Current Oxford/Cambridge students support/chat continued (2)

[Panicmode1]

The other thread is nearly full so I took the liberty of starting a new one...

Oxford is adamant that they simply expect the majority to be at grades 7 or above. However, it's all contextual. If she had gone to a selective school like some above, she wouldn't have had a look in

H2O it's obviously even more subtle than that, since most people on MN would say that 7A star let alone 5A star from a top selective school wouldn't cut the mustard.

Both of those DC scored very highly on the aptitude test for their subject (as I think your DD did too, from memory?).

Basically, they seem pretty good at identifying students who really do have genuine potential in their subject.

Exactly @goodbyestranger. As you say, she also showed potential through the TSA. I certainly don't begrudge anyone a huge string of grade 9s but it's disheartening when people believe the urban myths that it's ONLY worth applying with stellar grades. There is discussion on the current applicant threads about students applying with over 30 GCSEs and double digit A levels. It doesn't encourage widening participation.

Thank you very much for your responses and your kids sound amazing. On reading this I’m proud of them and I don’t even know them!

My own DC achieved 9x9 and 1x7 - I was concerned that the 7 might mean their application wouldn’t be considered. I’ll show DC your replies as it might give them a confidence boost.

Thank you! And I won’t derail any more. Wishing your DCs every success 🙌

Well, I’m sure there have been wobbles, but he’s not got as far as voicing them to me.
Student accommodation is a bit of a shock to the system for him I think. He’s not one for pubs and clubs, but has easily found his tribe as they say.
Is already looking to internships for the coming summers, though most start during the 2nd and 3rd year.
I’m looking forward to him coming home!

Although it was their GCSE profiles that gave my DC the confidence to apply, it was their interview experiences that helped them believe that they might enjoy going. This is so important for DC whose are not from families where attending top universities is the norm.

DS was 9x9 and 2x8 gcse. Normal state comp who usually get a couple to Oxbridge but v large cohort. No real assistance from school but he had an excellent history teacher. He was on the Oxbridge school pathway which actually was just they visited both for the day! That was it. He saw the college he ended up at when he was end of year 10 on a family mini break. Someone older he knew from swimming club was at that college also doing history and said give it a go. He enjoyed the interview and the style of learning they outlined . Hs A levels weren't all A stars except for his subject but he was in hospital with appendicitis for one of them. He loves his college. Does four sports, one at uni level, 3 at college level. Has finally this week got his results from year 1 and was v happy. He just loves the experience and it suits him. He just thought why not apply, they can only say no! But he would have been happy at his second choice if he hadn't made it. First in family to go to university and he gets full bursary.

My own DC achieved 9x9 and 1x7 - I was concerned that the 7 might mean their application wouldn’t be considered. I’ll show DC your replies as it might give them a confidence boost

Well maybe also tell your DC that the vast majority at Oxford in normal years don't have and never have had anything like those results (not sure about the CAG years). Medicine is an outlier which you cant generalise from but even if your DC intends to apply for Medicine, those results are still excellent.

MN threads can sometimes give the impression that all Oxbridge applicants have straight A*/ 9s. Only a tiny percentage of Y11s achieve straight top grades in each and every subject. Your DC's grades are outstanding. Also, it's certainly not always the confident ones who get in. When my DC have come back from interview there usually seem to have been a few stand out fellow applicants who are rather pleased with themselves (overwhelmingly - mild apologies here - from independent schools) and mostly they don't seem to have turned up at the start of term - confidence isn't everything. I think confidence does get a boost once an offer is made but is often lacking going into the process and not helped by mythical tales of the genius of other applicants. Although saying that most successful applicants are actually pretty normal DC runs the risk of people on these threads shouting stealth boasting or getting deeply offended because their own DC didn't get in but meh. Too many DC who should apply don't, and that's much more important.

@Rainbowglassbowl My D1 got exactly the same results as your DC at GCSE (2018 so first year of new syllabus and all numerical grades iirc) 9x9 1x7. She went to the local state school, we are in the NE. No opportunity to do extra GCSEs even if she had wanted to. She declined to do an EPQ. Not much assistance from school, they did have an early applicants group (Oxbridge, medicine, etc) and did a school trip for the open days but help was patchy. I think 3 from her year got into O. She's just graduated from Oxford with a college prize and a 1st in a History joint.

I agree with PPs, it's really not all about reams of top grades. There are also the aptitude tests, interviews and how they judge the student will respond to the tutorial system. She loved it when she went for the open day and then the interviews (in person) and could really see herself there.

@Rainbowglassbowl very good luck to your DC, who'd clearly thrive, if Oxbridge are lucky enough to benefit from their presence!

My two DCs got considerably lower GCSE results at a school which always had very high grades but then went on to do really well in A Levels. I think at GCSE, they each got things like 4 to 5 A*s, 4 As and perhaps a couple of Bs, although I now can't fully remember.

They applied twice - firstly, not getting offers after getting interviews on the first try. Once the A Level results were in (this was all pre-Covid, when they did the proper public exams in subjects they loved and got A*s) and they did round two of Oxbridge applications and interviews, both got places. A Level grades superceded GCSE grades.

Many of their peers who'd got much better GCSE results, didn't make it and some did and I do think that once you get to interview and have done well enough at the entrance tests, it was about who the college/ department thought would thrive most and really enjoy the teaching methods.

I recently met up with some old friends from my own Oxford Uni days (42 years since we were at interviews) and we were chatting about our experiences. All of us hadn't got stellar academic results but seemed to do something 'right' at interview:

I got every single interview question incorrect but then got into a very interesting discussion about one of my extracurricular pursuits, (art) in which my tutor-to-be's husband was a professional 'big-wig'. So that went down well. I also came from a school that barely sent anyone to university at all and never to Oxbridge.

One of my friends got angry and assertive with her tutor-to-be (same person as mine) at her interview and this was considered very positively, as our tutor liked a good 'fight' academically. Looking back, I think it was all about being able to have a discussion, express an opinion and back this up, more than a perfect set of exam grades.

Whilst things have changed a lot over the years, I think that there's really nothing to worry about if there are less than a perfect set of grades, as there's more to the selection process than just that one aspect.

Sorry - computer fail: My DCs GCSE results were 4 to 5 A Stars, 4 As and a couple of Bs but their A Level grades were A stars.

Mine was 7x 9 and 2x8. But I definitely think it was the PS and interview that got the place not the GCSEs. Loves the subject. You can get a 9 in, say, history by knowing what you need to know and knowing the mark scheme. My view is that student would not get a place at Ox to study history. An interest way beyond the curriculum is what is needed (just my view obvs, and one that is going to be tricky with my next child who has aspirations and similar grades but lacks that wider interest in my view)

Well, exactly, @Oxonc3 . DD got top grades in comparatively 'weaker' subjects by doing just that. Nobody in their right mind would have offered her a place at a top flight university to study, say, English or History on the strength of those grades, because there was no depth of interest in further reading to back it up. It was simply a case of doing what had to be done for the sake of the exams. And slipping the odd grade in arts/humanities subjects wouldn't make much difference when applying for a STEM course.
Does anyone else feel as if GCSEs were a whole lifetime ago? That's probably the preserve of those of us with no DC left at school.

@DahliaMacNamara it does indeed feel like GCSEs were eons ago now. So much water under the bridge since then.

Awful news today that DS1 may be told to leave his law conversion course if he doesn't get his degree certificate to send to them in time by their deadline. Meanwhile, Cambridge Uni are supposed to be producing this for him, obviously really late, given he's only recently received his degree at all but apparently they won't do this until the next round of official degree conferring.

Of course, he's also not allowed ever to attend a proper degree ceremony at Senate House because he did the pseudo 'leaving ceremony' long before his degree had been marked, in the summer. So now he has to wait until Cambridge do their next one - in abstentia - for all those who didn't get their degrees marked in time, through no fault of the students.

If this doesn't happen to be before the law course deadline, DS1 is out, losing his student loan too - though no fault of his own, his career path interrupted, another year of his life wasted, seven weeks already into his law course - wasted. I'm absolutely furious and of course powerless to help.

@mutterphore HOLY FUCK.
I hope it gets sorted. And that you have some hair left after pulling it all out in frustration.

@mutterphore that's so difficult - does ds know when the deadlines are? Could he get a transcript in the absence of a certificate?

That is SO deeply unfair @mutterphore. What a nightmare!! I really hope it all gets resolved in time.

mutterphore your DS1 needs to get Cambridge to write a letter to his law provider explaining the situation. I suspect it's a computer says no type at the law provider end who is just being narrow. Of course your DS1 won't be asked to leave in these very unusual circumstances, entirely not of his making, but what a horrible thing to have thrown at him all the same. I'm sure anything from the appropriate people at Cambridge will do and if computer says no person still holds out then your DS1 should escalate it fast to someone with a bit more authority to override the strict requirement of a degree certificate. Incredibly time consuming and frustrating.

I hope your two boys are having a bit more luck with their applications.

@mutterphore that is awful. I would suggest that your DS sends an email summarising the situation and including both the relevant person / office on the law conversion course and the relevant person / office at Cambridge university.

@mutterphore he could try copying in someone from here:

www.student-registry.admin.cam.ac.uk/contact-us

@mutterphore I am beyond disappointed in Cambridge for letting your DS down. I am hopeful there is some sort of solution, at the moment it just seems so darned unfair and even if a solution is found, the stress levels incurred are completely unwarranted.

That is ridiculous @mutterphore. Oxford provided a link for prospective employers and unis which explained the situation for those who were waiting for results. They just had to scan a QR code and it gave the provisional results and confirmation of the situation. It seems ludicrous that another education provider doesn't seem to recognise that it's outside your DS's control.

@mutterphore is the deadline set by the law school running the conversion, rather than SRA? I was a lecturer at one of the big providers (now back in practice) but DH works there now. I would be surprised if they were unable to flex on this but your DC's tutor may need to escalate internally. If you want to check if it's the same place DH works at to see if he can find out more drop me a private message

Would a transcript suffice? DS had access to his earlier in the summer in case his employer needed it.

Thanks for the messages of support. DS1 has now managed to get yet another transcript of his actual degree results from his college and has sent this off to the law course. Hopefully they'll accept another update version, although they say they need to actual degree certificate by a date in November which DS1 thinks is before Cambridge Uni confer, officially and in abstentia, real degrees on him and others in his position.

@alexisccd I'm not sure who sets the deadline for the law course but many thanks for offering advice via a PM. I'll see what happens early next week and if DS1's law course accept what he's sent them. I hope they will as it'll say they can vouch for his degree and marks, even without an actual degree certificate.

Ticket for Snowball booked by DD. I am glad she has something to look forward to near end of her first term. She has got ‘engaged’ to a college friend, as I understand it, ready to be a college parent next year. Still getting my head around all the college family stuff!

First night of play she is in at CUADC tmw night and I am heading up to see the production on the Friday night and staying over in her room. Such a short turnaround from casting to production and rehearsals have been intense but she has made some lovely friends through the club.

Collection booked for morning after the Snowball, DD has warned her father she may not have slept so may zonk out in the car. It will be lovey to have her home but also good knowing she is doing well and making friends.