Business & Language degrees

[RosaRoja]

Are they actually useful? Enjoyable? I have a DD who keeps changing her mind. The other option is pure Language.

DD is just back from her year abroad as part of a modern foreign languages degree (MFL). She is really enjoying it and has fun teasing friends studying STEM subjects that her degree is equipping her to speak a major world language fluently - far more useful than knowledge of obscure materials etc. MFL graduates are now in short supply in the UK so the degree is certainly useful. Graduate entry to consultancy, banking, law etc are all open to MFL grads. Along with maths and sciences, MFL is a teacher shortage subject. DD currently considering publishing and PR & Comms. EU linguist jobs are open only to EU citizens, which doesn't help UK grads. I can't comment on Business & MFL.

Thanks for that @IdaGlossop. I have another DC who did a language degree and doing ok in a first ‘proper’ job. DD was set on a different language degree and now had her head turned by a combo with business. They also have EU passports, fwiw. I don’t know if it’s nerves about entry requirements after her exams, or what the appeal is. Glad to hear your DD enjoyed her year abroad. It was during Covid for our other one, so still abroad but with restrictions.

Does she know what she wants to do afterwards?

Ah, that is the million $ question.

I did this years ago. I was disappointed by the multinational companies I applied to (and had interviews for) they really didn't care I was fluent in French and one of them was a French company. Hopefully things have changed and companies are more interested in that. What I do now has little bearing on the degree although some aspects have been useful for insights.

@RosaRoja I've told you more than you need to know! Good news about the EU passports. Despite the frantic gathering of destination and earnings data by universities, I think the maxim of studying a subject you love and are likely to do well in still holds good. Good luck yo your DDwith her choice.

Thank you @IdaGlossop At least she does, indeed, love her chosen language and the next 4 years should be ok.

It depends on the language and it depends on the business degree. A joint MFL and Business degree could be potentially very useful and very interesting.

Any MFL is useful, but some are more useful than others.

A business degree covers a very broad subject. I'd be having a look at course content and destination data, and finding a course that has good opportunities for meaningful contact with a variety of workplaces, opportunities for work experience, and that can support finding work opportunities in the summer vacations.

I did a business degree many years ago with French alongside, although I didn't do a year abroad. I did French simply because I enjoyed it. My mum did a language degree and worked in export sales for many years before moving into teaching. She always said that jobs requiring languages were poorly paid, and from what I saw this was the case. I worked in transport for many years before moving into central government. I'm on my second role now and neither have used any of the stuff I learned at uni.

Thank you for your insights. I’ll get her to do more work on identifying what she thinks she’d like and gain from the addition of business to a degree.

@IdaGlossop

This OP.
Purely by subject
MFL isn't more or less 'useful' than any other humanities degree. However, MFL graduates will have an edge in certain jobs requiring language skills. GCHQ for example hires them as intelligence analysts.

Business on its own isn't particularly a value add unless there are modules which involve work experience or maybe something like data analysis which is quite useful.

However specific degrees are structured for employability, offering relevant work experience here/abroad , tailored career center support, etc.

You'd really need to look at the detail of each degree

@RosaRoja It will depend on uni. Bath is a good shout. Others that are average unis, not so much. Often a MFL is very condensed with a business course. My DD did 2 MFLs for her degree. She was advised not to do one. It’s too narrow. So either two (three is too big in my view) or something with a MFL makes sense to me.

Im not sure anyone should do a MFL degree and think they will use it. It’s a vehicle for showing you are intelligent. So studying more than one demonstrates that. Not studying your native MFL shows that too.

Has she considered Law instead of business? Or another academic subject? The recruiters don’t universally recruit people with business degrees into business grad jobs. A very good degree from a very good uni is also worth having. DD would not have wanted to teach. She was at uni with friends who were clear about career paths and have achieved them. MFLs don’t stop you doing anything, even the ones not spoken much! This is because it’s not a vocational degree. It’s an academic one at the best unis.

I did business and German many years ago. My first job was in a Germany.

I thought it was a great course.

I did economics with French. I ended up in banking where I use both subjects (and have lived and worked in France and various other countries). Business is less well regarded so if she has the grades I'd look at economics with a language instead.

The great thing about adding a MFL is that MFL departments struggle for students so DD might be able to trade up on uni. I tend to think the job dc end up with is down to lots of factors and not just degree. A degree is the starting point.

She was set for a MFL, like her brother (though different languages). It’s just in the past couple of weeks she’s come up with ideas about Business + MFL. She had a brief think about International Relations + MFL, but she hasn’t done history or have much interest in it and I think it would be a mistake.

I'm 25+ years out of date on modern syllabus and course options. FWIW I did a science degree and later followed that up with a business related masters. I use what I learned on the business course daily.

Last year I was invited to help a local college with their business T-level and I was very impressed with the syllabus contents. If modern business degrees are anything similar to this they would be very useful alongside a MFL. Although English is generally the universal business language there is still demand for MFL in business. The right language would be an asset for anyone wanting a role in CX, customer service, sales, purchasing, etc.

My background is a bit different to an earlier respondents. The economics modules of my masters have been much less useful in my career than the business process modules (operations, marketing, etc.). But I haven't worked in banking. And that's where experience shapes the value we place on options.

I would always advise a student to pick subjects they enjoy, as it's easier to be good at a subject that interests you, and then see what you can do with it later. If it was purely about earning potential I'd be saying do an apprenticeship in plumbing or plastering.

@RosaRoja IR is a slightly narrow focus in my view. A few we have known have struggled to get decent jobs. We aren’t in EU but if you are EU passport holders, you might be ok. Others end up working for charities.

To be honest, there’s business degrees and business degrees. The best ones will have people on them with good maths. They want to end up in finance but find engineering and maths grads are competing too.Business is a slightly jack of all trades degree. However somewhere like Bath is a good call.

I don’t see MFL as being wholly vocational. The academic two MFL degrees should be - academic. I think that matters. Can you research and use your brain? Do you have critical thinking skills? My DDs never used her MFLs at work. The degree did launch her into her career though. Lots of top businesses recruit grads with all sorts of degrees and you get various seats as you move around learning more. A bright history (eg) grad will learn quickly, or a mathematician. You can go into a myriad of business fields with any decent degree. Business is just one but doesn’t trump everything else.

I would always advise a student to pick subjects they enjoy, as it's easier to be good at a subject that interests you, and then see what you can do with it later. I agree with this. Does she really love the idea of studying business or is she just adding it because she thinks it would be useful? DH has an MFL degree - he very much uses it in the job he has now, indeed that's what helped him stand out in the sector he moved into after he graduated. He always says it's not a vocational degree unless you want to teach languages, but a good MFL degree from a good university will keep a lot of doors open and will also provide you with a useful (and now vanishingly rare in the UK) skill.

The MFL + something else idea only occurred to her in the past few weeks. As I mentioned, it might be nerves about whether she’ll get that A she needs, or looking for something else to get her into the Uni she’s chosen. This is all very helpful, thank you for your experiences and insights.

A late addition! Another combination with MFL is linguistics. That addition would add elements of data and analysis not on offer with MFL by itself and would open the door to a range of careers in addition to those already mentioned - market research, marketing, speech therapy for example.

I know with fees and student finance a degree has to be worth it and things have clearly changed in the last 30 years but I did a combined business degree with French and it opened lots of doors for me. 4 yr degree (did beginner's Italian too in 1st year) - Year 1 and part of Yr 2 in UK, second half of 2nd year spent studying at a French university, 3rd year (48 week) industrial placement in France, back to UK for final 4th year.

Secured a very good grad scheme upon graduation - combination of relevant work experience and skills from studying / working abroad (independence / resilience / determination /adaptability etc etc) were very well regarded.

But besides the value of that degree professionally, looking back now, I also loved it and think the opportunity to study and live abroad for 18 months as part of my degree was a fantastic opportunity.

Placements abroad are like hens teeth now. Brexit! Nearly all degrees are 3rd year abroad because students need the credits from a full y2. However British council still operates and the uni partners are still there. Working abroad has become difficult for students but there are opportunities here.However people with EU passports are presumably in a better position. My DD has done pretty well with just the MFLs. Both taken as joint for degree.

DS is using his MFL in his first job after Uni. Hopefully, things will continue to be ok for them (thinking of impact of AI). I don’t know if DD has the diligence and focus needed for Linguistics, as per suggestion above (thank you for that), but I’ll talk it over with her. Curiously, I’ve been getting ads for MI5 and RAF admin & analytics jobs on my FB feed today. Bizarre.