Is home-edding for us??

[noodle6]

I have been considering home-ed for the past 2 or 3 years now, but I think I just don't have the confidence to do it.

At first I thought it would be good to make a decision based on what my daughter's feelings were towards school, but I've found that asking a 7 year old about school and getting answers out of them is hard. For instance, some days she'd tell me she hated school because none of her "friends" wanted to play with her and she got picked on and she didn't like the subject her teacher was doing (she likes writing, but she didn't like the topic her teacher wanted her to write about, which was about "polar regions", and unfortunately for the entire term their class was just focusing on "polar regions" so she didn't have much of a choice). Other days she tells me she loves school - seemed like it was because everything went well for her, she had nice playtimes and friends that day, and the teachers taught something she found interesting. Whenever I ask her would you miss school if I took you out of school and decided to educate you at home, she'd say "no" every single time. At her age I don't think her friendships in school are stable. From what she says, her friends come and go like the weather, and during school holidays if I ask her "do you miss school?" or "do you miss your friends" she'd always say no.

Saying that, she is a skinny, pale, bespectacled, shy, quiet child whose favourite pursuits are clearly writing, drawing and art. Without encouragement from anyone, she would happily get out her paper and pencils/crayons/pens and sit at the table after coming home from school or during holidays, and write and draw furtively for hours on end all by herself at the table. She is 7 but she has the reading level of a 10 or 11 year old and frequently uses the local library for books to borrow home. She loves the library. In short I'd say she would probably fit the stereotypical "nerd" or "weird arty type"... well, she does often complain to me that she gets teased by these 2 same boys in her class every other day or so. They also like to chase after her at PE and break times just so they can hit her on the head (and whoever happens to be her "friend" that day). Teasing her is routine. Basically it ranges from saying "her eyes are full of shit and that's why she wears spectacles", to saying "she farts and poos all day" to bordering on the racist "hahaha your mum isn't white.." type of "jokes", which my daughter finds quite annoying sometimes, but luckily she does have a sense of humour about the situation and laughs along with them most times.

She doesn't hate everything about school though. She seems to like the teachers but she doesn't think of her friends in school as people she couldn't live with.

My DH isn't very supportive of home-edding. Basically he's saying that he doesn't think my personality is suitable for it. I don't have a very calm, cool personality. I do get very passionate about things, especially in subjects that are important to me. He thinks school is the best thing. But I feel that on the principle level, there are so many things about school I just don't agree with - the one-size-fits-all approach to education and growing up I found it hard to fit in with school myself. I don't think school is necessary in order for one to get to Uni, because of personal experience. And I think since my daughter isn't very attached to her friends in school she really wouldn't miss much in terms of social life since she isn't the sort who likes having lots of friends anyway and already has friends of her own outside of school (granted its a really small bunch - 2 good girl friends outside of school). I'm at this point now where the more I hear my daughter tell me about her experience in school, the more frustrated I feel.

I'm not exactly a very confident parent. I am always doubting myself and whether what I want for my children is the right thing for them. I see other parents just make decisions for their children without needing to "consult" with them and their children seem to do whatever it is their parents decide for them, unlike me, I often feel the need to "consult" with my children and find out what they want/not want and then make my decisions from there... but granted they are young, sometimes I wonder if the approach I'm using is really useful.

Does anyone have any advice for me and whether home-edding is the right thing for me? I've tried googling for any advice on the Internet about how to decide if home-edding is the right thing for you as parent, but all I get is whether its the right thing for your child - and I'm pretty sure my daughter would take to it very well. Also I am a very shy person and don't have a big network of friends with children with whom I can provide my daughter with frequent opportunities to socialise, and we don't live near family so family support is out. There seems to be a good few parents home-edding in our community, and there are monthly meet-ups. However I've heard of one parent leaving the group because he has witnessed his young son being bullied by a gang of older home-edded boys at the meet-up.

My daughter is already attending ballet classes on Saturdays and she enjoys it. I'm not sure if that counts as a true socialising event since its not like they have play-time during the one hour class.
She tried joining one local Brownies group but sadly decided to stop going after 3 times as she failed to make a single friend or fit herself into the group and she found it extremely boring and awkward as a result. I have to admit I am sometimes worried for her that she will always have this problem of not being able to fit in/socialise. Come to think of it, I've always had the same problem, just not as severe as my daughter's as I have always managed to get by with a few friends no matter what setting... just that I'm just not a really social person by heart and don't really have the inclination to gain lots of friends... I'm happy with the few that I consider as "true friends". This is also another worry of mine that's making me hesitant about home-edding as I'm wondering if it would just make things worse for her on the social front.

Any advice ??

I have 3 DCs and would say that DS1 is definitely a 'geek' (or would be, if he was in school) and he was bullied when he was in school. He has not really missed it (had a bit of a wobble about not having friends when he was about 10), considered secondary school but didn't go. He's now 12 (nearly 13) and still really enjoys being at home. Just after he had the wobble, we found some great HE families who we meet up with regularly for various activities.

What do you have to lose by giving it a go? A school place, perhaps? Some people are more gregarious than others - they like to be in a 'gang'; others prefer more individual friendships. Neither way of being is 'wrong' or 'worse' than the other.

If Brownies didn't suit, what about Beavers/Cubs? DD much prefers Cubs as they seem to do more. If your DD gets on with people at ballet, maybe arranging to meet up with one of the girls there would be a possibility. There may also be more home ed activities in your area than you are aware of!!

"Teasing her is routine. Basically it ranges from saying "her eyes are full of shit and that's why she wears spectacles", to saying "she farts and poos all day" to bordering on the racist "hahaha your mum isn't white.."

what does your dh say to all that? I would take her out. Why should she be laughing along good naturedly whilst having that kind of crap thrown at her? Why not try a yea? At least you would break that cycle where she gets picked on every second day. Perhaps a year at home will give her a great boost of confidence too.

If it goes brilliantly, maybe stick with it. If you find after half a year that you/she aren't doing well with it, look at easing her back into school.

Actually I likethe idea of some kind of consesus between you and her on what you do. You could have a suggestion box and whenever anyone gets an idea for a topic, theme, day out, activity etc, write it down and put it in the box. Once a fortnight or so you couldboth sift through and see if anything should be tackled that week from the box.

It's hard to answer your very long and thoughtful post without sounding glib, but I think it sounds like you'd do a brilliant job with your DD. You know her inside out, you care for her, you enjoy being with her, you know what will make her thrive. (Polar regions for a term! )

I'm quite a shouty passionate person too, and not very social, but I'm finding HE is helping me in loads of ways as well (plus I can't wait to get on to the academic stuff). Even finding just one or two HE families that you like will make a difference.

Good luck

ou sound as though you'd do a great job home edding, and your DD would flourish. In your position I would definitely go for it.

thanks for all your encouragement... really appreciate it. i am starting to feel like perhaps i can do it... well, more than when i first typed out the original post!

today i had a chat with my daughter's headteacher about her school refusal (at times) which has contributed to her somewhat poor attendance record. headteacher absolutely denied everything i told her about what my daughter experiences at school... and said they had not picked up anything of the sort and that she will ask my daughter's teacher to speak to me at a later time "to give me reassurance" that my daughter is thriving in school. she also said that the next time my daughter says she has a stomachache/headache/dizziness/etc. and doesn't want to come to school, i must just frogmarch her there because the teachers can then decide for themselves if she really is sick and if she is they will call me to come and pick her up later... i wasn't very pleased with her outright denial of my daughter's experiences as i was only re-iterating exactly what my daughter tells me at home after returning from school...

i suppose my daughter could be fabricating all this, from the headteacher's POV... but i am inclined to take my daughter's words seriously (naturally!)

so yes i really really feel strongly about home-ed being best for her...however despite worries of not being able to do it right, its holding me back...

another concern about our situation which i didn't raise earlier on is that i also have 2 other younger children aged 3 and 1. 3 year old younger daughter seems quite advanced and mature for her age, she can sit still for long periods of time and keep her attention, so might be possible to home-ed her together with the elder one. my 1 year old son is a job on his own. he's very clingy and wants to be next to me all day long and will not be able to really understand most of whatever i will be teaching the other 2. he might even be disruptive to the lesson! yet he only naps for about half an hour a day so that means only half an hour tops for giving attention to the 2 girls...

my dh works full-time and won't be able to contribute a lot to the home-edding except for weekends, however his job is very stressful and i think whatever free time he can get at home he will prefer to use it for R&R rather than formal teaching - but i think he can be such a great teacher sometimes because i've seen him teach my daughter... he is very calm and collected.

that's another issue which i'm not sure how to go about. does anyone have any advice??

teachers denying the bullying? Telling you to coerce your child into school against her will? Me, I'd cut and run. That's not an environment I'd want my child in.

As for "teaching" them together, and disruption of the little one - read Alan Thomas and Harriet Pattison, How Children Learn at Home (I think that's what it's called). Also read Free Range Education, edited by Terri Dowty.

Even if you decide to go for a structured formal approach, you'll cover everything you need to while the baby is napping. Really, half an hour concentrated 2-on-1 is plenty for a 7 year old. The rest of the time is free for just being as a family. Playing, trips, reading together, making mud pies, baking...

A lot of the really educational stuff in our family happens in chance conversations in the middle of an activity that prob does not look educational at all from the outside. Or I worrit away about not managing to interest anyone in learning how to add with my nice neat workbooks for months, say, and then in a conversation at the park the child in question just does a load of sums out loud because of some game they are playing, demonstrating that they totally get and can use the concept, they just weren't interested in being explicitly taught it.

your dd sounds like the sort of dc who would benefit from following her own interests at home if the other two gave her a bit of peace to do it.I don't think she would need you working calmly with her for 3 hours a day tbh but you are there accesssible for her to come to and ask question and exchange ideas etc. I should think at this stage it might be all she needs. How is she at maths?

Have no experience so cannot comment on the HE with 3 kids etc but I do not like the sound of the head from your report of the interview. Doesn't sound as if the school will work on improving anything for your dd

Agree with ommward, that sounds like a really dodgy response from the head

You sound loads like us - I have DS(4), DD(2) and DD(8 mos). And my husband works long hours as well. And wasn't all that keen on HE initially! But all the many many benefits (like the huge freedom not to be tied into anyone else's schedule, cheap holidays off season etc), plus meeting lovely HE families, won him round.

I think it will do your "clingy" son the world of good to have his family round him all the time. You might find your children grow much closer as well.

Even if you don't home ed I would move her school. They sound stuck in the dark ages. Ask if they have a bullying policy and to see it (its a legal responsibility).

Read as much as you can about autonomous learning. The book Ommmward mentioned is fantastic. And anything by John Holt. And then try and find a few home ed blogs by families who take an autonomous approach.

I have four children, and my oldest is 7. She baulks at anything that looks like me teaching her. However, she is, like yours, an avid reader and is always telling me snippets of information she's picked up from random books she's been flicking through. She learns from watching dvds. And a lot from talking - she asks very sensible, intelligent questions and spends a lot of time thinking about things.

This week has been the Cheltenham Science Festival and we've attended some of the events there (with my 5yo too). We also visit museums and castles and anywhere they want to go. They learn loads from doing that sort of thing and chatting about it, and then tend to reinforce it by lots of playing! Yesterday they learnt (as part of a science festival thing) about how gravity on the moon is less than on earth so you jump higher and take longer to come back down. Today they played going to the moon and talked to eachother about how much higher they were able to jump than they could on earth .

They've had obsessions with different periods of history, thanks to dvds and tv programmes like Victorian Farm and 1940s House; and, as part of their deep interest in them, have learnt loads about it. I've arranged musuem group educational things with other HEors when my DDs express an interest in it and have shown they (and their peers) know more than the museum staff are expecting them to.

The younger ones I sometimes have to find childcare for, but most of the time they just muddle along with us. With a bit of practice, it's surprising how easy it can be to find a way to adapt an activity so part of it can be done by a child of different ages. And they get very, very used to taking turns and being patient etc.

It sounds like you'd be a fantastic HEor and your children would thrive

@ sufficient : Laughed at the "clingy" in inverted commas! I suppose he's not clingy. He just loves me A LOT :D

@ ZZZenAgain : She's quite good at Maths but she's not as interested at it as writing or drawing. Given a choice I have no doubt which subject she'd go for. I think Maths will be one of those things that she learns because "she has to" or because "mummy and daddy wants to teach her that".

@ ommmward : Thank you for the book recommendations. I'll certainly have a look at them.

@ mummytime : Will do, when I see the class teacher about this - I am interested in hearing her story too... even if I suspect it might be along the same lines as the head. I do want to give each of them a chance to tell me what they think and what they will do about the bullying.

It sounds as though HE is something your daughter could really benefit from. My younger daughetr is definitely the geeky type, and is quite proud to be so! She was what I would call a poor fit for school right from the start. She liked to immerse herself in a book or her own little world, and she never made any friends at school she was terribly bothered about or close to. The teachers would try to get her to be part of groups, but she never wanted to.

Since being taken out of school nearly 3 years ago (she's 10 now), she has really blossomed. She is far, far more sociable than she ever was at school and has some lovely groups of friends, both in the HE community and at her dance school. However, she needs time to be alone - she's that sort of child - and with HE she can get it. She's doing very well academically with not an enormous amount of input from me.

As for confidence, that will grow as you go along. It felt like a huge leap in the dark for me when I took her out of school, and an even more terrifying prospect when her sister wanted to come out of secondary school a year later. But here we are just a couple of years on with my eldest having just taken 3 GCSEs at 14 and my 10 year old nearly at thaqt stage too! If you'd asked me even two years ago whether I could have helped them achieve that, I'd have said no way! it's amazing how you learn as you go and hoe home education evolves.

In my experience, schools often play down bullying. It not only happened to my girls in school, but I worked as a primary school teacher for many years and I witnessed it first hand. I can't see your daughter would have any reason to make it up - why would she make up things that showed her to be unhappy if she was truly happy? If these other children were nice to her, what reason would she have to say such things about them? None at all that I can see.

I can't tell you that bullying never happens in the home ed community - we had a situation recently where a child my youngest had been really close friends with suddenly started being friends with a new little girl and completely ignoring (and being quite unkind to) my DD. But that has been the only problem in 3 years, and upsets don't become their whole focus like they do in school because they are not in the situation 6 hours a day, 5 days a week.

I think it would make your daughter better with socialising, not worse. School makes us think that every child has to be a complete social animal, but not every child is. I can tell you now that my younger DD probably won't get a job that involves being part of a huge team of people. But that would have been the same with school or without it - you can't completely change someone's personality by forcing them in with a crowd all day every day. All it means is she hasn't gone through lots of heartache between now and adulthood.

I think with HE you could fit the education and socialisation to your child, rather than trying to fit your child to the education.

Best of luck!

@ MrsWobbleTheWaitress : I have read John Holt's "How Children Learn" many years ago when said DD was only about 3 years old. I was really moved by the book and it actually made me go a bit teary when I thought about my childhood! It made me think that homeschooling was probably a good option for my child but I just didn't have the confidence to follow through with my gut instincts and instead put her through nursery when she had a really bad case of school refusal and I took her out. I tried educating her the Montessori way... Then I put her in reception and she didn't seem so against school then... but now when I think about all the stuff she had to go through adjusting to school life, I feel really sorry now that she had to go through all this.

@ musicposy : Thanks! Really nice to hear encouragement from an ex-teacher. I've often wondered if my daughter's school teachers were not that happy with the way things were done in school but because it is their livelihood they have to play by the "rules" and go along with whatever the head and the LEA says...

Absolutely. I had one child in my class, a really bad school refuser (despite all my best efforts - he'd been like it for years). We had a meeting with me, head, education welfare, ed psych etc because mum was talking about home edding him (years before I had my own children or knew anything about home ed). I said to the EWO, "well, why not? It might be the answer for him."

I have never been stamped on so hard. She basically told me that it wasn't in his best interests and I was to discourage the mother if I valued my job . I still feel bad about it all these years later. But I'm afraid teacher's hands are often tied, by the head, by the LA, by the government. It's why I teach privately now, not in school, and, although I did all I could to make my class a lovely place for the children in it, it's partly why I home ed.

@ musicposy : I wonder if I'll get hassle from the head if I do withdraw my daughter from school eventually because I was already told off today during the meeting that my daughter's attendance wasn't good enough. Up till now I was under the impression that all I needed to do if I wanted to home-ed was to write a letter to the head asking for DD to be removed from the school reg because I wanted to home-ed, and they will just do it with no questions asked... I'm not really looking forward to being questioned about my decision.

Hi noodle. Just skim-read this thread but wanted to reply to your last post in case others have gone to bed (where I should be!) You're correct in thinking that you just need to write a letter to dereg, and if they ask awkward questions / try to persuade you that you're doing the wrong thing then just smile politely and stick to your guns. In fact you don't need to meet with them at all if you don't want to - just drop of the letter and run!
BTW from what I have read, I agree with others that your dd and you sound like ideal home educators. If you give it a try you'll probably lose a lot of your wobbles and fears

drop off not drop of. It is too late for me to be typing. Good night!

Consulting with your children doesn't mean you lack confidence! I'm quite happy with how I parent and I try to always consult with the children on anything that concerns them - out of fairness, not out of lack of confidence.

Also, there's nothing wrong with being passionate. You don't have to be cool and calm to teach your kids as long as you aren't abusive!

I've found HE-ing remarkably easy but I'm using an online curriculum from K12 which makes it very easy (although it is an American system). I literally think anyone could HE using something like that. There are loads of resources out there though.

I agree with Carmen. Children should be consulted with because they should be as in control as they can be of their own lives. They are people, just like us IMO.

Let us know when you hand in your dereg letter!

noodle6

We were in the same position as you 3 years ago with our middle son...we took him out, we HE him and it is the most fantastic thing ever !
He is doing so well, he is just 10 but is already doing "senior school" work as he calls it, whereas at school he was held back by his shyness, they interpreted it as stupidity (their words) and he is having the most wonderful relaxed old fashioned childhood.

It has worked so well, we have recently taken our eldest son (14) out of school as he was bored and not being pushed (which is what he wanted) he is now about to start an OU course instead of sitting about waiting for 2 years to do his GCSE's which he could sit now and pass.

His school were really sh*tty about him leaving and said they were "fearful for his formal education" PAH! Don't be bullied by the EWO or the Head, they tried this with me and I refused to let them. Put it in writing and relax - I feel as though I have blinked and my son is 14 - where did it go ? We intend to make the most of the next few years!

Good Luck

I'm looking at the HEAS website... it has a number of publications. Does anyone think its worth buying some of them? Or would the home ed books mentioned here suffice for the beginning few months...

BTW had a chat with DH and he's starting to change his mind a little about home edding.

There are some (minor) issues he's concerned about relating to home edding :

1. school teaches discipline (in his view). he said he was a very unruly child in primary school and the discipline calmed him down a lot. he even thinks the fact that he is good at his career despite not being his chosen field is all down to the discipline they fostered at school. he's worried that once the children are grown and are looking for work, they might find it hard to adjust to a life of schedules and keeping time and self-discipline.

2. he doesn't know of any famous people born post 1950s who were home-edded apart from prodigies like the Williams sisters but our children are not exactly sports prodigies.

3. that i'm rushing too soon into the home edding decision and perhaps i should just wait until the end of year to make a decision. he said i could just be going into it too soon because the talk with the headteacher upsetted me.

4. his opinion of what DD goes through in school is of the "what doesn't kill you makes you stronger" variety. but he understands I'm really concerned about it so he says I go do what I think is best and he'll try his best to support it.

Wonder if anyone has any more to say about those points...