Harvard update: international students

[poetryandwine]

The Trump administration has today revoked Harvard’s right to enrol international students. I have no words to describe this outrage.

I am sure Harvard will prevail ultimately. However, loathe as I am to say it, I would not consider accepting Harvard as an international student until this situation is resolved. Implications for enrolment in Autumn 2026 are presently unclear, as the American application cycle is rather early.

Should be interesting. The Supreme Court, of which 3 or 4 are Harvard alumni, will no doubt be called upon to make a ruling.

I live in London but do consume a lot of US media, although never Fox, so I can't report on that. Most of what I consume is either aghast or pretty factual - i.e. the New York Times, while side-eyeing the illegality, is falling over itself to essentially report on it as though they are remaining neutral in a political dispute. In general, I think mainstream media is failing to rise to the challenge of reporting this moment. They seem a bit determined to behave as though this is business as usual, a difference in political opinion. But I agree that every day there's something new and worse to report on.

*Harvard just got a temporary restraining order to stop the edict, so we'll see how it goes.

NYTimes has the best coverage. A Boston judge has blocked the order.

Well, yes, but we al know these are amongst the world’s top students and suddenly they are intellectually marooned, until this is resolved.

(Granted the ban has been stayed, we have many examples where the Trump administration has refused to act until the Supreme Court has issued judgment, and even then been dilatory. So I don’t think we know what will happen.)

Current UGs wishing to transfer to British universities for Autumn 2025 do so on an ad hoc basis, so there isn’t much concept of fairness, usually. The large majority of Harvard students are very successful there, with an A- average, so we are likely to be happy with them. I suppose if there is a huge amount of interest procedures will need to be developed.

Students part way through a two year Masters will probably stay in America and there are many excellent programmes that can absorb them. Medical and law students, ditto, for curricular alignment. Doctoral students may be in a real fix, sadly.

One hopes that the small number of British and Overseas students who may have accepted Harvard and declined their UCAS choices for this Autumn will be permitted to revisit UCAS and make Firm and Insurance choices from their offers. I should think that British universities would be happy with this arrangement, though it depends on my assumption that numbers are small.

Why is this not fair, and why would we not be enthusiastic as a country with Harvard transfers broadly speaking?

Of course UK universities should be welcoming, my point is that what universities will be able offer won’t come close to the (hard to get) Harvard packages for the students affected. Eg big scholarships, Oxbridge places.

@ghostedtulip as you say awful, friend's DD can't go through clearing as her's was a PhD place - she already has an undergraduate and Masters from top British Unis.

The Harvard offer is very generous - and PhD studentships in the UK in her field are terribly hard to come by. She turned down other PhD scholarships elsewhere in the US.

The good news is there is this stay and the court case is slated for next week so fingers crossed there will be better news soon...

I guess this could provide an opportunity for UK universities. Who'd want to go and study in the States now?

Yes, of course. The situation is still shit

Thank you for your reply.

It’s generally as I expected - the side-eyeing and downplaying. If I’m generous, maybe they’re all scared of the bully too.

I find it like a bizarre pantomime: the villain is so obviously villainous with everyone shouting “he’s a joke! He’s behind you!”, and those on stage acting like it’s all totally fine and not a massive horrorshow that nobody can have imagined 10/15/etc years ago.

@poetryandwine Surely the big question is which universities. Surely our elite ones are full? Has anyone any idea about numbers? I agree with you about Supreme Court. Trump ignores lesser courts.

Most overseas students are on Masters not undergrad - and even Ox and Cam would still consider disgruntled Harvard acceptees. Any UGs would not be likely to come to the UK, although a few may of course. Canada and Aus would be decent alternative destinations though for them and timing may work, esp for those that switch to Aus.

The damage is probably done for next years Harvard hopefuls though. Surely they’ll now target Oxford, Imperial, McGill etc.

I can’t remember where I read it but three necessary requirements to become a dictatorship: take charge of your universities, take charge of your media, take charge of your judiciary. He’s almost there…

Let's hope that the huge endowments of US private universities, such as Harvard, carry them through until the mid-terms.

It’s an escalation in the existing row between Donald Trump and Harvard following the student protests last year. He’d already withdrawn funding over a perceived lack of action on Harvard’s part against anti-semitism on campus. Interestingly, Colombia were put in a similar position but they agreed to work with the Trump administration rather than dig their heels in as Harvard has done.

I agree the elite universities are likely full. It is a question of numbers. The COWI institutions could each absorb 3-4 Y2 and Y3 STEM students (on four year programmes). Oxbridge do not accept transfers but if ever there was a time for flexibility, thus is it.

I feel sure the numbers could work similarly in other disciplines. I don’t know how many British students are at Harvard, or how many International ones would like to come to the UK

I do think those who have accepted Harvard for Autumn 2025 should be permitted to revisit UCAS. Numbers will be small and given the quality of the students everyone wins

The case of Princess Elisabeth might be uncomfortable for President Trump. He loves to flatter royalty, and you just know that if she were a member of the British Royal Family an exemption for her would be found. OTOH he hates the EU, so who knows?

Is it known that she is on a student visa? Her country might change her to an A1 visa (Head of State visa), for close relatives of an HoS. Again , a judgment call by both countries.

Ordinarily I dislike royal privilege but I support anything that will get a student through this crisis

If you believe the rumours, Barron Trump was rejected by Harvard, despite his father’s strenuous efforts to get him in. So there’s that.

Meanwhile, I think Harvard are in an impossible situation, whatever the courts rule. My DS recently spent an exchange year at a top US uni and the paperwork was exhausting. However, once he had the relevant acceptance documentation from his US university, he had to apply for his electronic SEVIS (student and exchange visitor information system) certification which is run by ICE and overseen by the Department for Homeland Security. Without it he couldn’t enter the US. This is what Trump has control over and I heard on CNN last night that SEVIS are about to blackball Harvard, if they haven’t done so already.

SEVIS is going to be a threat Trump can hang over the heads of any university he disagrees with.

I don't think Princess Elisabeth will be able to switch to an A1 visa as they usually require you to be in the US on diplomatic business.

Hopefully UK unis get to pick up some more international students. If they have any sense (which is unfortunately not a given) they will begin recruitment drives with this in mind.

I am at a uni that has recently fallen out of the top 100 unis worldwide, which has a huge impact on finances. If Harvard and other USA based unis struggle with attracting international students after this, regardless of whether it gets overturned, then maybe it will help. Hopefully the government see this as an opportunity to increase rather than reduce student visas. I've never understood why students wanting to come to the UK and spend 3 times a UK student on the same provision is a problem.

I know that is true for diplomats, but the HoS does all their travel on an A-1. So the question is whether this would extend to the Crown Princess?

I have heard rumours that Prince Harry may have gone to America on an A-1. I couldn’t care less, and obviously he had multiple pathways available

If you believe the rumours, Barron Trump was rejected by Harvard, despite his father’s strenuous efforts to get him in. So there’s that.

Bingo! I surmised this in another thread on this topic (over in the University staff discussion room). Maggie Thatcher imposed the RAE on universities after Oxford vetoed an honorary degree for her. I know contiguity is not causality, but still ... it is a juicy hypothesis.

Hopefully UK unis get to pick up some more international students. If they have any sense (which is unfortunately not a given) they will begin recruitment drives with this in mind.

This isn't always in any individual university's powers. The bonkers Home Office attitude which regards international students as migrants is the sticking point here.

Kudos to @ParmaVioletTea and @Cafeconleche This would explain a lot.

I work at Oxbridge. I think there is a willingness to help students displaced by this, but the challenges are:
1 for postgrad students; their funding will be held by Harvard and probably can’t be transferred. Universities have no money at the moment so there’s no replacement funding available unless the government or a donor offers it.
2 for undergrads; there’s no system of transfers or credits (in or out) so it’s not possible to recognise any study completed so far. So potentially a student who has completed two years at Harvard would have to start again in the first year. Likewise, if a student did a year at Oxbridge and then wanted to return to Harvard, it’s not possible to issue a statement of credits.

But their combined endowments are in the billions (20b or so?). Surely, they could redirect investments towards funding students? As should a lot of American universities, by the way.

By 'their' I mean Oxford and Cambridge, specifically, not UK unis as a whole

I am glad the willingness is there.

But I have very occasionally helped students to do at least de facto transfers from Oxbridge. Perhaps in principle they terminated Oxbridge and we allowed them to start in Y2, but that is what it amounted to.

I agree there's absolutely some element of vendetta against Harvard for not taking Barron. But it is also a direct attack on liberalism generally and I think by making an example of the most prestigious (or most competitive to get into) college in the US, that T is using that bullying method of saying "look, if I can intimidate the BEST place we have, then I can intimidate all the rest".

Which obviously is horrendous, like every other recent policy or attempted policy.