Oxford/Cambridge - current students support/chat thread 2022 - cont

[Panicmode1]

@petitebleu - so sorry to hear about your DS. I hope that some time out over Christmas may help to give him some space and time to think about his next steps.

@Bapple I'll drop you a PM

I think many of our DC can relate to imposter syndrome and falling out of love with one’s subject, @Bapple… and I can certainly relate to the parental anxiety. It’s awful when they are upset and we can’t do anything about it but sympathise from a distance. In my more fretful moments, DH has reminded me that getting through these times builds resilience in the DC.

That sounds a bit encouraging, @Catsrcool69.

@DadDadDad good to see your update.

@mutterphore strange about the difference in how your DSs’ ends of studies have been marked. These rites of passage are so important. It’s such a shame when they are neglected by the people who should be organising them. But it’s good that both your DSs are nevertheless making the most of their last few weeks.

I typed an entire post and then lost it. 🤦‍♀️

@Bapple I'm sorry to hear that your DS is feeling stressed and low in confidence. I hope things become clearer for him and he is able to see a way forward.

DS came home yesterday; he chose to forego the last few garden parties in order to have ten days at home to recover from this term and prepare for Switzerland. He'll be working a 40 hour week there, so I'm glad he is getting a break after third year exams. He is also practising his French!

@Bapple my son felt very uncertain in his first year railing against Oxford’s ivory tower and southern students having never been chippy before and all after having been desperate to go to Oxford. He’d had a year out in a tough but rewarding setting overseas so the reverse culture shock was huge. Also he found the shift from busy school timetable to much lower contact hours and self study tricky so struggled.
His second year has been completely different- has a lovely girlfriend and good other friends. He’s even decided to do some academic work 🙄and is getting into his dissertation. Still a fit chaotic but much much better helped by a more sympathetic tutor.
So if you can do encourage your DC to stick in.

Thanks for all the words of encouragement about DS. It's been really comforting to hear similar stories.
I've suggested that when he gets home he goes and meets up with his A Level teachers and chats to them about their degree experiences (they are relatively young and one of them went to O himself) and they know his love for the subject.
I think he's in the right college for his mindset - it's small and he's made his mark there through getting involved with JCR committee etc but he just needs to believe that he does deserve to be there if he wants to be there!

@Bapple I'm so sorry to hear about your DS and you're doing a great job to support him no matter what he wants to do. I hope he knows that many, many students will be feeling exactly the same as he is. It's often those who think they've done the worst in exams who come out doing really well.

He is doing absolutely brilliantly of course just by making the transition from school and home to university, from a familiar cohort to new people and from probably being one of the best at his school to one among many. To be able to tolerate and adapt for a whole Oxford year is a massive achievement in itself. Many students will fall out of love with their subject when they feel the endless pressure to perform week after week of very intense and short terms.

I wanted to drop out of Oxford after only my first term 42 years ago - or at the very least, change subjects but in the end, I persisted and with no regrets. It's not for everyone but the fact that he got a place, means he definitely deserves to be there.

Hopefully, some time back at home will help him make the right decision for him and with some perspective away from Oxford, maybe he'll see just how amazing he is to have got there in the first place and to have got through a whole year. Very good luck to him!

@Catsrcool69 I'm very interested and partially encouraged by your info. from the VC's office. I just can't understand either why negotiations aren't continuing nor why finalists can just have their exams marked even if other years don't given how absolutely crucial this is for them. It just feels so so cruel. DS1 has now said I can contact our local MP if I want to see if this helps and I may also ask him if he minds me contacting the VC office too. Meanwhile, I'm glad your DD is making the most of her last ever May week as are my DCs too.

@Ironoaks I hope your DS has a good rest before his very busy working summer.

@Juja glad your DS has a good second year and best of luck to him for the third year too.

It would be great if even those whose offspring are leaving Oxbridge shortly could still share news of their DCs on this thread, which has been very supportive. I'll keep reading and sharing and in any case, I won't be able to think that DS1 (C) has actually left until his exams are marked and he actually gets a proper degree and who knows when that might be...or...worst of all...if that will ever happen?

@mutterphore I'm glad my update was helpful and your DS has agreed to writing to your MP. I've also now written to the Minister for universities, Robert Halfon. I refuse to accept that the Government does not have a role in helping to resolve this dispute, and the more noise that people can make about it the better. As it is, I feel really sad wheni think about how my DD should get her results on Thursday, but won't.

On a happier note, it is lovely to hear of all the fun many are having. And for those who are struggling, they are not alone. My DD has had some of the toughest times of her life at C as well as some of the best. She too comes from a state school background and at first found the confidence that many private school educated students appear to have somewhat daunting. But everyone is there because they deserve to be.

DS remains unperturbed by the Cambridge marking fiasco. He had a free ticket for yesterday's Trinity May Ball and is in Oxford this weekend for Varsity tennis so has plenty of distraction.

His dissertation supervisor is encouraging DS to submit his final year dissertation for publication. DS is very pleased to have been asked but it is a lengthy process and he is reluctant to re-engage with academic work quite so soon.

Re the Cambridge marking strike, I would urge your dc to write, email and protest themselves rather than delegating to parents (or in addition to parents doing it if they want to). It will have far more weight if they do it themselves and young people are very adept at using social media to generate support and exert pressure. I'm surprised that it's not more in the news than it is and that can only be down to a lack of student voice.

Tweet here linking to a story saying that employers like PWC will still take on students who haven’t got their results.
Sunday Times story

@Catsrcool69 regarding the marking strikes, do you think it would be best for me to contact the Vice Chancellors office first and foremost or perhaps Prof Munir directly?

I do realise that the students themselves need to be taking action @Scoobyblue but I feel that in this particular situation, I can't stand by and let my DS1 leave Cambridge without his rightful degree.

@mutterphore it's hard to know the best route. It seems to be Prof Munir who is leading the university 's response so I'd go direct and I've been focusing on the university's response and mitigation plan. But I think we need the Government to start caring enough to exert some pressure and get the two sides negotiating. That's what I've been saying to my MP and now to the Department of Education.

I do agree that the students need to make a fuss too. I am seeing more stories appear in the media, albeit not headline news, eg on the Education pages of the BBC News website. But ultimately young adults, including students, have very little political power and their interests are routinely ignored by the Government. That speaks to a wider problem around voting apathy in the young, which we can't fix. But us parents, we vote! And like you, I can't just sit by and do nothing as my daughter is robbed of her dream of graduating with an actual degree from Cambridge.

Re PWC: They simply can't afford to delay their intake. Their grads are due to sit their first exams by mid October and then immediately start client work. The likelihood of their intake not achieving the required degree grade is minimal and can easily be dealt with within the probation period. Once their students start racking up their professional exams within the first 6 months, their degree is largely irrelevant.

Thanks for this,@Catsrcool69 . If only the people striking could just mark the finalists work so that this cohort don't continue to suffer so much. I'll get in touch with Prof Munir and also my MP.

Alongside how this affects students' employment prospects - and there are certainly those where employers do need exact marks if making a decision between two almost equal candidates in very competitive situations - it's the fact that it just feels so unfair and wrong to students. Of course unfair and wrong things are also happening to those on strike but it's not achieving an end goal and it's just causing more pain for those without any control over the situation.

@mutterphore - from what I've seen if graduate recruitment so it's the aptitude tests and assessment centres that are used to differentiate between candidates. Class of degree is unlikely to be the differentiating factor.

An English finalist has written a twitter thread about the situation...
twitter.com/cambtweeteng/status/1670908284071542789?t=Ia-bkry_r15U4eG-tOCU6w&s=19

HoneyMobster I'm not sure that that's so, once you get through the tests and assessments. People seem to quite like firsts.

This is vicarious from the DC. In my day I literally went for an interview at a single Magic Circle firm (only considered one), talked to three partners (mostly about cockroaches then about jazz) and was offered a TC. No tests (computers were in their infancy) and no assessement centres. Those were the days.

'graduate recruitment' presumably isn't all the same.

Hello everyone,

I have a third year DS at O and was kept sane by this board during those dismal first couple of terms (dismal for the parents worrying about our offspring, but, as it turned out, DS rather enjoyed the clandestine parties). Anyway, as some of the cohort finish their university careers I thought I’d pop back to see how everyone is doing.

I’m happy to read about DC thriving and getting through their exams, and those who were once struggling finding their feet. The situation with exams at C is shocking and seems hugely unfair: this cohort have had too tough a time.

DS is in the fortunate position of having his exam results already – he honoured me with a phone call while he opened the email, which was pretty tough on the maternal blood pressure. However, all is very good; he will be returning for a fourth year and truly loves his subject.

Despite the strange start, he’s had a fantastic experience and has made the most out of the place. I would have liked him to have experienced a bit more culture (I’m not counting singing in the bar after rugby matches as culture), but it has been the sport that has captivated him, not just at university level but also college level for many different sports. He adores his college.

For those worried their DC may not fit in because they come from the wrong school, don’t have as much money etc., I haven’t seen any evidence of a problem. DS’s friends come from a wide range of backgrounds, from failing inner city comps to the most expensive public schools, from first generation at university to multi-generation at Oxbridge. What matters most to them is whether they back each other up on the sports pitch, give and take banter, and help each other home after a big night out.

My DS is really struggling with the situation re the marking strike. Many of you will know he has had many struggles along the way put has persevered. He completed his dissertation and all exams but didn't answer some questions and some were considerably below the word count so passing is by no means certain. He is so stressed by it all.

@mutterphore I've now also contacted the UCEA to urge them to resume negotiations as it seems it is them who are refusing to negotiate currently. I think that is shameful.

I got the impression from the way @mutterphore has described what her DC are applying for that they're trying to get into professional services - maybe financial services and law)? She's described them doing assessments online and in-person.

I can't comment on how the law firms are recruiting in 2023 but I do know a bit about financial services. It's the test results and the interviews that determine outcomes rather than degree class. Degree class, even if it is a first, without succeeding against the other criteria won't get you a foot in the door.

HoneyMobster I'm talking about City stuff too. I said once you get through those initial levels to final interview stage; clearly if you don't get through those you aren't in the running. But as Errol says, there seems to be a good deal of variation even between firms in the same sector and also (from what I see) variation in recruitment policies at the same firms across the years. Not a huge surprise I suppose. Anyhow, basically it's rubbish for these poor students - a massive deal.

My DS is really struggling with the situation re the marking strike. Many of you will know he has had many struggles along the way put has persevered. He completed his dissertation and all exams but didn't answer some questions and some were considerably below the word count so passing is by no means certain. He is so stressed by it all

Cliff very sorry to hear this. Your DS has done incredibly well to complete all the exams. A number just can't face going through that door. Also, several of my own DC have - unfortunately - inherited my trait for being seriously bad at timing in exams. Lots of unanswered questions and even more tiny answers. I very, very much doubt your DS is looking at not passing his degree.