life, it's worth looking into whether you could make a claim. (People of 65 or over can claim a similar benefit called attendance allowance).

Could you be eligible?
To get an idea of whether you might be eligible, try this test. As a result of your MS, or the medication you take, do you have difficulties with one or more of these everyday activities:

walking outdoors

walking outdoors alone in unfamiliar places

preparing a cooked main meal for yourself

moving about indoors

taking medication

eating and drinking

staying safe if you're alone

communicating with other people

getting in and out of bed

sleeping

using the toilet

washing, having a bath or shower and looking after your appearance

getting dressed and undressed

social and leisure activities.

Difficulties with living can include: fatigue; stiffness; spasms; pain; severe discomfort; having to take things very slowly or needing someone to keep an eye on you to make sure you're safe. If you need reminding or encouraging to do things, perhaps because of poor concentration, depression or anxiety, this also counts.

If the answer is yes, you do have difficulties with one or more of these activities, then you may be eligible for DLA. Whether you actually receive an award will depend on which activities you 'reasonably require' help with (regardless of whether you get it or not), how often and how long for each time. The detailed rules about who is entitled are complex and the law changes frequently.

If you think you might be eligible, you can get a claim pack by calling the Benefits Enquiry line on 0800 882 200.

Help with your claim
The claim pack is a dispiriting 37 pages long. But, if you have access to the internet, you can download and print off a very detailed guide to filling it in from www.benefitsandwork.co.uk . The guide also tells you more about how the qualifying conditions work.

In addition, there are more than two thousand advice agencies around the UK who may be able to help with form filling. These include:

Citizens Advice Bureau. To find out your nearest CAB, check your local phone book under 'C' or visit www.nacab.org.uk

Disability Information Advice Lines (DIAL's), staffed by disabled people. Call 01302 310 123 or visit www.dialuk.org.uk to find out if there's a DIAL near you.

· Independent Advice Centres. You can get information about local centres from UK Advice on 0207 489 1800.

There may be someone at your local MS Society branch who can help with form filling and, in addition, share their experiences of claiming DLA with you. If you need branch details, telephone the MS National Centre on 020 8438 0700. A local branch might also help with the emotional side as the whole process of claiming DLA can be lengthy and depressing, with no guarantee of success at the end of it.

MS Helpline. The Disability Rights Officer may also be able to help.

Making your case
The DLA claim pack has a page devoted to each of the activities listed above. When you're filling it in, try to give as much detail as possible. Don't just say 'I get very tired.' Instead, explain what the fatigue feels like, how long it lasts and how long you need to rest in order to recover.

Try to give examples of when you've had problems, e.g. when you overdid something and your health suffered as a result. Also try to suggest a way in which someone could help: 'If someone was with me they could help me wash my back / pull on my underwear, socks and trousers / help me up out of chairs.'

If you can get a letter of support from a health professional such as your GP, neurologist or MS nurse, this can make a big difference. It's important to keep your GP and / or MS nurse up to date with your condition. Letters about the difficulties you face written by your partner, friends, relatives, neighbours or work colleagues can also help.

It may take several months before you get a decision on your claim. If you're not happy with the result you can appeal against it. But do bear in mind that your award can be reduced or taken away altogether at an appeal, so get advice. Your chances of success, however, are good: more than 50 per cent of all oral hearings end up with the claimant winning a higher award of DLA.

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 06/09/2012 11:57

And what, precisely, is your problem with any of that? And what do you think the best interests of the disabled are, and how do you see the political right as having those interests at heart?

OwlLady · 06/09/2012 11:57

The fraud rate for falsely claiming DLA is less than 0.5%. that is a fact

The document you have to fill in to claim it is about 50 pages long and you have to have endorsement off a medical specialist and they follow it up with school/work etc and you have to, in most cases, include medical examination reports, school reports, assessments, social service assessments, therapy reports, specialist dr reports. It's really not an easy benefit to get and it's not a tick box exercise

FoodUnit · 06/09/2012 12:11

In reality, tories believe that the state should be small, that charities, religious groups and workhouses/prisons should replace welfare, and that in the main, genuine need is actually a bit of a phantom that will disappear if you say it doesn't exist.

All this 'genuine v scroungers' ideology is just propaganda prepping people to have welfare and the NHS (and all other aspects of the state) dismantled in front of their eyes, in order reduce the reach of the elected government (therefore people power) to control the actions of the privileged and wealthy. Its tories doing what tories do. Heartless, smug self-interest and disdain for the disadvantaged.

sammypaws · 06/09/2012 12:17

oh dear, oh dear, you really do have it bad

LurkingAndLearningLovesOrange · 06/09/2012 12:18

Have what bad?