If your children have never been to school and you have always said...

[mychildrenarebarmy]

"of course if they wanted to go to school we would let them" What would be your criteria?

We HE our DD who is 6yrs and plan to do the same for her brother. She has never been to school and has a mix of friend in schools and HE world. She has started saying she would like to try school. I have always said the above but now she is saying it I am not happy with the idea for many reasons. I was expecting it to happen at some point but not quite so soon.

She has a grass is greener idea of school.
If she went to school none of the ones within walking distance are ones I would send her to so we would have to drive.
I dislike the education system in general.
I don't think she is old enough yet to make that decision for herself.
I think it would not necessarily be good for her. I think she would struggle with the structure of it (we are semi-structured but not in a school type way) which I think would have an adverse effect on her.

So, Piscesmoon,

what would you do if one of your dc said that they didn't want to stay at school. Would you HE?

In my area - dont know what happens in other counties, the schools all have one day in June where the whole class goes up a year - so year 2 goes up to find who there teacher will be in septemebr and spend the day with the teahcer getting to know the class. The samne happens with year 6 they all go to the secondary school that they have been alocated and so on.

Could you enquire if there is a day like this in your county and then your dd could slot inot trying school on this day with the "possible" intention of her going to school in september?

Also this way although she would be "new" the whole class would be "new" to the teacher so she may feel more comotable with the day.

I see where she gets the bullying from now. You do have to choose your school very carefully-I would most definitely HE rather than send to a poor school. All schools will have bullies, so I wouldn't send a DC to one that says they don't-they are ignoring the roblem. HE will have bullies-human nature is the same the world over and you get all sorts in all walks of life. It is how schools handle it that matters and a good school will not allow it.
If you were to think of it I would go and visit a lot of schools on a normal working day and ask lots of questions. They are all very, very, different-they can't be lumped together. You may be unlucky and not have any good schools. I think you would be pleasantly surprised in my area-many are not as you would imagine.

Kaytee, I would HE if there were no decent schools for them to go to and most definitely if they were unhappy. I wouldn't have any hesitation at primary level, but would have to think very laterally at secondary level because I am not up to doing some subjects.
However, the last DS has almost finished and so it isn't going to happen. School has been a positive experience for all of them and it has given them a wide choice of career. They have been at a good state comprehensive that does the extra-for example it co-owns an outdoor centre. I chose to live where I live for the schools.
I wouldn't choose to do it if they like school-partly because I would get bored-I like to have at least 18 children so that they can bounce ideas off each other and inspire each other. If I were to HE I would have to group with others a lot.

mychildrenarebarmy - what is the problem with the local schools? Most primary schools nowadays are pretty good places to go. Secondary - perhaps not.

ok Piscesmoon,

what if your dc said they didn't want to go to school even if, in your opinion, it was not a "poor school". What if they told you that they hated going to the lovely school that your dc attend atm. Would you still HE them then?

seeker - the closest one has very poor literacy levels throughout the school which would be a massive concern for me as her reading age is 2 years ahead of her actual age. The next closest one is about as close as possible to being a failing school as it can get without actually being officially labelled as such.

This tuesday is starting to sound like a strain isn't it.

What stops you saying 'no, we're going to HE because of these reasons and I think it's a better option than school for these reasons.' That is what you think, perhaps it is okay for you to say it?

You are in a sticky situation, I do see that. I lurk on HE threads as I know someone who is going to do it, and I find it interesting. Sometimes I forget to lurk and post opinions!

I sort of wonder if you should do that? Or give her a cut off date and say we're definitely doing this until you are 9 or something? I think that is what I'd say to mine. I think that is what I'd say if they asked if they could HE. If it was curiosity which motivated it, rather than unhappiness ifyswim.

So both the schools near you have level 4s from Ofsted?

seeker,
what do Ofsted levels have to do with it??

I think it might be a compromise to say not at the moment but if you still want to do it in 2 yrs-3yrs time (your choice of time)then we will organise it.

Kaytee-if they weren't happy at a 'good' school. I would first of all talk to them about it extensively and find the reasons. I would then go into school and discuss it with the teacher and possibly Head and see how it could be solved. If that failed I would look around for another suitable school and I might go down the line of private education. HE would be the very last resort-mainly because my DH works long hours and comutes (the price of chosing to live in a place with good schools) and we need the money that I earn. I would also miss teaching other DCs. I teach because I like working with children-most of them are lovely. The job is never boring and I think I would get bored with only my own and because I have a large age gap it would have been difficult to be fair to them all.
It is all a bit hypothetical because they haven't asked to HE-but I have put a lot of effort into choosing the right school and always being supportive so that they won't ask in the first place!

I'm sorry I HAVE to butt in (again) rather than persecute the OP for her choice to H.E, Piscesmoon I dont think you realise just how 'perfect' you sound do you think that we as H.Ers tell our children school is a dreadful awful place full of bullies and black crayons and work,work,work- dont you think in an ideal society all children would go to school and be happy and thrive and make daisy chains,and parents could stay as parents instead of full time educators knowing our offspring were receiving a sound education.

fact the education system is letting a lot of children down

fact a lot of parents are making huge sacrifices in order to give their child a good education at home.

In an ideal world H.E would have the chance to spend some time in school seeing how the school day goes for children just like the op-but this isnt the real world and how can we really take what a 6 year old says on a whim as hard facts that can be very difficult to undo.

If Im absolutely honest I dont think the ops dd does really understand about school just as the children who want to be taught at my house understand what goes on here.

At 6 life should be simple the big decisions should be what t shirt she want to wear ,what cereal she will eat wether she will wear roller skates or go on her scooter - not decisions that will be lifechanging - and I think the op as a responsible parent has to be the ultimate decider.

OP do you teach formally? would it be worth investing in some curriculum based workbooks to go through?

It's just that a lot of people say that their local schools are awful without actually knowing much about them. I'm not saying, of course, that the Op is one of those people, but there is a huge amount of prejudice about school around, and I wanted find what she was basing her judgements on. A lot of people in our town wouldn't touch our school with a bargep pole for various reasons, but my children have been very happy there and achieved a lot.

"rather than persecute the OP for her choice to H.E" I don't think that happened, did it?

Well as I was reading it (late at night admittedly) it seemed that 1 poster was more suggesting the OP was homer edding cos she wanted to and almost as if she hadnt prepared her dc for school- seeker I dont for a minute suggest you were the cause for my outburst .

Piscesmoon, it sounds as though you have put a lot of effort into ensuring that your children will enjoy school because you believe that is the best place for them to be educated. You have presented them with what you see as the good things about going to school, how much they would enjoy it, how great school is etc. You have encouraged them to see the positive side of school.

If someone believes that being educated out of school is best for their children why shouldn't they do the same? Show them all the positives of learning out of school and encourage them to take that route. Why should they encourage them to try school. Why would you not encourage your children to try home-ed? And encourage it with the same gusto that you encourage school?

If someone believes that educating out of school is better for their child, why would they be falsely enthusiastic and encourage their child towards what they consider a choice less beneficial.

But if neither the parent or the child has any experience of schools - and I mean schools NOW, not when the parent was a child - how can thye possibly make that decision?

The same way that parents who have no experience of home-ed make the decision that school is better?

Really though, I'm assuming parents look into the pros and cons of each and make their decision based on that. Just as some people compare one school against another and decide which they think is best for their child. How can they know for definite that the school they didn't choose wouldn't have been better?
We can only make decisions based on information that we have at the time. We can't live 2 alternative lives to find out which was the better choice and then wind the clock back to just choose that one.

eek ladies, ladies (and gentlemen if applicable! ) calm down please. I know this is a subject likely to meet strong opinions and questioning. I think that is why I posted on here. I didn't want to ask in a solely home ed situation or a solely school situation because I would get bias towards one or the other. Asking here seemed a good balance because I know this board is visited by both sides. I am finding all you have said so far helpful because it helps me organise my thoughts about it. If you have said things I agree with then I have sat here and thought 'exactly', if I haven't agreed then I have thought 'that's not true for me. But why?' So no need to fall out here tis all helpful.

ahundredtimes - That might be the final answer but I do plan to do the 'school day' first. It is definitely curiousity, grass is greener type thing. She needs to have a clearer idea of the not so good stuff aswell as the good stuff.

seeker - one of them was 3's but with strong wording in a sort of 'pull your socks up type way'. The other was a balance of 2's and 3's but the thing that makes me discount it completely is mainly the literacy level.

nickschick - we do a little formal stuff. We are neither structured nor autonomous. Over the last few months we have started to become more structured and she has enjoyed that. I have been thinking about stepping that up a little bit more.

Now we are off to get ready for our day at the zoo where my friend is going to have to listen to me trying to sort out more of my thoughts about it while the children feed animals, run around and generally have fun. And yes I will be using today as an 'if you went to school you wouldn't be able to come with us when we do things like this'. Not because I am mean but purely because it's true.

I don't think that anyone is persecuting the OP for her choice of school. I have said that I don't see a problem with her DD trying school, either she sees that the grass isn't greener and wants to continue with HE, or it suits her and she wants to stay. As her mother would make quite clear that she could leave at any point, it isn't going to scar her for life- even if she doesn't like it. My second suggestion is that she shelves it for the moment but promises that if she still feels the same in a couple of years she can try it.

I think that you and I are very different, nickschick, the decisions that I am scared of making for my DCs are the real life changing ones because 1, I might be wrong and 2, when they grow up they may disagree strongly with my choice for them and it is too late to change it.
I don't mind if they are inevitable as in moving house and area because I can justify it it in later life-I would be too frightened to make one that I can't justify, except through my personal philosophy.
I am not being difficult here-I just know it to be true for me that if my mother had educated me at home I would be angry as an adult and it would affect our relationship.

I usually join in these debates because, like seeker, I get so fed up with the negative views of schools and the education system. My local primary school is one that some local people wouldn't touch with a bargepole, this was based on the fact that it takes a broad mix of social backgrounds and some of the DCs are a bit rough (they haven't actually visited). Those of us who sent our DCs there knew how good it was with a visionary Head and dedicated staff.
The funny thing was that it then got Beacon Status and parents wanted their DCs to go there!

Kaytee makes it sound as if school is an equal choice to HE and that anyone can do it, if their DC wants to. If you decide to send your DC to school all it really requires is that you get your DC up in time in the morning. Not everyone can HE for a huge variety of reasons. Money comes into it a lot and needing to work when the DC is at school. I have a very selfish reason-I like to have the house to myself for some part of each day-no one to make any demands and absolute silence.
Going shopping with my DCs would be a chore, (I remember the days when one had to push the trolley up the aisles and the other down, and we had to share out the end parts-and the next time the up one had to be the down one-it would send me batty!)in fact getting general life things done would be a chore, you can only call them educational up to a point.
My DSs get on, but not if they have too much of each othe's company. DS2 and I joke that if we had done it one of us would have murdered the other!-we are able to laugh about it because we didn't do it.

You also have to bear in mind that you are in it for the long term. My SIL has been doing it for over 10 yrs and she has another 5 to go. She was a great enthusiast, but she is tired of it and wants to move on. Last time I mentioned this someone blithely said 'she could send him to school' as if this was a viable option. Of course she can't! You can't keep a DC at home, not give him the option of school and then say at 13yrs " right-I've had enough-off to school", it wouldn't be fair unless he asks and I don't think he will.

I love going in to teach other people's children-this is why most teachers do it and I know several retired ones who go into school as volunteers to hear readers-I don't think you will get many jobs where people leave and give their time for free! It is very common for them to become school governors after they retire.

I had a year 1 class yesterday afternoon (half day). I take the register by saying 'good afternoon x' and most of them say 'good afternoon Mrs x', some vary it by using a foreign language or saying 'I hope that you have a nice afternoon' or 'I hope you enjoy teaching us'-yesterday a little Italian boy said 'good afternoon Mrs x-I love you'! It made me smile all afternoon-I would miss all this if I was at home with my own!

There is a lot wrong with education-mainly the bureaucracy , the testing and the constant government changes- but lots of schools are lovely places and I don't recognise them from the negative descriptions on here. I don't see any harm in OP at least taking her DD seriously and visiting a few-it doesn't commit her to anything and she might be pleasantly surprised.

I have extensive experience of home education. Otherwise I wouldn't talk about it - I realize that it is a very sensitive subject, although I'm not quite sure why. I was just interested in how far the OP had investigated her local schools before saying that she wouldn't send her child to them. It did sound from what she said that she was going by league tables and hearsay, rather than going in and seeing what's going on. Happy to be proved wrong if I am.

'If someone believes that being educated out of school is best for their children why shouldn't they do the same? Show them all the positives of learning out of school and encourage them to take that route. Why should they encourage them to try school. Why would you not encourage your children to try home-ed? And encourage it with the same gusto that you encourage school?'

Absolutely agree juule, but OP started this because her DD has said that she wanted to try school and although she thinks in theory that they should be free to try it, she wasn't ready for it a 6 yrs. OP obviously has put the same effort into encouraging HE as I have school-I think she is right to do that.

'That might be the final answer but I do plan to do the 'school day' first.'

I think you need to visit a few schools first-the 'school' day may not be as you imagine. I can imagine the sort of day you are going to do with hour for maths, break time, hour for literacy etc but I could show you schools that don't do that, especially at 6 yrs.

Maybe, Riven. But the OP hasn't said that. And even if that is the case, I think people ought to make their own decisions based on their own judgements, not second hand ones.