Explosion in Oslo

[OhYouBadBadKitten]

No threads here yet?
It looks like a very big explosion, one fatality reported so far. May be terrorism but bbc saying that is speculation.

Under the system we currently have, with the media and court treatment of these men, these crimes will repeat and repeat and repeat themselves until finally women say ENOUGH.

'Good god,

Are people here serious when they say that punishing a man adequately for an evil crime is the SAME THING as a man just deciding to kill nearly 100 teenagers, for kicks.'

Can you quote which posts have made you think that this is what people are saying please.

So do you think the death penalty is an adequate response to these sort of cases? Would that prevent recurrence?

First of all, I'D disagree with you GOblinchild.

Women don't hate men for existing, the way misogynists do. Women hate the crimes that men commit.

There is a multi-billion dollar porn industry whose existend depends on men's hatred of women.

There is currently a commercial out in the U.S exhorting men not to buy children for sex. The caption is "Real men don'T buy girls"

Can you imagine? Men have to be persuaded and cajoled not to buy children to rape!

DOn't even try to tell me women would organize a global sex trade of children for their orgasmic pleasure, if they had the power to make decisions, because I wouldn't believe you.

sakura, my ffs after your first post was because you made it sound like this could have been avoided if the tv, games etc weren't allowed to show violence.

Goblinchild's post puts it very well, this sort of hatred has been around for centuries. Apparently the killer is a follower of the medieval knight templars.

This needs a different thread if you are going to get sidetracked by the porn industry, rather than the horrific events in Norway created by one extremist who wanted to force everyone to take note of his opinions and force change through mass murder.

Oh the thread has moved on a bit, I meant Goblinchild's post of 07.19

"So do you think the death penalty is an adequate response to these sort of cases? Would that prevent recurrence?"

First of all, people need to get their heads out of the sand when it comes to the cultural influences that encourage men to violence.

One of such influences is the media. THis man is going to get a platform to air his views, he will reach notoriety.

FUck that. Take him to the city square, strip him naked, laugh at his genitals, throw rotten fruit at him....Humiliate him for being such a coward .
The next man will think twice.

I agree, although as a historian I disagree that it's getting worse.

Sounds like the answer to my question about the death penalty is yes then, provided humiliation comes first.

" I'm sure that would make the NEXT man planning devious little schemes in his bedroom would THINK TWICE."

The evidence does not support your certainty. If what we have in this case is a psychopathic killer, fired up by some combination of religious passion, hatred of a particular political party and self-importance.... then do you seriously think that he has sat down and thought about any consequences?

"this annihilation isn't a one off though is it..."

What is 'one-off' about it at the moment is that the killer has allowed himself to be taken alive. In most other cases of mass shooting they are effectively dramatic suicides. Person decides to kill themselves in as theatrical a way as possible, often involving special costumes, videos, facebook manifestos... there's a fairly standard format and taking out innocent bystanders is part of the production. This latest atrocity seems more deliberate but I don't think it can be argued that it is part of an increasing trend.

No matter what the punishment, he is still going to be a hero in the eyes of like minded people.

According to the bbc website he is going to explain himself in court on Monday

"FUck that. Take him to the city square, strip him naked, laugh at his genitals, throw rotten fruit at him....Humiliate him for being such a coward .
The next man will think twice."

Sakura, you know nothing apart from your intense dislike of men in general.

People who carry out these acts don't do a cost/benefit ananlysis, weigh up pros and cons. Once 'terrorists' start playing around with explosives they are already in a death syndrome - proportionality went out the window a very long time ago for these people. And that goes for female suicide bombers as well.

Lenin - I am sure Sakura can speak for herself if she wishes to. I read too much of her nonsense to not identify her theme. But I guess she can write what she likes.

I am finding this hijacking of the thread by ideological rantings extremely distasteful to the people who have died. Sakura- you clearly have a perspective all your own on this: I invite you to start your own thread. This is not the time or the place.

yes, I'm sorry for contributing to the prolonging of it. Shall desist.

How did this thread derail onto man-hating and porn? I really can't make a cohesive connection from that to the terrible events in Norway.
Sadly, this sick individual, whatever his motivation and however he has twisted the beliefs and thoughts of other religions/organisations/politics to fit his own skewed agenda, is ultimately seeking notoriety.
The fact he didn't turn the gun on himself, and has sought to court the media with his 1,500 page diatribe, which will no doubt prove irresistible to serialise, analyse and obsess over, speaks volumes.
And in my opinion we are all guilty of subscribing to this when we watch the endless news coverage and discuss it. We all want to make sense of the senseless and find a scapegoat for the act of one individual. No wonder the media jump all over it - it sells papers, makes money.
Our intrinsic facination with the horror of it all is ultimately our own downfall and the only antidote would be blanket boycotting of media saturation. And not just necessarily news coverage. What about the masses of film and tv shows dedicated to the investigation of murder etc? We are entertained by it.

And I'm talking about myself just as much, too.

I wish that we could allow ourselves to defy this horrrendous behaviour by affording it the minimal attention it deserves and focussing on the victims not the perpetrators, but we are all sucked in to the 'rubber-necking' that is all too available.
I remember the dignified and courageous acts of the Madrilenos who calmly and silently filled the city streets of Spain's capital after the terrorist attack by Al-Quaeda on their train system. I'm not using this example to compare the events in Olso with the acts of Al-Quaeda, instead just wishing the majority of the world would follow this act of dignified defiance, showing the world that they are bruised yet not broken and bringing the attention of the world to the people that deserve our compassion, whilst denying the attention that the terrorists wanted. There was no impassioned hatred that day, just a solidarity and intent to support each other in the face of an act designed to disrupt and destroy trust and security.
Until we stop focussing on the shock and horror and frankly glorifying these monsters we will never defeat them. But it is too 'attractive', too intriguing and the folks that 'sell' it to us know this all too well.
What a shame

"First of all, people need to get their heads out of the sand when it comes to the cultural influences that encourage men to violence.

One of such influences is the media. THis man is going to get a platform to air his views, he will reach notoriety."

I have never felt that I had to lash out in a violent manner as a result of anything I have see either on the television, the internet, or printed media. Alright, so the ten seconds of Jeremy Kyle I saw by accident once did almost make me want to kick the screen in but I restrained myself. I see acts of violence every day, yet the last time I was violent myself was when I was attacked during an attempted robbery on myself by two women. The police then told me to drop the charges as the two women claimed it was I who had attacked them.
Sweeping generalisations are rarely, if ever, accurate. You let your hatred get the better of you, the vast majority of us aren't bastards, just as most women aren't misandrist.

I decided early in the thread not to watch the rolling news coverage, after ShowOfHands linked to that Charlie Brooker item, and I am certainly not going to engage with any ghoulish post-mortem ideological dissection of the killer's imagined motivation. I think that focussing on expressing sympathy for the victims is all that is appropriate at this point.