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Higher education

Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

Original poster

A* EPQ and clearing

26 replies

marmitewrap · 13/08/2024 08:43

Starting to panic for DD now that we're only two days away from results. DD has had a very very tough few years health wise, and has received contextual offers at both her firm and insurance choices. Also dyslexic.

She worked so hard on her EPQ and came up with a quirky subject area and was awarded 46/50 which I believe is an A*. EPQ format worked well for dyslexic DD rather than traditional exams.

My question is, do you think this A* might help her still receive a place at her chosen Unis if she drops a grade (given the fact that she already has contextual offers)? Unfortunately she chose a couple of notoriously difficult A'levels which aren't doing her any favours and they are also unrelated to proposed degree subject. One A'level is related of course. Her current Uni offers don't include the EPQ as part of the offer.

Would welcome any wise words. She really really wants her firm choice.

OP posts:
PettsWoodParadise · 13/08/2024 09:02

OP your DD sounds like she is a fighter and wishing her all the best.

An EPQ can sometimes be part of the mix. Every university will be different. DD did an EPQ and got a reduced offer from one of the five Unis she was offering in the end she just enjoyed doing it and got the grades needed so didn't 'need' the EPQ however it has helped her hit the ground running at Uni with the skills she had to use for the EPQ. A friend who also did an EPQ who didn't even meet her insurance did get an offer, others didn't get in on the same grade, but it wasn't explicity said that the EPQ was the reason they let her 'through' so it is hard to say for certain. I suspect this will often be the case. Hopefully there are some admissions people on here who can say.

redskydarknight · 13/08/2024 09:31

Some universities typically give a grade lower offer if the student has an A* EPQ. So, if the universities she's applied for do this, it will already be factored into her offer.

Ceit · 13/08/2024 09:37

An excellent EPQ grade will definitely help and she should be prepared to talk about it enthusiastically over the phone if she does end up in Clearing. She won't officially know for sure if she has an A* until results are out, as both moderation and shifting grade boundaries can make a difference, but she's obviously done really well with it and it shows she has skills necessary for HE.

mm81736 · 13/08/2024 09:41

Most university courses are recruiting not selecting and just glad od bums on seats.
RG and other 'elite' unis like Bath requirements like AAA are less likely to drop much and also STEM courses where a previous knowledge is built upon for example maths has prerequisite skills where as history doesn't

mm81736 · 13/08/2024 09:42

The trouble is epq is not done under exam conditions and could be anybody's work

LIZS · 13/08/2024 09:47

Was it related to the subject she hopes to study? If so it may be relevant.

Original poster
marmitewrap · 13/08/2024 09:54

@LIZS yes, totally aligned to proposed Uni subject.

Re: comment that it could be anyone's work. The school are very thorough in ensuring that all work is completely the pupil's own and this work is.

DD is a high achiever despite everything. Achieved lot of 8s at GCSE. Goes to state school.

OP posts:
clary · 13/08/2024 09:55

My understanding is that the high grade in the EPQ means the initial offer may be lower - so if it would be AAA then the A-star in EPQ drops it to AAB. So surely any EPQ benefit would have already been felt through her lower offer?

I agree tho that if it is directly related to what she wants to study then a good grade may be a bargaining tool. Tho tbh her firm choice uni will have her grades, and if they want her they will offer, even if she misses what they asked for. I am not sure how much point there is calling them on the day and saying "look I got these results" as they already know, and ofc have discretion to offer.

It may well help her in clearing tho.

Original poster
marmitewrap · 13/08/2024 09:58

@clary her Uni offers don't include the EPQ, just A'level grades at the moment.

OP posts:
redskydarknight · 13/08/2024 10:00

marmitewrap · 13/08/2024 09:58

@clary her Uni offers don't include the EPQ, just A'level grades at the moment.

So that suggests the university don't take the EPQ into account. Although, of course, it forms part of the overall picture if she does drop grades and it comes down to university discretion.

clary · 13/08/2024 10:03

redskydarknight · 13/08/2024 10:00

So that suggests the university don't take the EPQ into account. Although, of course, it forms part of the overall picture if she does drop grades and it comes down to university discretion.

Show quote history

Yes this - if the uni dropped a grade for a top EPQ that would be part of her offer as received before A levels. But yes, as I suggested too, the chosen uni may use discretion and still accept her.

Mate of DD's got in to his course (you hear from UCAS before you know your grades as I am sure you know) and was surprised to see his grades were at least one each below the offer - turned out they were happy to accept that.

poetryandwine · 13/08/2024 10:21

As a former admissions tutor I think you have a lot of good advice above, OP.

If DD’s Firm and/or Insurance choices are in Recruiting and the EPQ is relevant to her studies, then if her grades are only slightly off it could make the difference. As PPs say, these unis have her full grade profile already; you don’t need to do anything.

If DD goes into Clearing, it will be helpful to put down a letter grade for her EPQ. Can you get one? A or better yet A star will def be an asset

Tulipvase · 13/08/2024 10:24

I too would have thought any benefit from the EPQ would be already in her offer. My daughter didn’t do an EPQ as she was already doing two essay based A levels with NEAs. She did do a maths qualification on top which if she gets an A in, will allow her to drop a grade in one of the other A levels. But we knew that when they made her offer.

Original poster
marmitewrap · 13/08/2024 11:19

Thank you for all the valuable advice everyone - very useful.

I think that I am just stressing as DD has had a few particularly bad years with two major spinal surgery ops; touch and go whether they would be permanently disabled and in a wheelchair/permanent colostomy bag etc. So in addition to being in huge amounts of pain, huge mental load for DD too at a young age. Not your normal secondary school experience.

I suppose that I'm just clutching at straws as I really want something to go well for DD at last, but realise it's out of our hands now. Time will tell.

Wishing everyone's DCs the very best of luck for Thursday! I've got everything crossed for them all. 🤞🤞🤞

OP posts:
Original poster
marmitewrap · 13/08/2024 11:21

@poetryandwine, can I ask what a letter grade is? I've no idea. Thank you!

OP posts:
Tulipvase · 13/08/2024 11:23

I wish her all the luck in the world. It sounds like she has had a really tough few years.

mm81736 · 13/08/2024 11:34

marmitewrap · 13/08/2024 11:19

Thank you for all the valuable advice everyone - very useful.

I think that I am just stressing as DD has had a few particularly bad years with two major spinal surgery ops; touch and go whether they would be permanently disabled and in a wheelchair/permanent colostomy bag etc. So in addition to being in huge amounts of pain, huge mental load for DD too at a young age. Not your normal secondary school experience.

I suppose that I'm just clutching at straws as I really want something to go well for DD at last, but realise it's out of our hands now. Time will tell.

Wishing everyone's DCs the very best of luck for Thursday! I've got everything crossed for them all. 🤞🤞🤞

But all that will already have been reflected in her Contextual offer

clary · 13/08/2024 11:45

Op a letter grade just means A or A-star for the EPQ rather than the 46/50 I think.

Original poster
marmitewrap · 13/08/2024 12:07

Thanks @Clary. Won't this letter grade be with the Universities already as they will receive DD's grades direct? Hopefully it will be useful if it comes to clearing.

OP posts:
clary · 13/08/2024 12:09

marmitewrap · 13/08/2024 12:07

Thanks @Clary. Won't this letter grade be with the Universities already as they will receive DD's grades direct? Hopefully it will be useful if it comes to clearing.

No idea tbh - none of my DC did an EPQ. Pretty sure that those friends that did knew their letter grade before they took their A levels tho - but maybe others can correct me on that?

Otherwise I guess it is on your A level results sheet and yes, mention it to clearing prospects, if it comes to that. Best of luck to your DD.

Ceit · 13/08/2024 12:40

To clarify the point about knowing grades. Grade boundaries vary from year to year. You can look at what the numerical mark needed for an A* was in previous years, and be pretty confident about what grade a project will get, but you haven't 'got' the grade until results day. There is also a possibility the school's marks will be changed by the exam board after the sample is moderated. In my opinion schools should not (and most wouldn't) tell students they have got a grade without all these caveats.

PettsWoodParadise · 13/08/2024 12:42

DD didn’t get her final EPQ grade on A level results day last year. She knew roughly what it was but didn’t know for certain and if it had been moderated. Her teachers had marked cautiously (a nearby school had been generous a few years before and all students got massively marked down) it seems it was moderated up and got the EPQ result A* and 50/50 about a week later, not sure why it was so late. In truth as she got her A level grades she needed for her firm she wasn’t chasing this very hard.

poetryandwine · 13/08/2024 15:32

@clary is correct, OP. When I did Admissions we did get the letter grade on the UCAS form, and I would hope that continues.

mitogoshi · 13/08/2024 15:38

The universities have the grades now, they are going through the offers that have missed and will be decided whether to still accept or decline them, how much movement there is will depend on how many people missed, type of course etc. They may look at epq and the contextual offer to decide to take them

Malbecfan · 13/08/2024 16:42

OP there is some misinformation on here, as is often the case with EPQ. What is true is that the mark could possibly change as part of the moderation process and grade boundaries also move. However, many universities treat A star and A grades in EPQ similarly and if your DD's final grade is similar to her raw score, she should be fine.

As others have said, if she misses a grade and needs to do some phoning, make sure she talks about her EPQ title as it is directly relevant to her chosen course. Over the years, I have had a number of students whose EPQ was the clincher to them getting onto their chosen courses despite missing their offers.

Finally, a number of RG universities do recognise the value of the EPQ so I wish people would stop spouting the drivel that they don't. Obviously it depends on the course, but from my EPQ groups over the last 3 years, reduced offers have come in from Birmingham, Bristol, Cardiff, Exeter, Leeds, Liverpool, Manchester and Southampton as well as Bath.