Harvard update: international students

[poetryandwine]

The Trump administration has today revoked Harvard’s right to enrol international students. I have no words to describe this outrage.

I am sure Harvard will prevail ultimately. However, loathe as I am to say it, I would not consider accepting Harvard as an international student until this situation is resolved. Implications for enrolment in Autumn 2026 are presently unclear, as the American application cycle is rather early.

Not speaking from personal knowledge of Oxbridge investments here, but some endowments may well be directed, eg for specific subject areas or buildings. Others may be tied up in long term investments.

Separately, for a lot of post grads, there may not be a direct crossover of spaces eg not an MA or MSc in the particular branch of science or history you picked at Harvard.

Thirdly, some of the endowments are with colleges, not departments.

Fourthly, a shitstorm is coming for the UK University sector and courses and departments here are closing. If oxbridge is going to take on students from other places to be supportive, it might want to hold fire for this.

Yes of course @Flyswats - I was being a tad facetious. But with Trump these things generally ARE personal.

The most recent episode of the Pod Save America podcast discusses this action against Harvard, and cautions listeners not to see it as just against Harvard - Trump & his posse are in opposition to liberal values generally. Harvard is just the start - well, the next big step, actually. They've already gone for cancellation of most, if not all, NEH grants, as well as a lot of science grants.

I imagine De Tocqueville is pointing and telling us "I told you so."

@ParmaVioletTea I think it’s not unreasonable to say students cannot bring their families though. We’ve needed to close this loophole. Hopefully this calms down fairly quickly. I’ve no issue with study visas for individuals.

I’m of the opinion that it would understandable if UK universities rejected the students who find themselves victims of this decision by saying,
“you rejected us first time round and there’s nothing we can do to help you.”

But I’m so glad my loved one decided against Harvard as an international student this year and went for the UK instead.

The decision seems to go against Trumps business ideals. Having the very top international students making friends with US students and receiving a US education is planting seeds that will benefit the US in years to come. These international students will go on to become leaders in whatever career field they enter but will already have networking connections made years prior in the US. It just seems like a short sighted decision.

Obama’s daughter Malia attended Harvard and Trump’s son was rejected .
This is probably the root of Trump’s anger
If Barron was given a place at Harvard I honestly don’t believe that Trump would have taken this action . The man is a menace
and is obsessed with the Obamas

An Oxbridge academic would know more but yes, @SheilaFentiman , much or most of any university’s endowment is restricted. Most of the Oxbridge wealth has accrued to the Colleges.

@Weepixie I am also glad your YP elected to stay here, but I think the UK loses out if we don’t offer to help British students in this fix now. Choosing to attend Harvard was understandable and reasonable, and the larger point is that these students, who are mostly British citizens, are amongst our best and brightest. Why would we alienate them?

@TeenagersAngst your post seems to imply that you think the university is partly to blame for Trump’s actions, and/or that those actions were justified.

Lol funny that now everyone, even those who were previously unaware or uninterested now knows Barron was rejected from Harvard. I do feel a bit sorry for him but he'll fall on his feet well enough undeservedly probably.

No. These are the facts. Harvard is within its rights to act as it pleases. Colombia has chosen a different path.

I was merely adding information around the context of this latest escalation.

I do however think Harvard should get its own house in order. https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c0eljwdp545o.amp

Yes, but there is always some flexibility with endowments. Not all of it will be specifically earmarked or ring fenced. Granted, I'm could be talking absolute garbage, but I'm a trustee of an endowed foundation and we do have some flexibility, and my husband is on the board of a very highly-endowed US university and they definitely have the ability to direct more towards initiatives to fund students. The annual interest alone on these endowments is enormous - Harvard periodically talks about eradicating tuition altogether as it's such a small drop in the bucket to them.

Thirdly, some of the endowments are with colleges, not departments.

When my DC went to one of the Oxbridge unis, the acceptances were done by the colleges in conjunction with the departments, so I would assume the individual colleges are also involved in the decisions around which students are receiving funding?

They could create something like the pool system for these students. I'm not saying Oxbridge can or should step in and offer a lifeline to every one. But it seems to me they could be creative and try to make room for some. It would be so beneficial to the country.

@TeenagersAngst I know this is nitpicky, and it's probably autocorrect, but the university is Columbia.

Yes, there are issues, but somehow, considering the anti-semitic, anti-muslim, anti-woman, anti-equality slant of this administration I somehow doubt their motives here.

Columbia played ball and still lost $400 million in federal funding, which it's now caving even more to try to get back

Harvard understands that fighting back is the best way to get Trump to back down. See also: Mark Carney.

Harvard ‘should get its house in order’……..& it justifies Trump’s actions?

Two separate posts, two separate points.

Good spot, thanks. I think it was probably me getting it wrong

That is unreasonable. A PhD takes a minimum of 4 years. Should a PhD student be forcibly separated from his or her spouse & children for that length of time? I don't think so.

Agree. “Closing the loophole” simply means that such international students will look elsewhere if other countries allow families to accompany.

I think people think international students bringing family members is somehow a drain on the taxpayer. But to get the visa they have to have in hand already the funds to support them all for the year, for a family of 3 that's 15000 pounds. They can't claim benefits and have to pay an NHS surcharge. And international tuition can be 25-30K for postgraduate.
That's a lot of money coming into the country and UK unis will gladly take it, even good programmes have not closed MA admissions yet because trying to get as many students as possible in current climate.

The USA has strict visa regulations not rights. We are the same now and surely that’s ok?

Here is an example (from 2023 so may have changed) that implies US PhD students on an F1 visa can bring a spouse and children on dependents’ visas:

https://gradarticles.smu.edu/advancing-the-field/coming-to-smu-with-a-family-4-resources-to-help-international-students-with-your-transition?hs_amp=true

I think people are getting muddled here. The UK put a freeze on visas for people wanting to bring their extended families to the UK while also seeking to study.

The US recent activity putting a halt to International visas is quite different. Trump is seeking to punish specific groups, both students and institutions. His focus was on getting hold of and scrutinizing all of the paperwork for each student visa application alongside any arrest records for protests around Israel or other issues.

He is trying to punish and ruin Harvard. That is where his focus lies, for the most part.

He is also setting himself up as the man who lets no one thru US doors unless invited - hence the start of Afrikaaners getting a fast track refugee status on the basis of "genocide" within their own country.

All of it insane, of course, but absolutely not the same as what happened with VISAS in the UK.