A level subject shortlist to keep university options open?

[DressToKill]

My dd is trying to decide which A levels to choose. She wants to go to university but doesn’t know which course though might be interested in medical sciences, history or psychology.
Her strengths are the sciences and humanities though extended writing is not her strong point.
She could also probably manage maths which I think would be a good idea.
So does anyone have any advice on, let’s say a shortlist of 5 subjects she should consider to keep her options open?

Biology would be helpful for psych and sciences. A humanities based subject - such as history or psychology. You need to look at individual courses. A Bachelor of Arts in psych might not requires maths or biology, but a Bachelor of Science would.

Don't push maths unless she is really capable (at least gsce grade 7) and she loves maths.
All A levels are a huge step up from GCSEs, and maths seems particularly tough.

Maths is an interesting one as despite top grades in SATs and the schools own start of y7 assessment she was put in set 2 of 3. I wasn’t aware of this until they proudly told me she had been moved to set 1. It turned out a TA had kicked up a stink when she got 99% in an end of topic assessment. I suspect because she is diagnosed with Autism she had been underestimated.
I myself have a maths degree so would be able to assist her if she struggled but I actually don’t think she would.

The a levels you would choose for a medical degree and the ones you would choose for a history degree are very different.

medical degrees vary in requirements but chemistry and biology are generally a good start. Many aspiring medics do maths chem bio or maths physics chem bio.

for a history degree you’d be looking at history plus other humanities subjects generally.

I guess you could try chem bio and history?

I don’t think she would want to do a medicine degree but possibly something adjacent like pharmacology or psychology. I guess she will need to decide if it’s humanities or science…

Psychology is generally considered a social science. While a psychology degree will have quite a lot of statistics in it, maths a level is mostly pure with a bit of mechanics and stats so the maths a level isn’t particularly useful here.

it is possible to do psychology a level but it’s quite rare and most degrees won’t expect it.

it’s normal at a level to basically choose between stem/humanities/languages/creative paths so while some people do mix these paths eg choosing bio geography psychology or chem bio French it’s more normal to pick three that are in the same area.

if you are used to a European system or the Irish system where they study more subjects for longer it can look at bit weird, but it’s normal for England.

I myself have a maths degree so would be able to assist her if she struggled don't factor this in - she should pick subjects she can manage alone or adjust expectations in terms of grades - it's better long-term to work to your real best level than have ongoing extra support as that has to end eventually.
Different getting a bit of help for blips.

If the worst comes to the worst and she is missing a subject that she needs then she can always do it as an additional later on, post-school. However, this is easier for things like Maths or Humanities. It's not so easy for things that need equipment like labs for sciences or facilities for Art, Textiles, etc.

If extended writing is not her strong point, history would be a surprising uni choice (or even A level).

What grade is likely in maths GCSE? Not much point taking it and getting a lower grade than in something else – what I mean is, it opens doors to science degrees but not so much if you get a C/D.

The trouble is IMHO if you genuinely want to keep options open at A level, it’s really tricky. DD took three subjects which open doors to studying those subjects at uni (Eng lit, geog, MFL) but even then she closed loads of other doors – biology, physics, maths, chemistry, engineering, medicine, dental, vet med, music, art, DT, classics – you get my point I am sure.

Actually a number of unis (inc Leeds for example IIRC) don't require history A level for the degree. Otoh if you love history that much, surely you would want to take the A level.

For medical subjects biology and chemistry are the best options; also good for psych. Psychology itself is not needed for a psych degree tho it will give an idea of the content. It doesn't in itself keep any options open tho.

I guess my list, based on your OP, would be: bio, chem, maths (caveat: as long as GCSE is 8+), history (caveat: concern about not liking writing essays). MFL if she takes one (needed for MFL at uni)? Geography (if she takes that at GCSE)?

She should only take three ideally. Bio, chem, history would keep both medical and history/humanities options open.

ETA: I took so long to write that that I have x posted. I actually disagree re psychology being rare – IME it is a very popular A level and frequently offered in sixth forms local to me at any rate. Lots of ppl take it and then drop it tho as it is much duller than they thought.

It's not unusual for medics to take history actually as it shows breadth – but I see she is not keen on med anyway. Maths supports the other sciences better than history tbh. You don't say her likely GCSE grade but that is key.

Maths is the most general for every subject. I know more than one person with maths a level who went on to classics at oxbridge. And any science values maths.

psychology can be taught as a science (not social science) at more academic universities and maths is v valuable to go beyond the basics. Psychology a level is not needed or even recommended.

so I’d recommend maths plus favourite sciences.

If you want to shortlist 5, then Maths, Bio, Chem, Psychology and History. Could get away without Chem if could rule out Pharmacology or Biochemistry - but it doesn’t sound like they should be ruled out at this stage. Could get away without Maths, maybe think about a History-adjacent such as Politics. But yes, unless going for IB, or Scottish quals, A levels need a science/humanities decision.

Biology and Psychology seem the obvious choices
Chemistry is compulsory for most medicine degrees so if she doesn’t want to rule that out include chemistry
History is a good solid subject and leaves a lot of options open
Maths is a good option too but only if she enjoys it and is on track to get at least a 7 at gcse

Biology chemistry and history would keep most of not all of her likely options open.

I note what you say about her not being strong at long essays. Has she thought about archaeology at all? A science background could be very useful there.

I would say that Psychology is a hugely popular A-level (and a hugely popular degree). At degree level is most often taught as a science (BSc), and some of the top courses are likely to be heavy on the cognitive neuroscience. A majority of psychology undergraduates will have psychology A-level, and I would say maths A-level is more useful than biology (although both are useful for cog neuroscience).

Having said all that, as PP have said, the A-level is not a requirement. I would also say, it is not the best subject to chose if you are trying to keep options open.

Most science degrees require a minimum of 2 science A-levels (with Maths counting as one). Psychology will count as a science for some courses, but for others it would be better to have different subjects.

If she is interested in medical sciences, but doesn't know what, then I'd suggest biology and maths or biology and chemistry (depending on whether she is more interested in maths or chemistry, and what courses she is interested in after that). If she is very good at maths (grade 9), she could consider starting maths and further maths, with a view to dropping FM if she doesn't end up loving maths.

If she loves History, she should do it. My DD is doing history. It is her worst subject (in that she finds the essays harder to nail), but she absolutely did not want to do pure science/maths, and she finds it interesting.

So, depending on her preferences and interests, I'd say to consider:

Maths, Biology & History (and possibly FM if she does super well and wants to give it a go)

Biology, Chemistry & History

Just asked AI about the sciences (and clearly it may not be accurate!!):

Degrees with Biology + Chemistry (Not usually Biology + Maths):

• Medicine and Dentistry: Chemistry is often a compulsory requirement.
• Pharmacy & Pharmacology: Chemistry is essential.
• Veterinary Science: Frequently requires Chemistry, not Math.
• Biochemistry / Molecular Biology: Deeply relies on organic chemistry knowledge.
• Chemical Engineering: Usually requires Chemistry and Math, but Chemistry is key.
• Food Science/Dietetics: Highly dependent on chemistry, not math.

Degrees with Biology + Mathematics (Not usually Biology + Chemistry):

• Bioinformatics / Computational Biology: Requires high-level math/programming skills.
• Biological Mathematics / Mathematical Biology: Focused on modeling ecological or biological systems.
• Economics: Math is a key A-Level requirement for top programs, whereas Chem is not.
• Data Science / Statistics: Uses Math, not Chem.
• Theoretical Physics/Biophysics: Focuses on math-based modeling of living systems.

Common Degrees for Both Pairings:

• Biological Sciences/Zoology/Ecology.
• Biomedical Science.
• Psychology (if they require one science).
• Natural Sciences.
• Environmental Science.

I think that psychology degrees are often not fully represented on MN. Psychology is a broad subject area. All BPS accreditated degrees have to cover the core areas. These will include quantative and qualatitive research methods as well as social, biological, developmental psychology etc. All students will be conducting and interpreting statistical tests and using packages such as R and or SPSS. They also have to study qual methods. Some students in their final year will focus on biological modules and do a quants based research project others will focus on other areas and do a qual based research project. Students need to look at the courses and the options available and see what fits with their interests. Some courses will have a much more bio/quants bias than others. Qualatitive resesrch (including things like grounded theory) is part of psychology and is very different from quants. The research groups in the department will influence the course emphasis and options (but these are subject to change - nothing is guaraneed).
In terms of A levels:
*Sound maths skills are important, but maths A level isn't usually a requirement. It is that stats in maths a level that will be directly applicable. Don't take it if you aren't confident of an A or B (see below). Many students manage fine with GCSE maths. Stats A level would also be an option, but isn't commonly offered.
*Most degrees with ask for a minimum of one science, but this can often be psycholgy. If you are interested in neuroscience biology and chemistry are helpful. However, many students focus on other areas. In most degrees the compulsory modules will be accessible without bio and chem (see below).
*Psychology A level isn't a requirement. However, a lot of students will have it (I think ut is now the second most popular A level). What it is helpful for is giving an insight into psychology before commiting to the degree. Degree work is different, but if you dont like psychology A level it is unlikely you will enjoy it at degree level.

The most important thing to note is that pschology is hugely popular. High ranking institutions will want minimum AAA. Even less selective unis will often want BBB/BBC. You need to take subjects you will achieve high grades in. Check the subject requirements at a range of unis. Most want a single science (that can be psychology), but there are exceptions who have greater science requirements.

Bio/Chem/Maths or Bio/chem/Psych is going to keep most medical science and psych options open, however wouldn't be much good for history.

Two of Bio/Maths/Chem/Psych + Hist would leave both some sciences and history open but it would be a broad and challenging mix.
I know I am a bit like a broken record about this, but you need to think both about subject choices and what is likely to lead to high grades.

& sorry for the terrible typos - it is.early & wont let me edit now.

Hist + Psych or Bio + one other, will leave open most history and psychology degrees. If you take a second humanity/essay based subject this would arguably be better preparation for a history degree. However, it will limit the medical science options. No selection will be perfect for all the possible degrees.

Biology Chemistry and History would keep medical science and history open. History plus 2 STEM a levels would keep many science degrees open without closing off History as an option. Physcology, Geography and similar subjects can count as science A levels but it varies by institution and degree subject.

History for someone who doesn't like extended writing may not be the best choice. It also has NEA which may or may not appeal.

She could add an EPQ or core maths to add breadth.

As others have said Psychology is the 2nd most popular A Lesson; certainly not rare.

I would also agree that if extended writing isn't a strong point or enjoyed then history at a level or degree level doesn't seem a good fit.

I'm not up to date with uni requirements.

My gut says Chemistry, Biology, History. Maybe with an EPQ on something Psychology related?

Chemistry is the 'core' science. I can't belive you need Psychology A level even to do it at uni?

A few schools around us suggest strongly that students take maths when taking chemistry. We pushed our daughter into maths because she was taking chemistry, she hasn’t thanked us at all!!! When I did biochem at uni, I had to take a maths core option because I hadn’t taken maths alevel.

This is a good choice. You don’t need any psychology before undergraduate (and I think the A level is so turgid it actually turns a lot of people off). I wouldn’t recommend maths A level unless you’re shit hot at maths - at least an 8 or a 9 if you’re aiming for top grades at A level.

Depending on what she wants to do, focus on the subjects where she’ll likely get great grades because often aptitude is more important than the subject, especially if it’s a subject that isn’t always taught at A level. For example, if she wanted to do politics, A levels in English, history, and economics would be good.

Psychology is the second most common A Level.
No you don't need it for a Psychology degree but almost everyone will have taken it, and if you think that's where you interest is why would you not take it?
Psychology is a highly popular degree, keeping entry requirements high - and then turning out vast numbers of graduates.
It is not unusual for students to offer Psych and Bio/Chem plus History which does keep a number of routes open.