Oxbridge Aspirants: Sep 2021

[funkysatsuma]

Not sure if it's too early to start this thread in Nov 2019 :)

DS would like Cambridge Economics as the first choice. Would like to know where can we get some help to prepare for the ECAA test - appreciate any pointers/links. Thanks in advance

So, I have just done a swift straw poll of Oxford colleges and HAT/GCSE's in terms of contextualisation. Their wording is consistently inconsistent!! There are an awful lot of comma's, hashes, either/or's to throw you off.

However, looking specifically at the Merton tables, contained here:

www.merton.ox.ac.uk/sites/default/files/inline-files/History%20Information%20for%20Applicants%202019.pdf

And explained here:

Applicants were given a pre-shortlisting rank based on their HAT mark and contextualised GCSE score.

It would seem on high level inspection, that it is still the case that ONLY GCSE grades are contextualised.

People arrive at Oxbridge to read Classics with everything from no classical languages up to A levels in both Latin and Greek and everything in between. It is perfectly possible to pick up a language to a fairly high level in a matter of a few terms of intensive study. It could be that Oxford thinks the students will benefit from studying Homer and Virgil later in their course, once they are more proficient in the languages. There is no shortage of other material for them to study earlier in the course. Apparently the debate is still ongoing, and things may or may not change.

Bum...... just read the whole bloody document. Ignore me completely. I now see that they DID contextulise the HAT. Bugger.

possibly that's because she's not very bright, since I didn't pay for her education.

Come on goodbye.. you’re above that. All of us who pay tax paid for your childrens’ education. The real disgrace here is surely the fact that some state funded provision of education is so openly acknowledged to be poor and failing students that it has to be compensated for. Tackling poverty of aspiration right from infancy is where the fight should be rather than tinkering at the end of secondary education if we really want to make things fairer. Not to derail..

Couch- the report Ive read says that they will be studied in Greats rather than Mods ,ie not compulsory and as for picking up a language to a fairly high level in a few terms,of last years Mods firsts 94% were awarded to students who had studied Latin or Ancient Greek at A level.

Ivy league for elite schools isnt new ,whats new is the number of British applicants and the numbers of pupils going..

hobbema I'm afraid I'm absolutely not above that level of response given the level of the post I was responding to!

@Goodbye.. fair enough! Have just read the Times article, like lots of these things it’s far more nuanced than the post referring to dumbing down suggests. I doubt Oxbridge are quaking in their boots just yet about losing the USP they have spent the best part of 1735 years between them creating.

www.textkit.com/greek-latin-forum/viewtopic.php?t=68947

Interesting article here about possible changes to Classics course because of disparity between men’s and women’s performance in finals.

(Sorry for derail...)

One of the contributors to the comments was right, I think, in that the disparity really lies between those who are ab initio and those who had been studying since they were seven years old, most of whom would have been boys (ie had been to prep schools).

There is so much more to a Classics degree than just the language requirements, and those who are studying a language ab initio spend more time on that and a bit less on some of the other elements, at least initially, so I very much doubt any difference in outcome is solely due to previous experience in the language elements.

At the end of it all, they all end up with an Oxbridge degree, which in itself confers a huge amount of privilege and advantage in terms of job applications etc. Is there really that much of a difference between a first and a 2:1 etc, when they have that magic Oxbridge label as well?

Does anyone know if there is a Cambridge college where you can live in college for 2 or 3 years with a high likelihood of en-suite? We went to the Emmanuel open day and I was surprised how tired some of the accommodation was - and sometimes 5 to a bathroom/toilet! Would be nice to have a higher chance of your own bathroom or at least not share with quite so many!

Can I just add that “the elite students from Westminster and Eton etc” are not “all targeting the US”. Many of the parents of boys at these schools (elite boys or otherwise) simply can’t contemplate paying US fees I am one such.

Oh, and DS1 May have a crack at History next year, hence appearing on the thread :-)

Thanks for a reality check Michaelahpurple. And just to add that DD4 who is an all rounder and might have suited Princeton, Harvard or Yale, actively rejected the idea of applying. She far preferred the idea of Oxford. What a ghastly term 'elite' is too, in this context. Should probably reserve the term for sportsmen and women.

@pourmeanotherglass I've been reading through this thread as I was interested in the contextualization debate and saw your dc is interested in Maths. DS is a Maths offer holder for this year. I'm not sure I would choose his method of picking a college which seemed to consist of a mix of practical (kitchens, gym and library facilities)/ academic (tutors and place in the Norrington table) and the number of Maths applicants each college takes but the alternative Oxford prospectus could help her filter. Very annoyingly after the whole process and having been made an offer ds managed to wind me up spectacularly by wishing he had applied to 'a prettier college' (??).

Anyway, happy to help if I can.

Agree @Michaelahpurple - it's another one of those independent myths that has somehow got traction.

Did anyone notice the The Times had to publish a retraction this morning for suggesting St Paul's employed full time Oxbridge advisors? They don't of course, they have teachers who have a role to support students in addition to their teaching responsibilities.

Did they? Good, I think. I did find the figure of eleven pretty full timers pretty extreme! Mind boggled as to how they filled their time....

I was astonished when some years ago a poster said that their dc's school brought in a "personal statement team" at UCAS time. No wonder colleges have to take personal statements with a pinch of salt. I must admit I only found out by googling that an Oxbridge ps was supposed to be more of a scholarly essay than a list of "Grade 2 Bassoon" or "Under captain of third rounders team" and possibly, "I am passionate about History because..."

@ClarasZoo I think you'd be lucky to get en-suite accommodation for all three (or four) years. Anecdotally I believe Trinity and Homerton have plenty of en-suite rooms but there are also room ballots to contend with. Of course many colleges have many ancient, listed buildings so renovating to include en suites isn't so easy.

This was important to ds (he has a medical issue) and his hair stood on end when we saw some accommodation where the loos were actually in another building! That was the worst, admittedly, but what was his favourite college on paper suddenly became his idea of hell!

@huashan thanks, the alternative prospectuses are useful. It looks like the older prettier colleges may be less likely to have kitchen facilities for first years, which may put off DD who is vegan and likes to cook for herself. St Annes looks good.

DD1, old college in Oxford, had very variable accommodation. First year, obviously at the bottom of the ballot, had a tiny attic room, in a four storey old house off site, with shared bathroom. I hated leaving her there. Plus side was it forced her out to meet people, and they didn't rent it out, so she could leave stuff there. Second year, she bagged a lovely large room on-site, but tiny shared kitchen, and still with shared bathroom. Third year, lovely re-furbed room with en-suite, and access to nicer kitchen. These rooms were always rented out though, so had to be completely cleared every term. At her college, there were designated disabled/special needs rooms, at ground level with on-suites for those who qualified.

Thank you for the accommodation tips. Not sure he is keen on Homerton or Trinity. Going to look at Churchill next week.

@claraszoo - we were at the Emmanuel open day too and my DC also thought some of the accommodation was a bit tired (compared to their older sibling's new ensuite room elsewhere!). We are also looking at Churchill but later in the year- be interested to hear your feedback from your open day visit next week!

Fair enough to do your research if this is a big issue for your DC but bear in mind that your DC may be pooled anyway, and also that some colleges have a wide variation in the accommodation available -- you're unlikely to be able to see the whole lot.

(My Oxford college had very grand rooms but the decor was extremely "tired" -- all part of the charm IMO!)