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Original poster

Are Firsts the new 2:1?

272 replies

Cranmer · 20/07/2020 17:15

Over the last 2 years we have had 6 nieces/nephews/God children and family friends graduating. Without exception, everyone of them has received a first. The courses range from nursing, graphic design to engineering and geography. The highest A level grade any of them achieved was a B and they all went to ex-poly type universities.

When I went to university back in 1994, there was 200 on my course and not a single First awarded. Are students just more able? Are 2:1s seen as good degrees still? Why are so many Firsts awarded now?

OP posts:
Hardbackwriter · 21/07/2020 10:42

You're right - clearly my degree wasn't in maths! 1 in 15 still isn't the once in a blue moon occurrence that people are suggesting was the norm, though, is it?

ErrolTheDragon · 21/07/2020 10:57

My chemistry course 79-82 (which started with a cohort of about 100 but they were fairly ruthless about chucking people out if they failed resits so maybe about 70 took finals) got 6 firsts. I'm pretty sure there were significantly more 2:2s than 2:1s too.

Piggywaspushed · 21/07/2020 12:16

Article about this in The Times today if anyone gets it.

ErrolTheDragon · 21/07/2020 18:48

I put a sharetoken link upthread, piggy

Piggywaspushed · 21/07/2020 18:59

Thanks errol ; didn't spot that!

TeenPlusTwenties · 21/07/2020 19:08

You lot and your glass boxes don't know you were born. Smile
We had our finals results read out, by classification, alphabetically.

Piggywaspushed · 21/07/2020 19:29
Shock

Glasgow University put their results outside the uni for passing public to peruse! I wonder if they still do this... seems a bit no GDPR compliant...

BasiliskStare · 21/07/2020 19:35

1980s less than 5 % firsts where I was - but then approx 15 % overall went to university not 50 % Not sure if that adds to the argument

ErrolTheDragon · 21/07/2020 19:40

1980s less than 5 % firsts where I was - but then approx 15 % overall went to university not 50 % Not sure if that adds to the argument

If a First had a set 'value' then there should be a lower proportion now than then.

Danglingmod · 21/07/2020 19:43

3% got Firsts on my course, early 90s (6 out of 200), essay subject. I was one of them.

I don't think I worked really hard (though I think my definition of "working hard" and others' probably differs), but I was naturally able at my subject. We definitely got no guidance on how to get a certain mark or improve your grade or what they were looking for.

Shimy · 21/07/2020 19:49

@Hardbackwriter could you point me to your figures source pls, thanks.

dementedma · 21/07/2020 19:57

Dd2 got a first. She worked really hard and am proud of her but I proof read her dissertation and no way was it first standard..or what would have been first standard back when I graduated. I scraped a 2:1 and there was only one first on my course,30 plus years ago. Definitely dumbed down

TheMarzipanDildo · 21/07/2020 20:04

I know it’s true and all, but these threads always seem a bit snooty. I’m the sort of person who stays up all night working but a first still seems bloody unlikely (after the millionth 68 anyway).

And there’s an implication that because more people go to university there much just be loads of thick people there to make up the numbers.

MiddlesexGirl · 21/07/2020 20:50

I first graduated in 1986. 1 out of my cohort of 40 got a first - she was a mature student. About 8 got 2.1s and around 5 got 3rds. No fails.

I secondly graduated in 2018 in a challenging subject for me. I got a first and was one of around 20% to do so.

Hardbackwriter · 21/07/2020 21:20

@Shimy - here: reform.uk/research/degree-uncertainty-investigation-grade-inflation-universities. There's a nice graph which hopefully I've attached to this post!

Are Firsts the new 2:1?
Shimy · 21/07/2020 23:22

Thanks @Hardbackwriter

DramaAlpaca · 21/07/2020 23:30

I graduated in 1985 from a very good university. There was only one first in my year, and that was a mature student.

These days, with my A levels that were considered very good back in 1982, I wouldn't even have got a place on the course. They want at least three As now.

PhoneLock · 21/07/2020 23:38

Glasgow University put their results outside the uni for passing public to peruse! I wonder if they still do this... seems a bit no GDPR compliant...

If they do, I suspect that the students have to give their permission for their results to be included.

FaceOfASpink · 21/07/2020 23:59

something was published in local newspapers...A level or degree results, I can't remember which (it was a very long time ago).

FannyFungi · 22/07/2020 01:42

I was speaking with my mil about this last week. She denied there were more firsts (because she knows everything there is to know about everything). In my first degree only one person each year got THE first. By mid 00s a few more were getting firsts but the degree had changed to modular and the marking was no longer out of 100. I’m back taking a second degree and at least a quarter of this years grads were firsts. Marking is now out of 22 (!) and it seems much easier to get grades that align with a first than ever before.

Danglingmod · 22/07/2020 08:16

It's a bit frustrating if you're right at the top of that tranche though and everyone assumes your "first of today" is more like a 2:2.

Ds is on track for a first. I read his essays; they're brilliant. He's even more naturally gifted at his subject than I was. But, if he gets a first, will his be deemed less worthwhile than mine because more got them in his year?

okiedokieme · 22/07/2020 08:20

@topcat2014

Same here, over half the year got 2:2 or below. Unfortunately because of grade inflation and despite having lots of relevant experience I'm banned from the social work masters for not having a 2:1 (but a 21 year old from a crap university is welcome to apply)

ErrolTheDragon · 22/07/2020 08:33

@Danglingmod

It's a bit frustrating if you're right at the top of that tranche though and everyone assumes your "first of today" is more like a 2:2.

Ds is on track for a first. I read his essays; they're brilliant. He's even more naturally gifted at his subject than I was. But, if he gets a first, will his be deemed less worthwhile than mine because more got them in his year?

That's the main reason why grade inflation is wrong. It is a devaluation. And the other problem is shown in the next post, if lack of recognition of what's happened essentially leads to age discrimination.
Danglingmod · 22/07/2020 08:42

Absolutely. It's so wrong if you have an "old" 2:2 and are denied a post-grad or training place in favour of a "new" 2:1.

penelopeplums · 22/07/2020 08:49

We are waiting for degree results here, whether it's a first or a 2:1 I'm going to be proud, I don't care what anybody else gets.