An apology and a request for encouragement...

[NumptyNameChange]

I have stated with utter conviction at least a few times on mumsnet, and most recently on the ongoing thread about fines for term time holidays, that homeschooling is not an option for me as a single parent. I was convinced of that as entirely as I would be of the difference between black and white.

It has suddenly occurred to me that actually yes, there possibly ARE ways I could do it that may not be obvious or without complications but are not unattainable necessarily.

So this is partly an apology and partly a big ask for help and encouragement.

It is such a HUGE idea to actually say NO, I won't let you have my son and put him through this whole machine that every instinct in me rejects despite being a teacher myself, and actually maybe i COULD give him something better that didn't leave him screwed or me screwed or us living in the gutter. But there is so much convention and opinion and resistance that it would be easy to lose sight of this or not garner the confidence and conviction to go through with it.

Any encouragement or wisdom would be massively appreciated.

For a little background my son is nearly seven, in year 2 at a village primary and has no SEN or relevant issues. I am a secondary school teacher of Religious Studies and I work three days a week in term time (so obviously some issues to work out there in terms of childcare, affordability etc but suddenly I'm open to the idea that those ideas are potentially not insurmountable and given some of the things i've read on the thread i mentioned before may well be worth surmounting even if it means sacrifice and challenge and massive going against the tide).

thanks. it depends if i can stick this job out tbh. finding it so draining dealing with that level of disruption. i'm trying to stay empathetic to the fact that some of the worst cases i'm dealing with have horrendous homelives but it's hard to keep sight of.

ironically i have to decide if i can cope with taking abuse from other people's children in order to prevent my son from having to go take abuse from them instead.

Wow, that makes very sobering reading about the state of the secondary schools you've taught in. This is making my current dilemma about whether to send DD to secondary a bit clearer cut!

sorry i don't mean to be alarmist crabby.

i've worked in three counties over the years and this one is definitely the worst and is known to be a bit of a backwards LA with issues to be dealt with and awful at managing budgets traditionally. to be honest though even the 'good' schools i've worked in don't really strike me as places i'd want ds to rely upon for his education and be forced to endure five days a week.

i'm sure there are great schools, i'm sure there are kids who love school and let the nastier aspects of it go over their heads whilst taking the good from it etc. sorry - big disclaimer needed as i'm not the authority on schools and the one i'm in at the minute is in special measures so clearly has had some problems in recent years in order to get there. i have lovely classes too who are noisy and lively and take some management but aren't malicious.

how old is your dd and what is her character like? what is it you would want from school and what are your concerns?

Hi Numpty,

Childcare costs are childcare costs, they’re linked into how much you work and earn, sometimes gateway benefits, (am a bit out of touch on the mechanics) and the provider being registered, not when you work or if there’s a cheaper option. School is not officially childcare to anyone but DWP, and then only if you’re seeking non-working LP benefits, and claiming home responsibilities.

Reality is, people on low incomes who need to use benefits always have some difficulties being given misinformation, so over time you must become self-reliant, and learn and research all the bits you will need, and what’s dependant on what, which category trumps another (ie a LP whose disabled, should be treated under disabled parent rules, not LP rules, housing benefit can be paid to a person who has no other gateway benefit if they are nil income, there is no legal limit on how many hours a Level 3 student is allowed to work to still receive CB etc, and many other myths) and how to deal with things when they stuff it up. (It’s not much different from being a parent with a child with an SEN statement in school tbh!)

They can try and shut down h.e, but they’ll have to change a very important law about whose responsibility education is first, and there will be an even bigger fight than Badman got. It isn’t something they’d be able to quietly bring in and you not have a choice to jump ship, so really don’t worry too much about that.

Re your hell school post, yes some schools are hell holes. Most, probably aren’t, and are lots of everything, with a lot of the worst stuff quite contained, which is why a lot of people just can’t imagine what you’re talking about, because they never experienced anything like that.

Some schools we’ve used have been hell holes, but even then only a portion of children were directly affected by the worst bits. It’s only when you work in one, or are having to be there a lot dealing with what’s happening, that you start to be aware of just how bad some of the bad, is.

One of mine suffered very badly (the one who ended up illegally excluded) culminating in being shot at, and the school just talked about risk assessing the next attack. I questioned why it was acceptable to expect him to keep being attacked, and they insisted it wasn’t something they could be expected to stop from happening as they could only ‘work with’ the situations they had.
It was fine for him to be suffering repeated kicking’s and staff to be off sick from the shock of what they’d witnessed while he struggled in, because everyone knew about it, including the LEA.

But, older sibling’s had seen some disruption in their schools, but nothing like those levels of violence especially during lessons. Things happened away from the adults, and if they saw it then adults went in to break it up, not act as witnesses while a child was battered, and they’d managed an average neither here nor there education, and seen nothing like this and at first struggled to comprehend it.

So even within a family, it can be hard to relate to very different realities.
Recently I’ve seen what life for staff and pupils at an independent school looks like, and been gobsmacked at how very different again, their world is, and LSA’ing a pupil in an internet school has shown me another educational reality, and of course h.e has shown me a very different world indeed. So I guess it’s like travel, if you only know one country, another nationalities experiences may seem outlandish and others may struggle to understand.

I think HE is fantastic for some families, and I would love to join in the debates on here about it- I have lots of personal experience. But can I just say, I, and perhaps others, are always put off by the way schools and parents who choose school based education are talked about. Already on here the has been talk about "SATs folder" " handing children over to the state" "following the flock"......:.

Do bear in mind that presumably you will still want to socialize with school educated children and their parents, so be careful not to let your enthusiasm sound like criticism of others choices. Many of us schoolies have thought abut our child's educational needs as much as you have, you know!

yes, i see your point. most people do have no idea unless they have to go deal with it. going back to teaching has made me look at society very differently again and how much of a clash there is between the supposed culture we live in terms of media portrayal and politicians view and the culture of those from deprived socio economic backgrounds of significant sizes within our counties. again something most people would have no cause to be exposed to or aware of unless they were a teacher or a social worker or the like. most of mn is unlikely to have seen what life is like for some of the young people i teach and would find it impossible to believe that it can be that bad, be entirely known about by all authorities and yet that child still be living at home and in mainstream education itms. think they'd be able to believe that oh no that child would be in care or that child would be in a secure psychiatric setting etc.

govt seems to expect teachers and schools to just hide the problems of society and presumably contribute to keeping that majority blissfully unaware. one of the things i find really disturbing is the way that schools do not involve police in criminal events - re: physical and sexual assaults, drug dealing, etc and how many parents don't seem to realise they have the right to call the police and press for criminal charges but take the heads word on it and assurances rather than going to higher authorities.

anyway i could go on all day about that.

i'm sorry your child had such an awful time of it and yes the situation does seem to change so quickly that even siblings can have entirely different experiences - that was true for me and my older sister who was 9years older than me and taught under a very different system with o'levels and minimal contact with anyone who wasn't expected to get c levels and above let alone those expected not to get any formal qualifications at all. she would find it hard to comprehend a lesson where there are a* students crammed in with those who have very basic literacy problems, those who barely speak english and those who struggle to comply with even the most basic behavioural expectations.

It was only when ds was shot at that we found out the school police officer didn’t record crimes involving SN pupils as victims, by the request of the school in order to figure manage! (in fairness that changed very swiftly after armed police explained a few things!)

It sounds like you've the same education model where you are that we had.
No streaming for most lessons, A*, A,B, students allowed a couple of additional separated core subject lessons a week as boosters, but doing the rest in totally mixed ability classes?

I'm wondering what your subject is (though fine if you don’t want to say here) because there are teachers out there home edding and working from home (sometimes other’s homes) as internet school teachers, tutors etc. One (who I think has now grown h.e children) supplies distance learning courses. Many also pick up exam marking. Invigilating etc, teaching creative writing, either on line or r/l, Kumon franchise etc, as part of a mixed income.
Some also have side line businesses producing educational materials, and another sells science kits and DK books. One teaches child actors on set/ backstage, and her child is growing up happily alongside her work.

Just as a child doesn’t have to go to school to learn, neither does a teacher to be paid to impart knowledge.

Oh dear, guess who didn't read the op properly?

I think within the earning ideas above, you'd probably find more call for the Philosohy end than conventional RE, (at least as it was taught in last school) but it's all about flexibility. An internet school teacher I've come across LSA'ing, is a brilliant English teacher, but apparently she's actually a geography teacher.

"Oh dear, guess who didn't read the op properly?"

That wasn't directed at me, was it?

Lurking but.....shot at!!!! Not recorded!!! Whaaaaat?!
I just had to say that...thanks for all the comments btw...

Sorry I should clarify that he was shot at off the school premises by the same lot that were hounding him on them.
It was all the previous incidents; being dragged down a long flight of stairs by the hair, flying drop kicked knocking him half out in a lesson,
serious classroom beatings in front of teachers, including broken bones, (in one the teacher was also threatened to not get involved, which was recorded, but not my son as being the victim) threats of (male) gang rape, threats of knife stuff, threats of chucking him under vehicles and out of windows, 'happy slapping' videos, and constant harassment for being SN and walking with an odd gait, showing an escalating situation spread amongst older years too, that had been recorded by school as school 'behaviour incidents' or 'fighting,' ("no it's not fighting, fighting’s when you get a chance to hit back") but wasn't being recorded by the school policeman as crimes, which is what they are at that level, not just 'bullying.'

So when the shooting incident happened off the school premises by some of them, 999 got called by several people and police were given basic info and that it wasn't random. Armed police arrived, expecting to run ds through the Merlin system as a repeat victim and put names and addresses to, and round up the offenders, and retrieve a gun immediately, but couldn't, because it hadn't been being recorded by the school policeman. (As I said in fairness that incident changed 'policy' fast)

curlew, I think Just was referring to herself, not you! She had just asked the OP what her subject was, and straight afterward picked up on the fact that the OP had actually mentioned RE in her first post.

Phew! I'm used to being jumped on when I post on HE threads so I had a brief moment of paranoia.

Curlew no, directed at myself! She said what her subject was in the OP, and there I am asking her what it is in the post above hence the follow up "Oh dear, guess who didn't read the op properly?"

Numpty

Justgettingonwithit, how utterly horrendous! Your poor dc, how stressful for you as a family also.

It was an absolutely horrendous time in our lives, sometimes I couldn't believe it was happening, especially as it was the best of a bad bunch of schools we could get into, and covering up and minimising everything as somehow normal and ok, seemed to go on a lot, along with blaming, and trying to cover up.
I felt like the worse parent in the world for being unable to end it and protect him properly for so long. That's something I'll carry forever.

It did them no favours either, as several are now locked up, (not though us) the school still has a lot of issues, but I'm told some of the truly awful stuff is now dealt with better as a result of some of it. I hope so.

I'm pleased to say though, he's done really well through h.e. despite what he went through and despite not insubstantial SN's, and he not only has a good education, he has a decent social life too, and he tries to support others who need it.

It also left us understanding and not denying other people's realities if they talk about what may seem very removed from main experiences.

Getting back to encouraging Numpty as asked, rather than backing up that she isn’t making up the situations in some schools; 3 dgc’s (no 4’s a baby) are now also h.e on a low income, and are having a ball, growing up happy and enquiring, not exhausted, learning, and well, and bright eyed and bushy tailed.
Mum has completely changed her life, from what was a quiet stressed life, and made the decision to move from an inner city estate to a more relaxed and closer to rural area, with a good h.e. community and a slower pace of life, and is looking at setting up an internet business. Seeing them grow up like this is magic.

So how will you home educate if your working?
Also I think you should leave teaching if you think it's so terrible. Hypocritical and not fair on the kids you teach.

so if a teacher finds it difficult to deal with the most extreme behaviour problems in schools of a small section of students they should leave teaching? itsbetterthan you would find there were no teachers if we all did that and funnily enough we do actually care about the kids we teach and the difference we can make to their lives and keep going through the difficulty of dealing with the challenging aspects because of that.

or are you just saying that people who HE shouldn't teach? what about people who send their children to private school should they not be allowed to teach in state schools?

If you think 'it's a whole machine that every instinct if you rejects' then yes you shouldn't be part of it. I'm not saying you shouldn't be allowed but morally imo you should not do it. I think teachers (or anyone) who send their kids to private school are in the wrong.
I'm a socialist so even though I wouldn't be banned from working at a huge arms dealer for example I wouldn't do it because I believe it is wrong.

many people work within systems that are struggling and sometimes utterly broken such as teachers, social workers, mental health workers etc. they stay and do what they can within that system. social workers who try to do the best they can to help children and families despite budget restraints and workload for example. are you saying all social workers who think the child protection system is fundamentally not working should leave? all teachers who think the education system is not working in it's current form should just quit? politicians who think that the political system has become horribly corrupt and skewered towards the interests of the elite should simply give up and go home?

other people do send their children to school and those children need teachers. if you only wanted them taught by people who thought the education system was working wonderfully and had no cause to be critical of it you'd be hard pressed to staff even a fraction of the schools in the uk.

teachers do not control education, politicians do. if no one who didn't wholeheartedly agree with a system ever entered it there would never be change and there would be no such thing as subversion. some argue (and there is a book of the same name) that teaching is a subversive activity, that the teachers job is to make children think and question despite the fact that the schools job in a society is really to make them obedient citizens who don't think or question. schools are set up to socialise the masses, teachers are there to develop enquiring and critical minds. by it's very nature there is a clash there.