Longer school day and shorter holidays, proposes Gove

[Morebiscuitsplease]

I cannot understand this man. Children need time out, teachers also need time to prepare and mark work, when do either get this with such proposals? We complain our children are obese yet suggest more time in school. I do not want any child of mine going to school for 7.30 and finishing at 5. They need time to play, pursue other activities and do homework. Your thoughts please!

*Where has any teacher said that they are the only ones who work long hours?

I am still working now and will be for about another two hours. I am sure there are other parents still working now. Me saying that I work hard does not mean that others are not working hard.*

Absolutely. The only reason that teachers mention these things is because we are constantly being attacked for being lazy! Do other jobs get this to anywhere near the same extent!? Lazy workshy accountants, anyone? tardy vets? time-wasting dental nurses?

I think it would do more good for those children who need the extra input be it educational or social, than it would do harm to a) the teachers and b) those who think their children need chill out time. That's all.

Where has any teacher said that they are the only ones who work long hours? I am still working now and will be for about another two hours. I am sure there are other parents still working now. Me saying that I work hard does not mean that others are not working hard

Absolutely. The only reason that teachers mention these things is because we are constantly being attacked for being lazy! Do other jobs get this to anywhere near the same extent!? Lazy workshy accountants, anyone? tardy vets? time-wasting dental nurses?

on another note, that Michael Gove couldn't be anything but a tory could he, smug, patronising face he has

christ i sound like yoda there, but one look at his face you'd know i was right

the trouble with most peoples perceptions of teachers is that they work 9-3,30 and have all school hols off

the reality that the day is spent finishing off marking/planning at home and during the holidays isnt usually thought of

My daughter runs before school every day unless she has to do her paper round, and does activities after it most days too. A longer school day would be fucking ruinous.
This has nothing to do with what is best for children and everything to do with Gove hating teachers and trying to pander to those who think their job is too easy.
What a cunt.

I am lucky that I live very close to my school,I almost walk out of the school gates and into my own house. Other teachers work my hours and then have a commute ahead of them.

My children do their 'extra input' on my own terms and their own, whether that is watching Tracy beaker, doing ballet, or twilight courses. Gove does not care abiut that input, he just wants to punish teachers.

The problem is that a lot of parents, including MoreBeta on this thread, genuinely think teachers just swan into the classroom, pull out their pre-prepared plan, rattle it off, then head to the staffroom for a cuppa and a jolly laugh about how easy life is as a teacher. When they were at school themselves all they saw was a teacher, ready to go, deliver pre-prepared materials and then disappear off. They never thought about where those materials came from, or when all those marks and comments that appeared in their books were actually put in there. They never saw the meetings and preparation that went into guiding their education, and so now they seem to think that the teachers who teach their children just turn up in the classroom, ready prepared as if by magic, they way their own teachers did.

There seems to be a very odd lack of understanding about what teaching entails among the general public. Very few people would query the idea that nurses work very hard and have a tonne of paperwork, and very few people would say "Well all nurses do is sit and watch patients sleeping all day, why don't we get them to run the canteens too, save some money and make them earn their wages!" Yet there seems to be a strong underlying feeling that teachers are slackers - why??

It always tickles me when posters complain about looking after three children on their own, at home, yet they can't believe that teachers find not only looking after but teaching 30 children tiring and difficult. I just cannot understand where people get the idea that teaching is a cakewalk when so many of the same people would be the first to admit that looking after their own children is bloody difficult.

Yes Elaine but this isn't about the likes of your children as somebody else said earlier on you cannot point the finger at children and say we've been tracking you since birth and we know the outcomes for you are frankly prison/army/dead so we are keeping you behind at 3.30 to do your homework.
My eldest has just pointed out her state school library is open until 5.30pm anyway and teaching staff from some departments are on hand to help out.

Not sure what your point is though? The library is open so there might as well be lessons in it?

Heswall you don't seem to be listening to any of the very valid arguments I and other posters are putting forward. The fact of the matter is, teachers just don't have time to carry on teaching until 5pm. If the proposals were brought in schools would have to employ extra staff to cover the extra time and there just isn't the money for it. You mention that your daughter's library is open with "teaching staff from some departments" on hand to help- this will be done on a rota basis so that, more than likely, each teacher has to do one evening a week. Being on hand one evening a week is very very different from having to teach for an extra hour and a half five days a week. You can see that, can't you?

heswall I often work with students until 5pm, however there is a difference between me running a club, supervising homework or running a revision session and having to plan, teach and then assess a lesson. I also have the flexibility to cut back on my after school commitments when other demands or high or I am just too knackered.

I can see that and don't see the problem with extra staff being brought in, I'd have thought the existing staff would be delighted at the prospect. Goodness knows there are enough unemployed NQT's around right now certainly in the North. The money will be found if they want to implement it.
I know many see this as teacher bashing but it could be that somebody in the government is actually trying to close the gap between kids from well off caring homes and the ones where they pick up a bag of chips on the way home before vegging in front of the TV. Is that really beyond belief ?

In answer to the op, I think it a ridiculous idea. I actually like my children (most of the time) and look forward to the holidays when we can do what we want.

Heswall in the school I was in they could not afford to pay the caretaker to come in for one hour extra a day so that teachers could work at school. Teachers used to be allowed to stay until 6:30 to work but due to budget cuts that had be cut back to 5:30. If the school could not afford to pay a caretaker for 5 hours of extra work a week, how on earth would they pay 8 teachers for (collectively) 60 extra hours of teaching a week? And in a recession how could every school in the country afford to do this? Where do you think all that money would come from?

I have no real issue with extra staff being shipped in, I expect the LEA will have an issue with paying for it. I left a school because it could not afford to pay for the staff it had. There were staff not taking full pay so we could afford to give the kids the level of support they needed, part time staff coming on their day off, staff running breakfast clubs paid for themselves and doing the same at the end of the day , again unpaid and often out of their own pocket. This was a school that very much would have benefited from an extended schools system. From my experience the schools that would need this the most would have the least money to pay for it. It costs more to educate children growing up in deprivation, Gove wants to give them more ( which is admirable) but has no intention of providing the funds to pay for it.

This is a shit idea even if they did hire all the extra teachers required to do it properly (which they won't).

The cavalier attitude to the harm this would do to millions of children and their families is sickening.

Anyone who thinks extra hours in the classroom (particularly forced hours, but even optional ones) = more better education is a philistine

You can't measure education like that.

Millions of children are failing in education right now so which group will it do less harm to, that's the question, the answer is glaringly obvious.

"the answer is glaringly obvious"

No it isn't. Just as it isn't obvious it will do any good to the ones who are failing now. If it's failing students now, how will more of the same improve things for them? and on top of that some of the students it's working for will possibly be harmed? So the system failing even more children?

Heswall-how exactly do you see these changes being implemented? Who do you think they would benefit?