University snobbery

[nysw]

Just wondering if anyone has come across this from adults/parents?

That is all

I work in early careers and a surprising amount of employers will only consider graduate candidates from a top 20 uni. Even for sales roles.

I went as a kid from a council estate in the north to Durham. The quality of teaching was variable from awesome to shit, but the biggest thing I learnt from that degree was that I was never going to be "worth" anything in the eyes of a lot of people who would be likely to end up in power because of where I was from and how I sounded. My Durham degree and PGCE were pretty fucking useless in terms of employability.

On the other hand - my vocational allied health degree from an ex Poly that has MN clutching their pearls in horror was superbly taught with fantastic staff and resources behind it, excellent support in terms of employability and. it's got me well established on a good career path and moved up to a Specialist level role within a year.

I work in careers and employability at a university and so does my husband.... both ex-polys.
We've seen lots more employers working with us. The landscape is changing in many sectors.

When I meant snobbery I meant moreso parents looking down on lesser ranked universities.

Not just aiming high (which there is nothing bad about)

Only know one IRL, loves to slide into every chat her DC are privately educated and what uni they're at, was very surprised when I casually mentioned my DD was at same uni 🤣

What's the university if you don't mind me asking?

I seem to recall a thread like this where the OP was cross her partner wouldn’t admit he’d gone to the “poly” 😂

This is not an unusual experience.

One of the reasons the graduates of many Russell group universities earn more is because of their prior network of connections which gives them access to internships and graduate roles. These opportunities are generally not available to working class students.

My take on this is always about the course - where is the best place for the course you want to do. I'm more interested in what a young person is studying than where they are at uni,

I also feel that there are 3 tiers - Oxbridge, RG plus key others such as Bath, Lancaster, St Andrews and then the rest. As I've said above there are also outliers for very specialised courses.

Personally I can't see the point of spending £50k to get a degree from a low ranking university given the competition for well paid careers. I'm discouraging my DC from doing this.

Lastly I agree with PP re stem degrees - much better value as more teaching time etc. I'm very surprised at how little my DC at an RH is getting.

But in your example,the grade requirements vary wildly. For History, Lancaster requires AAB but St Andrews requires AAA
As such you could say that St Andrews will attract more academic students.

Are there any UK Universities on Oxbridge level? (That aren't Oxbridge obviously)

Of course there is nothing snobby about acknowledging that some Universities are more highly ranked, have higher entry requirements etc than others. Nor is it snobby to aim for a highly ranked institution if it suits your needs best, or to celebrate if you meet difficult entry requirements. But it is snobby to be disparaging about people who attend institutions that aren't on your personal approved list (especially if you don't know what you're talking about!) and to treat them as lesser human beings. I think we've all seen that on here.
I don't think anyone would argue against the idea that there is more academic rigour at Oxbridge than a typical post 1992 University but to hear some posters on here you'd think that anywhere except a handful of institutions is full of shuffling Epsilons doomed to a life of miserable servitude, if anyone would employ them at all, which is just ridiculous.
I suspect that's what the OP means, not someone objectively stating that a first in maths from Cambridge is likely to get you more highly paid job opportunities than one from a small ex FE college.

@Rainydayinlondon well how much more academic is AAA vs AAB? I know someone who got into Oxford only to somehow mess up one exam and get a B. Ended up at another RG uni but not after a scrabble around because they all want AAA!

IMO the current system does not differentiate enough between students. It doesn't allow the very bright to stand out. Additionally with so many offering contextual offers eg Bristol to leafy comps it's all become a bit of a joke!

Looking down on people who went to a 'lesser' uni is always snobbery and never fair.

But OTOH we are doing our kids a disservice if we pretend that all universities and courses are equal, and that they should just study whatever and wherever they fancy.

What specifically are you asking OP? A general question? Based on what, something that someone has said to you recently. Or re your dc, considering Uni? Its not clear what angle you are coming at this from?

@Rainydayinlondon
"her partner wouldn’t admit he’d gone to the “poly” . Oh I remember that thread. It was so funny. Is it in 'classics', because it should be.

Ravensbourne is THE university for films and TV. There are very few productions in the UK that don't have at least one alumni (or current student) on set.

Don't know about photography but the networking and placement opportunities are far more important for a photographer ... which depending on her preferred style/subjects London/Glasgow will may have more of than Leeds.

In Maths the top tier is called COWI - Cambridge, Oxford, Imperial, Warwick. For 2024 the Complete University Guide has C and O in the top two spots but for 2023 these were occupied by W and I. Also St A’s has come on very strong; it and a few others are def competing

The same is true in a number of areas of study. Oxbridge is utterly fabulous and for the right student, which is an important caveat, the tutorial system is an incredible and potentially life changing opportunity, beyond the disciplinary education provided. But that is not why parents and, according to some on this thread (though not my experience) alumnae brag or humblebrag about it.

Oxbridge v eg Imperial for STEM? Essentially a draw. Personal preference is a valid reason to be attracted to one or the other. But I think the (humble) bragging is entwined with the ever present awareness of the British class system. So sad

I thought the general MN consensus was that parents should support a DC's course and university choice because "their life their choice"

@nysw LSE and Imperial!

I've been involved in recruitment recently and can hand on heart say we wouldn't treat anyone differently based on where they went to university. To be honest, even their degree is not that important. We pick our recruits based on their skill, passion, eagerness to learn and develop. Which university they went to would be bottom of the list.

Those saying it’s about the course, did not get into Oxbridge.

That relates to not imposing your preferences onto DC that are sensible and have fully researched their options.

Many DC have no idea what they want to do, choose a uni because they're 'passionate' about a subject, it sounds cool or all their friends are going there. Given the expected parental contribution running into thousands, one would hope they have a plan!

I’m from Edinburgh where everyone seems to ask where you went to high school and judges you accordingly. University snobbery is a thing though too.

@Netflixreject Yes. The IFS have done the number crunching. I suspect the difference probably comes down to art grads and those doing “academic” subjects like law snd history at lower tier unis and then struggling to get jobs at a higher paid level. The IFS looks closely at what degrees are worth more than others in earnings over time. No surprise to see medicine at the top and art at the bottom. Uni makes a huge difference for some subjects, eg Economics. If you have the time, the research is illuminating.

@nysw Other unis; Imperial for a start! Definitely better in some sciences. LSE. Very highly regarded. Many now also believe other universities will give DC a fair shot at any career. Don’t forget that grads actually have to want the jobs even if they go to Oxbridge.

It cannot just be down to parents regarding careers. I would say DD has a career that’s alien to DH and me. We would not have known where to start! We see many friends with dc in all sorts of jobs where parents have no influence. Some dc have been to very expensive schools but are not doing jobs their parents have any influence over. The DC have the talent and the drive and enthusiasm to do it.

Also RG unis vary hugely. 6% privately educated at Sheffield. So why would anyone feel out of place there? At every uni, state educated is the minority and many RG are like Sheffield. All these details are available so looking them up can help dc make informed choices. Parents should have some input into this, even if it’s ignored.

lol.
Well, I didn't even apply to Oxbridge. As a first generation student who grew up on one of the most deprived estates in the UK I was lucky to even get to university. Oxbridge sat firmly outside of my horizons - in my 18 year old head people like me didn't go to places like that.

Have a degree, masters and PhD now though so clearly I still managed okay.
Now I work in at a university and careers and employability and can confidently say that for many sectors it's the course that is important.