Missed Durham offer - is it worth calling?

[RightWhoWantsABoiledEgg]

DD had a deferred offer at Durham for English. Offer was AA plus A star in English. Results were AAB, but importantly, she didnt get an A star in English Lit and Durham offer was lost.

There were reasons for this slightly lower performance (although not the B and we may ask for a remark). She was poorly for 2/3 of the exams for one subject (GP visit and medication confirms this) - had an A star for the first paper and As for the ones where she was poorly. Special consideration was meant to be requested, but don’t know if it was done.

More importantly, for English, there was an issue with the biggest mark question on one of the papers. The school does a very unusual combination of books, that very few schools opt for, for the comparative paper. In the exam, the big mark question had no relevant theme to compare the books by. All students were confused and said they’d had to wing it. School never reached out about it. Either the school messed up and missed a theme, or the exam board messed up in failing to ensure a theme that was relevant to this combination was included. An A in these circumstances seems pretty decent.

This is by way of asking if it is worth her calling Durham up to discuss and explain? Will they even entertain excuses and discuss a deferred offer? As the school hasn’t ever addressed the question issue (it is a very high performing grammar school so may not want to appear lacking), should she approach the school first to ascertain if they would support what she is saying about the problem with the question?

She worked so hard and feels like she has failed. She could resit and is considering this, but would Durham even consider her next year as she has failed to meet their standard once already?

Personally I would go with your own view of Durham, not those on an anonymous website. It’s like Oxbridge - everyone has a story about a person who struggles and the college/university didn’t help.
This summer I have heard some shocking stories about 2 Russell Group universities and the extensive drug use/poor behaviour especially among ex private school kids. Do I think that’s indicative of everyone’s experience? Of course not. (Not naming for that reason)

OP - I would indeed phone and find out more. Good luck to your DD on her gap year. FWIW the Bailey colleges tend to be smaller and more nurturing only because they’re a bit of a goldfish bowl.

That sounds like an eating disorder if she's not eating enough calories. She will also have to cook and eat in front of people if she's living in student dorms or a shared house.

@RightWhoWantsABoiledEgg

Although it's a long way down the line, it's worth considering an MA like the one at UCL once she has her first degree under her belt.

www.ucl.ac.uk/prospective-students/graduate/taught-degrees/publishing-ma

She might like to come to the London Book Fair in March of next year, it will be a chance to meet publishers and chat to them about their work.

www.londonbookfair.co.uk/en-gb.html

Most universities will have a deadline by which you needed to have informed them of any mitigating circumstances they might have needed to consider when assessing your results, and won’t consider anything submitted after this in the interests of fairness unless there is an excellent reason you missed the deadline - from what you’ve said that doesn’t seem to be the case.

If you feel you need to contact them and ask the question, then there’s no harm, but please do so with realistic expectations, and don’t do it if a second piece of bad news would be harmful to her.

Also if you’re saying she can’t talk about her grades without getting teary, this is an excellent reason she should NOT resit - because what happens if she doesn’t do better? The focus should be on acceptance and resilience rather than re do. This time of life is often very difficult for exceptional students as it’s the first time they stumble, but learning to accept you don’t need the A star every time, and that there are many paths to the same place is indescribably valuable.

Berryberries, she isn’t concerned about eating in front of people, but more around the possibility of being sick in public. One counsellor called it an eating disorder (others haven’t) and this was really unhelpful, as she seemed to treat it as a badge of honour and also, something she had no control over. I was pleased when the new counsellor said it wasn’t an eating disorder tbh. This started as a reaction to bullying and was reinforced by covid lockdown.

@RightWhoWantsABoiledEgg

That would be touching on emetophobia, I think, OP.

https://www.oxfordhealth.nhs.uk/ohspic/problems/emetophobia/

I work in HE and really wish we could adopt the European system of applying once you’ve got your results, it would save so much palaver.

Seconded!!

A lot of biases/prejudices against Durham rearing their heads on this thread.

Yes, it has its fair share of arrogant, entitled, privately educated t0ssers, as do Exeter, Bristol, Edinburgh etc etc.

However, unless your DC actively wants to hang around with those groups, they're very easy to ignore - you find your tribe, as people say.

A plus for Durham is its collegiate system - usually makes it easier to make friends in 1st year, and you gain a sense of "family" that you retain for all 3/4 years and beyond.

A minus for Durham is that their admissions team will very, very unlikely shift on their position once you've been rejected

Durham is very difficult to get into - when my DD was applying they wanted higher grades than Oxford. On the Open Day there were lots of public school families trying to get places after a year of resits.

Hello @RightWhoWantsABoiledEgg Would she consider going this year? Durham have let people in this year with lower grades than hers but not for deferred entry. The other thing I would do is get written confirmation from the school that they applied for special consideration for her. Good luck!

Ex Head of Sixth Form here. If entry was only for 2025 time is on your side. So no need for a rush decision.
I would contact the Head of English, or your daughter's English teacher initially, possibly copying in Head of Sixth, to ascertain their take on it.
If it is the exam board's issue with the question setting then the teachers will be contacting the exam board and fighting it.

Also was the special consideration applied for? The paperwork will show this. To be honest, it probably won't have made any difference but it might give you more insight.

If it is a school mistake, exam boards are usually reasonably sympathetic if the school own up but it does depend on circumstances.

I'd email requesting an appointment at school to discuss next steps. If you are ignored ( hope not), politely contact someone else at the school.

Your daughter should 'sit' with all the information and take a few days to think. She does not need to make a decision about Durham immediately, sort out the English grade issue first.The unis will be flat out with 2024 entries. As an aside, legally the result is your daughter's. Some schools will be reluctant to discuss this with you unless your daughter gives written permission.

I'm sorry this has happened but, sometimes, this sort of thing helps individual students see how resilient, wise and mature they can be, particularly when they have support.

Apologies if any repetition, I haven't read the whole thread as a bit busy but felt for you both.

If she ends up taking a year out, I wonder if it would be interesting or helpful for her to do some creative writing courses as a confidence booster and as something that might feed her future career plans. There's loads out there from local evening classes, to ones run by publishers such as the Faber Academy, or well-established places like the Arvon Foundation. Some courses seem to do discounts for 18-25s as well. Studying and writing purely for the joy of doing it might also balance things out a bit after A levels grades/stars-chasing. Just a thought.

I've namechanged here I think it's very hard to get special consideration.

DD had glandular fever during the exams. However because she had huge lumps on her lymph nodes and some other strange symptoms they also had to do a whole raft of tests to rule out Hodgkinson's Lymphoma - basically these were being done in between exams. She somehow managed to sit them all but was so tired in between not a lot of revision was getting done as she was just sleeping.

School applied for special consideration with a pile of doctors notes and it wasn't granted in any subject. Luckily she did get the results she needed for her offer but was below predicted grades in all her subjects (predicted A*, AA but got ABB)

Was the subject that got moderated down on coursework by any chance history?

History course work marked down History course work marked down

My son had a year out after A levels
It was the best decision, I felt him buckling under the pressure of education system and I wanted to allow him some time & space to grow.
He has worked in a pub, taken driving
lessons ( not passed yet 😆😆 but it doesn't matter ) enjoyed his guitar took a next level and passed, cooked family meals once a week and spent his money on a trip to Europe on his own. Visited mates who had gone to uni having mixed experiences themselves away from home good and bad.

He is now a different person and so much more confident, he admits this himself.
He can't wait to start uni in Newcastle this September and I feel he is ready and that it's been his choose route rather than one mapped out for him

I you want my advice give your daughter some time away from the stress of education she needs to recover and be a young adult who can relax and enjoy life.

I think navigating university life needs a level of maturity and perspective that a year of growing can equip a young person with.

I don't believe it's easiest world to navigate straight from school and family home
And it's expensive if they fail at it
Emotionally and financially

Good luck

Definitely request a remark... I did this and went up a grade in two subjects. Secondly, call the university to tell them you are doing this and ask if they will hold her place in the meantime. I did actually miss one mark in the end, and was still allowed to join my course of choice at an excellent university. Resitting would be a last resort in my opinion as she already has fantastic grades. She has a year to reapply to other unis with guaranteed results. Also please don't forget to smother her in love and tell her how proud you are. My parents did not handle it well and i have never forgotten how they made me feel.

It's worth a try but I don't think you'll get anywhere with Durham.
I think she should take the RHBNC place and have a stress free gap year working on her eating issues and just doing stuff that makes her happy.
Worrying about resits and getting in to Durham doesn't sound like the best idea.

Durham is closed for clearing so contacting them might not be of any benefit, might just make the situation more stressful.

I am another one who was concerned about the terrible culture at Durham. My daughter looked at it for English and so pleased she did not apply. My DS has a few friends at Durham and they are not part of the upper class clique, some of things they have told him are awful.

To be clear, we are enormously proud of DD and have made that very clear to her. I know she will deal with the disappointment in time, but it’s hard to see her upset now and therefore supporting her in how she wants to deal with it.

With the special consideration, I’m not thinking that’s going to change her grade. I know it has very little impact on outcomes, it’s more about knowing the school did what they said they would do, as I can’t see anything on the results sheet that indicates this has happened.

The coursework downgrade was across alo English Literature students at her school, so it has had an impact of the A rather than A star outcome. Apparently school is asking for a rationale for this, but if anyone can outline the detail of the moderation process, it would help to understand what has happened.

I’m sorry your dd was disappointed - A levels are brutal! Unfortunately English is a very popular course with a standard offer of a star aa so whilst she has amazing grades she missed by a few. That said there’s no harm in speaking to the Uni and as she’s not looking for admission this year time is on your side. It would probably be unlikely however that they would offer for English with those grades - that said there are other courses which offer AAB if it’s Durham she wants.

Sadly this thread is trotting out the standard negative Durham rhetoric but your dd knows best if she feels it is the right place for her. My dd thought she’d hate Durham - we only went to the open day as it was the day before the York one but she knew from the moment we got to the city that it was the right place for her. Dd is from a state school and has had no issues. She is in a Bailey college which anecdotally have higher number of students from boarding schools as they are happier with the concept of sharing. DD’s experience has been wholly positive at Durham - yes there have been problems and Durham have again withdrawn 3 offers this year for classist, ableist and sexist behaviour on WhatsApp groups but I don’t think this is a Durham only problem. The university is working very hard to encourage a more diverse student body. Support both within college and also the department has also been outstanding and I don’t recognise some of the comments made in this thread.

OP if your dd feels that Durham is right for her then she should trust that feeling.

Thank you Kitty. That’s really helpful. She may be a bit shocked by some of the more boisterous ‘rugby/PS’ set behaviour (all girls grammar school for the last 7 years, so no real experience of this), but is generally content to plough her own furrow and may, therefore be fine outside of such groups.

English Lit is more important than Durham, but that combination is the ideal I think. If she had to drop one, it would be Durham, as there is no other course she wants to study. However, everything that she has done for the last 2 years says that she is good enough to get into Durham for English Lit, which is why she’s holding on to the dream I guess.

I second what KittyMcKitty says about Durham.

I absolutely wouldn't phone however. Your DD is far better off writing a persuasive email and making sure she directs it to the correct person (very easy to find/ work out the direct email address by looking at the departmental website). Durham has a very set formula for working out who to accept/ reject after near misses and if they've already said no then a phone call to the first filter in the department is highly likely to elicit a repetition of that no (possibly terse possibly not - a definite risk that it could be horrible for your DD though. An oral no would also block the way to writing subsequently). If she's good with language then writing as short an email as possible setting out her stall might just tip the scales back in her favour - one would hope that at least she'd get a reasoned response and a pointer for what to do next. It's a case for a very carefully crafted email imo. It could be a relatively cathartic exercise if nothing else.

This is a great suggestion. Thank you so much. I think this would also mean she could be sure to say everything she wants to say, rather than possible forgetting something in a live call. I realise there’s little chance of them changing their decision, particularly for a deferral, but at least she’ll know she gave it a go.