Oxbridge Aspirants: Sep 2021

[funkysatsuma]

Not sure if it's too early to start this thread in Nov 2019 :)

DS would like Cambridge Economics as the first choice. Would like to know where can we get some help to prepare for the ECAA test - appreciate any pointers/links. Thanks in advance

Thanks @KaptainKaveman. That would be really helpful 😊. It’s considered a small department presumably?

Hear Hear @WarmAndco3y.

i thought there would be a problem, but that it would be large numbers deferring or trying again next year in order to improve their experience. I did not imagine that there would be this horrible debacle and that potentially half the places would be gone for next year.

I don't know what the solution is, but patently it is unfair to the year 12s. Not just unfair, Oxbridge are shooting themselves in the foot by potentially spurning yr 12 talent in favour of some (definitely not all) undeserving candidates for this year. Oxford not so much, as there is a bigger cull after entrance exams, but Cambridge hugely over-offer, in some cases to politely deter less than great applicants, and now they are left with this mess.

Perhaps post A Level applicants could be banned from applying... well, at least they have to sit the entrance exams which should weed a few out.

It’s such a mess isn’t it.

To be honest though, I also think I’d be feeling quite touchy as a Y13 parent when comments are made which suggest offspring might have gotten lucky in getting in to C or are undeserving. I guess at the stage of having been offered a place the margins are quite small on getting in/not getting in. They will all be bright and very able students! It’s a bit like Y12s and Y13s are being pitted against each other which is not a nice feeling. I’m not blaming anyone/anything for this, rather I see it as an inevitable outcome of this absolute shitstorm. It’s inevitable to have friction but it’s just shitty I think.

As a Y13 parent I have to say that I think I'm significantly more relaxed than I would be as a Y12 parent, in fact. I can't see how the quality of education and accommodation at top/ competitive unis is going to be unaffected for both year groups but then the Y12s have the added downside of a big wodge of places already gone. It's a massive old mess. Anyhow, my vote goes to the Y12s for having it worse, I just think the idea of exams at the end of first term is a completely unrealistic one. That certainly doesn't mean I don't have the utmost sympathy for the Y12s, because I do.

I just think that, in the absence of exams, it was inevitable really that allowances were going to have to be made for the current year 13s and they were always going to have to be given the benefit of the doubt in the end. It’s just a shame it took GW et al until the 13th hour to realise this!

It’s an imperfect system in any year anyway, with some outstanding candidates inevitably falling through the net. Even the student predicted AAAA with prizes in x,y,z can have an iffy interview or nerves can take over in an exam. The whole selection process is a bit of a dark art, even in the best of years. Getting the place is one thing, what they do with it is another, and it’s impossible to say how it will pan out for any of them. They’re young and they have a long way to go. This is just a point in time.

But I will say that I did see this situation coming. No, I didn’t quite foresee things being as dramatic as 40% grade inflation with no exams. But as soon as Cambridge announced they would guarantee deferrals for anyone upping grades via the Autumn exams, I thought... hmm, here we go...

Personally I don’t begrudge any student a place anywhere this year as it’s been a bloody shambles and they’ve had no chance to prove themselves, which must be very frustrating indeed. What a mess. I would be livid if my DC was moderated down, only to then receive their CAGs a few days later and find out their first choice course was now full. And the poor BTEC students still haven’t got their grades. Outrageous.

The reason I am annoyed is because these things are avoidable with a bit of foresight. Eg. if they have 50 extra students this year for a course that can only admit 150, then maybe half will need to defer (or something like that), but what would be helpful is if they could issue a statement that this will not mean x% less places for 2021 because the whole thing is stressful enough without feeling that the odds are even more stacked against you than ever because the govt are a bunch of dipsticks, frankly.

I agree @quest1on - they need to reassure the new year 13s now. If some offers need to be made for 2022 that is preferable to a reduced number of places.

I think next year there needs to be a reduction in the number of foreign students and an increase in the number of domestic students to give the 2021 cohort the same odds of a place as normal

I was thinking about this last night. Is it even possible to discriminate? In the UK (and US and Australia), we are fairly unique in that we attract huge numbers of foreign students, who to be fair, also bring in a lot of money and skills. But, perhaps for this one year (next year) we could ask THEM to defer? On one of DD's TSR threads there are currently a majority of US students posting......

In addition to above suggestions, I think they need to create a few more spaces each year, for the next few years. I imagine some people might be asked to defer again next year.
Some may re-apply the following year with desirable grades if they don’t even get an offer next year ( this may be more difficult to quantify). But it just gets perpetuated forwards each year.

I don’t know if it’s possible to discriminate against international students Baaa. but yes, reducing those numbers could be one possibility. Or they could offer more places for 2021, but make it clear to all applicant there is the option to defer without it reducing your chances of an offer? Or just commit to another bulge year and seek govt funding.

Unfortunately, I don’t think any of this is likely to be clarified before Oct when the UCAS forms are due in. There is no evidence that anyone is thinking in terms of such strategies really, so it’s just likely to be the usual soundbytes and platitudes and “wait and see” approach. Schools may even have to close again, intermittently or otherwise, and all they will do is chuck a few more laptops at a given group of disadvantaged students and call that a “rigorous policy” to ensure no student is disadvantaged (or something like that). Then they’ll spend the rest of the year saying exams will go ahead as normal, only to U turn in April. Nothing would surprise me at all.

To make matters worse, I understand Durham is in an even worse pickle. They vastly over-offer.

Where will have places? Probably only ex-HE colleges at this rate.

Yes, we are assuming teaching and exams will go ahead. What about entrance exams? They may fall by the wayside, in which case they may as well draw lots for (the lack of) places.

Perhaps just cancel all university admissions for next year, and then move to a post-A Level admissions system which does not reply on dodgy predictions.

You don’t have to use up all five choices on the UCAS so I would recommend keeping at least one back for a later application when you might know which universities are a better bet for an insurance offer...

I don't know how the deferring for a year is going to work in the science topics. For these subjects even a gap year was frowned on, because a student had done no maths for a year. Some will have had a gap of 18 months in their maths if they are deferred until 2021, without having completed the A level syllabus in the first place. Is being a certain standard in maths for going into science at Oxbridge important or not?

So what are thoughts on encouraging gap years or not? I do really hope there is an opportunity to state somewhere (perhaps on SAQ?) that ds would take a gap year for sure if it meant more chance of an offer. As he's interested in doing languages, he could certainly use the year well even though it wouldn't be his preference to take a year out in the first instance. If there isn't a tick box or place to say, what will others be doing?

@JustRichmal I think I read somewhere that some students were being offered something to support the transition - some extra week's of tuition of similar to ease them back after such a long break in studies. I imagine that will be for the science and maths topics particularly but I'm not sure. And very unhelpfully I can't remember where I saw that because basically I'm constantly on social media at the moment woofing up all the talk about the situation in a way that I think perhaps suggests I'm possessed.

Irma - yes I suspect the deferral situation will be even worse at Durham too. Great!

I think next year there needs to be a reduction in the number of foreign students and an increase in the number of domestic students to give the 2021 cohort the same odds of a place as normal

Fat Chance. Universities rely on overseas students' fees too much (for their fat salaries). I am hoping there'll be as many places next though, as my nephew has been planning to go to Oxbridge almost his entire life. He'll be devastated if he doesn't get in.

Since EU students will need to pay international fees next year it may be that Oxbridge are factoring in a reduction in the number of EU students for 2021 entry - places which can then go to UK students

Joining you as a parent of a Yr12 who’s applying to Nat Sci at Cambridge. I feel like she’s screwed! I doubt her second choice of Imperial will be any better/fairer.

First choice here is Cambridge And 2nd is Durham
Trying not to despair, 😔
Been his dream for years and always works hard....

What a total mess. So unfair. I am so angry but I feel totally helpless. What can be done?

Joining in the despair. First choice Cambridge second choice Durham.

DS is blissfully optimistic though that ‘things will be ok’ but suspect that is not the case.

Not sure what to advise him really. I’m just watching and reading and hoping to enable him to make good decisions.

Cambridge and Durham here too! DD is keeping her head down and not flapping at all (unlike me). I suspect she hasn't realised that Durham isn't a 'safe' back up option at all!

Our DC ‘sound’ similar. Just getting on with it and hoping it will all be fine.
@Crikeyblimey same here, just watching, listening and reading, hoping when the time is right, the right decisions for them are taken.