Tottenham rioting

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has anyone heard? seems to be all over Twitter but not on other media
apparently police cars burning

teej that was me

I've had the chance to see some of the Afghan counterinsurgency work up close and you would not believe the amount of time and money spent on intel, network analysis, anthropological studies, you name it. It's not applied in an effective way, which is why Helmand has not been going well, but the effort to understand what's going on is considerable.

A lot of these tools are also being applied in American cities and have done a lot to reduce crime. The biggest impact they have is in allowing the police to separate out criminal elements from the surrounding population and track their activities. They also allow the police to rank criminals more effectively and go after the big shots.

I don't know how much the London Met is using any of these techniques for regular policing (as opposed to counterterrorism and such).

And that is why I still say that ultimately the solution comes from the people, not the cash.

Her name escapes me, but that lovely lady who turned her estate around comes to mind. She had a programme on BBC1 where she went to Bristol and tried to help estate residents there as well. If there were more like her, estates wouldn't be like they are, if people had some pride in themselves and their environment.

sing yes, my friend knows who has run late from work - and which non-working parents just cannot be arsed. she also knows the working and non-working parents who turn up on time and do obviously care for their children, thanks.

which, incidentally, is yet another reflection that people can live in the same area in broadly the same circs and yet behave v differently.

oh dreaming that is fascinating and so typical of our government, of whatever tribe - they can spend a fortune on asking the right questions and then still do nothing constructive with the answers!
there was a pastor on the radio who had worked for 2 years with brian paddick to come up with alternative proposals for stop and search and at the end of those 2 years, when consensus had been achieved, they just binned the recommendations. such a waste of time, effort and opportunity for change.

paddock

I feel desperately sorry for the poor souls who have had their businesses/homes destroyed by this.
I doubt the bastards sitting in front of their new looted plasma screens tonight will give them a thought.

Just heard on Twitter that riots have started in Enfield?

the good schools in Muswell Hill have people in them that don't live in overcrowded conditions and parents earn £60 an hour, not £6 an hour

Exactly. So it's pretty pointless blaming the schools, then, isn't it?

"Just heard on Twitter that riots have started in Enfield?"

Riot police have evacuated Enfield Town, not sure if there is actually a riot there though.

The schools in Muswell Hill will have students and parents who value education, who believe in self reliance and have aspirations.
All of which cost nothing.

The buck is being passed around like a hot potato. Schools, teachers, government, bankers .

Let's be really Old fashioned about this and start making people take responsibility for their own actions? Novel or what!

Don't be silly AlouiseG.

The chattering classes won't have anyone to patronise ad beat their be Bodened chests over their lattes if we expect people to take responsibility for their own lives.

The chattering classes won't have anyone to patronise ad beat their be Bodened chests over their lattes if we expect people to take responsibility for their own lives.

100% agree.

Imagine what that would do the unemployment figures?!

There's going to be a lot of handwringing about Tottenham: relations with police, life opportunities, aspirations, community issues, and that's a disucssion that's well worth having

but

This was a riot. If you're an angry young man living in Tottenham, then last night might well have been one of the most exciting nights of your life. SOMETHING ACTUALLY HAPPENED. The news! The noise! The action! The loot! It's not difficult to imagine how it kicked off from a position of genuine community frustration, but the snowballing has a lot less to do with Tottenham specifically. It's less about the area, and more about crowd psychology.

bulletwithaname, the government/council/housing associations still need to be involved by evicting families of troublemakers, insisting that tenants pay their rent and look after their homes. There are people who indulge themselves because they know that no action will be taken against them. Some people have a tendency to sh*t on everything because they don't have to pay for anything, something that is free has no value. It shouldn't be up to one woman to turn an estate around.

The police in London know where all the gangs are, but I don't know how they go about policing them. A few years ago when knife crime first came to the attention of the general public, the Evening Standard printed a map with the names and locations of the street gangs in London. I think they said that there were 150+ gangs in the city.

AlOuiseG when i mentioned bankers that was my point! Taking responsibility for your actions - many of the people who have been made redundant from the banks are not those who were trading ever more complex instruments that bear no relation to reality!

do to I really must take responsibility for my own proof reading.

creighton - did you read my post properly?

'If there were more like her, estates wouldn't be like they are, if people had some pride in themselves and their environment.'

^what lemon said^
really hope tonight is quiet - keep safe everyone who lives around there.

Grrr fucked the bolding up royally. What I mean to say, that if there were more like her, we wouldn't have these problems. And yes, I wholeheartedly agree with the points you made, creighton.

Teej I'm married to someone who trades very, complex financial products in all asset classes over all time frames. Difference is he's traded for himself for the last 23 years. He's not impressed by some bankers. Let's not blame them all for a wannabe "elder gangster" carrying a gun and allegedly using it.

Has this been posted yet?

Apparently this is a video of the 16 year old girl who was at the peaceful protest being grabbed (the video isn't entirely clear) by the riot police. This is BEFORE the riot and apparently what caused it to escalate into violence. I've read that she was beaten by batons or pummeled by shields, but you can see for certain plenty of officers surrounding her and hear the upset response.

Some have said she threw a rock at the police line, others a bit of paper, some say she was just trying to talk to them and engage them in a dialogue.

Rural poverty is much harder than urban poverty.However with the Countyside Alliance protest 400,000 angry people travelled miles and marched through London. They didn't even leave any litter let alone turn into a riot.
( No they weren't all upper class twits and that doesn't follow anyway from Gilmores' actions in the student protest). So it's a mindset. Of mindless ignorant thugs.

To clarify- it's not certain that this was the trigger, just that some are claiming that this is what made it kick off.