Industrial placements

[BlueskyBluesea]

How are your DC getting on with arranging these? It seems like every placement is so competitive and really it is very lucky if a student is able to organise a placement that is relevant to their degree. Or do you have a son or daughter that found and completed a placement ....any advice gratefully appreciated ☺️

Is he yr13? Has he looked at apprenticeships? Lots of accountancy firms offer school leaver apprenticeships. Some are level 7 (so masters level) but some are level 4/5, which if he’s not Uber academic maybe a better option for him. The former are highly competitive and ppl applying are usually on track for As at A level and have university as a back up plan. If he is fairly academic then there’s also Flying Start degree which is offered by PwC, which is a 4 yr degree offering full time university with work experience at the big4 firm (PwC). There’s threads on these btw. I don’t want to derail this one if your son is yr13 rather than a uni student looking for a year in industry during their degree.

Yes, I'd agree. My DD did an MEng, the vacation internships allowed her to try out a couple of different types of company, one big blue chip, one small consultancy. Both were very good experience, but I'm not sure she'd have benefited from a year in either - first one she probably wouldn't have enjoyed for much longer than she did, the second one yielded a job offer which she's thriving in, and obviously doing more advanced and interesting work than she might have been able to before having done the whole degree.

They may need to do quite a lot of applications for these internships too of course, especially in the first summer.

@BlueskyBluesea which industry is your DC looking at? Have they found many to apply to? DD says that hers are scattered across a fair few websites so they aren’t all advertised in one place.

@NotDonna It was my sister's business she did the work for which did help when it came to interview stage.
The best advice I can give is to say keep going with applications and the stages you need to go through. Each business has their own type of person they're after and don't be disheartened if you don't get through the personality profiling stage.
She is enjoying the placement and is getting involved in other parts of the business as and where she can.

Thank you @OrangeBlossom28 i think it’s quite fortunate that DD’s older sister is on an apprenticeship and witnessed her applying for those, the stages involved and the rejections so is relatively realistic about the process. Is your DD hoping for a grad position there? Is she preferring HR? My DD is interested in the ‘business’ side of business management more than anything. She’s worked in hospitality previously and currently works part time in retail sales so hopefully she’ll be able to reflect on situations etc. 🤞🏼

@NotDonna they are doing chemistry so for something relevant for a masters, positions seem a bit more limited and a bit further from home...if they choose to change to BSc then more options open ...so far the rough plan seems to be apply to a mix of both and keep fingers xed.

@BlueskyBluesea ahh yes, I think science research placements are probably nowhere near as prolific as finance/business ones. DD has applied to around 20 that she’d be thrilled to do. She doesn’t want to apply to more as it’ll dilute her ability to impress / do her research etc. If she’s unsuccessful then she’ll stay at uni for 3rd year. Apparently the summer interns are advertised simultaneously to placements so by the time she knows she’s not got a placement it looks like summer intern opps will have gone unfortunately. But she can see. Fingers crossed for placements!

Maybe think about why positions are limited!

DH and I are both PhD chemists, and neither of us can really see the point of 'year in industry' type placements versus summer vac internships and just getting on with the degree. There's likely a limited number of projects they could safely or usefully give to an undergrad who hasn't yet completed the content and done their final year research projects. If you're wanting to be a higher flying scientist then you'll be thinking about doing a PhD - that already takes plenty long enough especially now so many places expect you to do a masters first rather than going straight on from a BSc as we were able to do back in the dark ages.

DH's company rarely offered any sort of internship. Mine does - 6months or a year but they're nearly all for people who have just finished their PhDs, not students a couple of years into their first degree.

I have done multiple years of interviewing YII students and I was one myself years ago.

These are so invaluable and amazing, happy to
help answer any questions 🥰

I am FMCG / chemistry background too!

@Fisharenotfoods thank you, I'll definitely take you up on offer of advice ...so far it's a waiting game to see if the first step of the first few applications have been successful and if there is progression to step two🤞

My DD is in her final year at Bath after a year in industry. As so many do placements at Bath, I think the students tend to persevere for longer with their applications because they won't be keeping their 2nd year house arrangements for final year. Many students don't secure their placement until spring and some of them are securing placements a month before they begin.

It's stressful and unnerving but if they're determined, they have to keep applying throughout the year.

I think students embarking on a course with a placement for a year often do not realise how much effort they need to put in. Unis say their students go off to X,Y,Z employers but don’t say these placements are competitive. I’m firmly of the opinion some dc don’t need them at all. A BEng with a year out making it for 4 years has dubious benefits. A 4 year MEng is better, gets the student further down the qualification route and is cheaper than a stand alone MEng.

I think students who have relatives offering work are very lucky and privileged. Ones who have had to apply to many employers and prove themselves should state this on their cvs. They have not had the benefit of privilege and have had to do more to get the experience.

@NotDonna thsnk you got the info on apprenticeships. He is really rather sold on the idea of going to university - he wants the whole experience of being away with a group of people, meeting lots of different people and making friends and studying for something that will help his career. He also loves his sports. He’s not really into heavy drinking /partying (yet?). The uni experience gets a bad rep on Mumsnet, but I think it’s great for all these things + learning to live as an adult in a semi supported environment. We’ll see if he gets good grades. Either way, it’s really motivating him.

Degree apprenticeships are hard to get. Most go to existing employees. Uni is way easier to get.

This isn’t the case for our large company. You need a degree to have a job in our sector (it’s a basic requirement for entry level). We take 18 year old straight from Alevels into our degree apprenticeships. Most science base companies are the same from my experience.

@Fisharenotfoods Currently government stats show less than 10,000 18 year olds starting degree apprenticeships each year. 350,000 start uni degrees. A few years ago it wasn’t even 4,000. What individual firms do isn’t remotely the national picture. That’s why they are ludicrously competitive and need multiple applications. The apprenticeships below degree level are easier to get and more dc get them. However it then takes many years to get a degree.

The uni experience gets a bad rep on Mumsnet

Does it? I think most I hear about (and mine) had the sort of positive experience your DS is hoping for (even though DDs included 2020/21 which obviously weren't typical years)

As a Mum who's son; has absolutely smashed a post graduation job
my advice is scrubbing up well, confident and well spoken. Not privately educated!

He has had an amazing 2 years in London and Vancouver! Confidence/ without being an arrogant twat / dick really helps.

A lot of companies that offer a year out in industry will have already started recruiting for 2025 intake.
The careers service should have information about companies who offer industrial placements and when they start recruiting, worth asking there.

I wandered in to this thread out of curiosity as I couldn't see why a parent would be concerned about placement as it's all organised by the placement department in the university I work at in Ireland. Am i correct in thinking that the universities don't organise placement in the UK? Are students required to do placement or is it an optional extra?

I would say though, with the caveat that I have very little knowledge of the UK systems, that placement is brilliant for post-graduation jobs. Loads of our students are offered graduate positions by the company they do placement with. Some are even paid a retainer for the final year of uni to ensure they take the graduate position.

I get the impression that students arrange their own but the uni will help if they are struggling. It varies both by course and uni. The company I worked for took 100s of placement students each year and they applied directly to us, nothing at all to do with their university. But I do know someone who was a placement tutor and they had direct relationships with some placement providers.

Totally agree about placements helping with employment opportunities afterwards, whether with the company they did the placement with or elsewhere. I also read that students who had a year out also achieve higher degrees (I suspect because of the discipline they adopt after working for a year)

I'm not surprised that there is data showing they do better. I notice a massive difference in maturity and work ethic in my final year students compared to them pre-placement.

@ErrolTheDragon Really pleased your DC had a great experience, especially in spite of Covid years. I notice a few anti-uni-experience comments. Usually related to lofs of partying and how going straight into work can suit some better. It’s what made me want to clarify that my DS isn’t just looking for night life 😁

@vegaspot very interested to hear about your DS. What did he do for his placements? Vancouver sounds an incredible opportunity - I travelled there eons ago and loved it.

That’s good advice for life: scrub up well, be confident but not arrogant. I hope he really enjoys his grad position.

@TizerorFizz our scheme is very competitive as are all the ones I know. What I was saying was commenting “most go employees” isn’t true for my sector and the three very large FTSE 100 companies I have worked in.

I wasn’t disputing how many are available etc. we take 4 apprenticeships vs 50 YII.