Warwick Uni (less face to face than last year!)

[Daisysway]

For those students applying in 2022. Really think twice about applying to Warwick University for any of the Bioscience Courses.

My dd just going into year 2 and she's got less f2f teaching than last year! Only 50 percent of her tutorials are f2f this term, all lectures are online and she only has 6 LABS all year.

There apparent excuse is they have a larger in take this year so more tutorials.

Shocking behaviour from a top 10 University.

@OnwardsAndSideways1

I teach at a RG uni and we are pretty much all F2F! No excuses. Even vulnerable staff are being made to come in with a very few exceptions.

I'm pleased to be back in the classroom. The big classes though are huge this year, our intake is up 40%, it's crazy. I'm not sure that's increasing anyone's quality of education, nor being crammed in a teaching hall.

Unis were not given any funding to get through covid last year, they asked for a bailout and were refused, so they are clawing their deficit back by having huge student numbers.

I am not looking forward to the larger numbers, but I do agree face to face is the way forward if students wear masks, I wish that was compulsory but it isn't. I'm bouncing around campus though!

Sounds like that is the crux of it isn’t it. Get higher numbers to get higher income. Not ideal for staff or students.

That must be very disappointing. I teach at Oxford and am very very much looking forward to academic life being close to "normal" this year, as is the University and College plan. At least if infection levels remain at an acceptable level. Fingers crossed!

Our student numbers are not significantly higher than usual. A small number of international students have been given permission to study remotely. Others are returning in time to quarantine. Lectures will of course be recorded, but the vast majority will be delivered in person as will all tutorials, unless someone needs to isolate.

DS was at Manchester last year and didn’t have a single F2F session all year. Due to height tiering and lockdowns he didn’t meet any students outside his flat bubble. It was really a poor experience, especially when the ‘prison’ fences went up around his accommodation.

This year is completely different. He has all lectures and tutorials timetabled as F2F. They need to be double jabbed or to have done an LFT to go in, but it’s made such a difference. I think he really deserves it after last year, as Manchester was hit pretty badly, but all the second years deserve a better year.

Why do they need to accommodate social distancing? That's not happening in schools or colleges.

I think Universities (and even individual Colleges) are making their own rules to some extent. In the same way that some restaurants require mask-wearing now and some don't. On the whole they are being fairly cautious relative to the rest of society. I think one reason for that is that the responsibility we have for these young people is in some ways much greater than a school. They live here. If there is a covid outbreak then they isolate here. My College has provided meals to hundreds of students isolating in their rooms. Plus welfare support. The drain on non-academic staff has been enormous. And on the other side of the balance, undergraduates manage relatively well with online teaching compared to say, primary school kids. Labs excluded of course.

I think if Manchester can do it, why can’t others? I understood it last year as cases were through the roof and vaccinations hadn’t started, so despite it being a really poor experience there wasn’t much alternative, but this year things should be different.

I think that's the question - why should some unis be getting away with delivering almost no in-person teaching, when they've been promising plenty of face-to-face teaching for months, and students made selections on that basis.

Edinburgh University is offering basically the same as they did last year - virtually no face to face. Very similar situation to OP - my DS2, doing biosciences at Edinburgh, is getting 3 labs per term (if he's lucky-we'll see if they actually happen and are actually in person), and other than that, around 1 hour of in person contact every 2 weeks - which I'm hoping will actually be in person - but really, are we supposed to be grateful that the university is granting him 1 hour per fortnight of in-person instruction with a professor or grad student TA, in exchange for the 20K he's paying to attend this year? One class is made up entirely of pre-recorded lectures from last year.

And good luck to students wanting to protest or submit complaints - the Edinburgh Vice Chancellor and his staff appear to be missing in action, with a note on their webpage (not updated since April) saying they're working at home, not picking up post, and can't be contacted by phone?! According to news reports the guy is on GBP400K a year - nice work if you can get it, but how about ensuring your institution actually offers what was promised to the thousands of undergraduate students you've accepted? They certainly haven't held off on collecting tuition and accommodation expenses.

Wishing DS had not already taken a gap year - which he did to avoid having to do a year of fully online uni :-( at this point it seems best for him just to soldier on, but what a huge disappointment and what a waste of time and money, when he could have been at one of the many UK universities that actually care about what they deliver to students. Also wishing we had paid more attention to the very low student satisfaction rankings, the reasons for which are now becoming clear. Edinburgh leadership should be ashamed.

@irregularegular

Why do they need to accommodate social distancing? That's not happening in schools or colleges.

I think Universities (and even individual Colleges) are making their own rules to some extent. In the same way that some restaurants require mask-wearing now and some don't. On the whole they are being fairly cautious relative to the rest of society. I think one reason for that is that the responsibility we have for these young people is in some ways much greater than a school. They live here. If there is a covid outbreak then they isolate here. My College has provided meals to hundreds of students isolating in their rooms. Plus welfare support. The drain on non-academic staff has been enormous. And on the other side of the balance, undergraduates manage relatively well with online teaching compared to say, primary school kids. Labs excluded of course.

I get the idea behind that but students have a very high % of vaccination. It’s 98% for one jab and 75% for two at St. Andrews I understand. So actually a pretty low risk cohort of people compared to general population. I do worry for 2nd years who are now in private accom perhaps on own or in small groups with low levels of f2f. That seems more concerning to me if the issue is pastoral

If that's what Edinburgh are doing that's crazy. One hour of F2f a fortnight???

Is it possible it's because it's biosciences? I keep seeing threads on Twitter from academics in the bio/medical fields who say we should still be distancing and mask wearing, basically seeming more risk-averse.

In Scotland the universities have gone back with 1m social distancing. It's guidance from Scottish Gov.
This will have a big impact on them being able to operate anything like normally.
However some are definitely making more effort than others

And of course students have to wear face mask in class as it's still law for indoor crowded settings here.
I don't see how lecturers can feel unsafe with these mitigation's. The universities have had to follow more stringent guidelines than many other sectors that don't have social distancing anymore🤷🏼‍♀️
And has PP said there is very high vaccine uptake in the student population.

Good point sartorious - with the mitigations of distancing, masks, vaccines etc teaching Scottish uni students looks like one of the safest places to work in the UK

DS1 is at Manchester - as part of his enrolment he was asked if he preferred on line or F2F. He chose F2F

So far he has between 5 or 6 in person lectures, and they are working on breaking them into smaller groups still, but has had a couple of 121 and smaller group sessions in person too. He said the lectures seem to have about 100 in person attendees, on average, but that he has noticed there are quite a few "on line" students who log in to watch the lectures.

That's 5 or 6 in person lectures a week at Manchester (so far)

This would be a great subject for a MN campaign.

It’s utterly appalling. I have no words. Another 100 students is around a million pa in fees isn’t it? I VERY much doubt the unis struggled to sell those extra students their expensive accommodation. Sorry to be so cynical but the lack of transparency about this is appalling.

Well done to Birmingham with the full lecture halls.

The student on the thread who said lectures were just a chance to zone out maybe shouldn’t have bothered going? The whole point of uni for me was to listen to people who were eminent in their research and thinking and learn from them.

At my institute and the one my husband works at class sizes above a certain number have to be taught online. We've also got a member of staff who has refused to get vaccinated so all his classes are online.

A friend who teaches at the University of Surrey already knew in April 2020 that it would be solely online teaching for Oct 2020-June 2021. Now he's back 3 days a week & the rest online.
His son has deferred this year at a RG university on his father's advice as he honestly didn't see there being any change from this year to last year & he has been proven right

@sartorius

In Scotland the universities have gone back with 1m social distancing. It's guidance from Scottish Gov. This will have a big impact on them being able to operate anything like normally. However some are definitely making more effort than others

And of course students have to wear face mask in class as it's still law for indoor crowded settings here.
I don't see how lecturers can feel unsafe with these mitigation's. The universities have had to follow more stringent guidelines than many other sectors that don't have social distancing anymore🤷🏼‍♀️
And has PP said there is very high vaccine uptake in the student population.

We're at scottish institutions and it's class size that is determining if the class is being taught online.

DS1 is at Birmingham where they are effectively running two streams atm, one 100% f2f and then every lecture repeated in more on line friendly format for those that can't physically get there. Must be a massive workload for the department on top of the increased numbers but as a dyslexic its perfect for him as he gets human contact but has two versions of each lecture he can watch back later and make notes.

Plus Marquees put up for summer graduations have been retained for 'outdoor' in person lectures and tutorial spaces

His son has deferred this year at a RG university on his father's advice as he honestly didn't see there being any change from this year to last year & he has been proven right

How has he been proven right?

My RG university has gone from 100% online last year to 100% f2f this year

Most RG universities I know of are at least half f2f

Fair enough to defer but most universities are not the same as last year

We've also got a member of staff who has refused to get vaccinated so all his classes are online.

@backoffice

We've also got a member of staff who has refused to get vaccinated so all his classes are online.

You have to wonder if they are in the right job - were they worried about germs before?

It isn't that he has refused to teach in person. Health & Safety at our work have said that as he is unvaccinated he poses more risk to our students so they have stopped him from teaching in person.

It is very varied. Where we are any groups over a certain number must be taught online (we have cohorts of 300+ so any full cohort lectures are online).

For those who are absolutely furious etc etc I do understand for those HEIs where its still 100% online, however IME with friends and family most workplaces are still in a phased return/some mitigation/option to WFH etc. As long is the universities are upfront about the delivery of content, offer pastoral support to those who are struggling and offer some face to face teaching it can't be all bad. An awful lot of students work around university (due to the hideous fees) and online lectures that can be accessed around work etc can be really helpful for some students. Going back to a very rigid fully face to face timetable can be difficult for some students.

They haven’t been upfront though have they? Just a blanket ‘we are doing blended’ as a uni, which for some courses seems to mean no face to face at all.

Well small update from dd... Some of her lectures are now live online instead of the prerecorded online? I'm guessing they are classing this as f2f... Total joke...they have no idea whether all the 2nd years in private rented accommodation have managed to get decent WiFi.

Her start to second year is an online tutorial on Monday. Fortunately, her tutorial group have a f2f tutorial with the Course Director the following week...I'm not sure dd is confident enough to rock the boat but I think there are a few in her group who will make noises and get supported by the whole group.