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Higher education

Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

Elitism at Oxford

384 replies

piso · 09/05/2019 10:03

I thought I would post this, not to put people off, but rather to make them aware that Oxford isn't the bastion of egalitarianism that it claims to now be.

My Dd is in her first year at a well known Oxford college. It is an old prestigious one, that has a reputation for being particular pro state school.

In her year group, there is a clear clique of London schoolers, think St Pauls and Westminster. They tend to bother with one another only. "Do you have a place in London?" "I'm from London, smugly the middle bit" "Oh you're so South Ken"

Then there are the old Eton boys, Radley boys etc who seem to also stick to one another.

Private dining societies are still a big thing in Oxford. Whilst apparently they are open to non private school kids, you have to be invited and considered suitable. Ergo, those who come from certain families, went to certain schools.

Favourite activities are skiing and horses. Where are you going skiing this vac? Oh you don't ski? "Our family have known each other forever, we always ski together at Klosters"

DD's neighbour for example is a third generation Oxonian. She proudly caresses her signet ring when talking down to others. She said in freshers week that she'd only consider dating someone from Eton, or Harrow if she had to as she wants a husband like her dad. This girl didn't even get the entry requirements for her course, but after some negotiation got in.

My point being, far from reverse snobbery, is that there still is clearly a large group of hugely entitled people at Oxford. Being born wealthy is certainly none of their faults (nor is it a problem!). DH is from the boarding school type of family, but there seems to be a high preponderance of rich, London type who are keen on being exclusionary.

Never have I been asked in a snobbish way where I went to school, but dd has numerous times, and not in an interested way; a way to see if you are suitable for friendship.

Some friendship groups at her college this year were very much decided based on appropriate background. You get a tick if you're from London. A tick if you went to a select few schools. A tick if your parents know of one another. Another tick if you have a lodge somewhere too.

OP posts:
marfisa · 14/05/2019 21:51

As a young woman I preferred older men because they were more confident. We didnt mix much with postgraduates but I did date a 3rd year briefly in my first term - what's boak about that?

alreadytaken, I don't think that's boak at all. It's not the idea of young people dating at uni, or even young people dating older people at uni, that's cringeworthy in itself. It's the way Maria phrased it, presenting the male postgraduates as some kind of prize the younger women were drooling over Hmm

MillicentMartha · 14/05/2019 21:52

Flipping heck. If your DC aren’t using university as a RL Tinder then they’re doing it wrong! Grin Maybe more Tinder than Match.com, admittedly.

MariaNovella · 14/05/2019 22:27

Gosh, why the priggishness, marfisa? Wink

howwudufeel · 14/05/2019 22:31

Priggishness! The irony?

Devondoggydaycare · 14/05/2019 22:35

Post grads preying on freshers was definitely a thing in my day. "Steve" in my corridor was notorious for helping the freshers settle in, the more the merrier based on the sweepstake he had with our porter.

It's not just those from private school though who treat some as though they are invisible. There are some ridiculous braying posts on social media from those from state schools who thrive on the whole Oxbridge Boat Race, May Balls etc thing. It's so obvious that they are trying just a little bit too hard and those at either end of the Oxbridge social spectrum are cringing at their Instagram & FB accounts.

MariaNovella · 14/05/2019 22:44

Yes, priggishness. Since when did the mating market become off limits as a topic for discussion? Grin

goodbyestranger · 14/05/2019 22:46

So Devondoggydaycare, you are on (or would like to think that you're on) which end of the Oxbridge social spectrum exactly?!

howwudufeel · 14/05/2019 22:47

You are weirdly over invested in your dss’s dating.

ErrolTheDragon · 14/05/2019 22:51

Since when did the mating market become off limits as a topic for discussion?

About 1817?

goodbyestranger · 14/05/2019 22:52

Errol you're good at this Grin

howwudufeel · 14/05/2019 22:52

Why does the name Mrs. Bennett keep coming into my head?

MariaNovella · 14/05/2019 22:53

The Victorians discussed mating endlessly. Haven’t you read 19th century literature?

goodbyestranger · 14/05/2019 22:55

Well you do seem to have a monopoly on 'cultural capital' Maria, so I'll assume that was rhetorical.

ErrolTheDragon · 14/05/2019 23:14

The Victorians discussed mating endlessly. Haven’t you read 19th century literature?

Yeah, but they should have quit while they were ahead.
Though I was wondering just now if there are any latter day Veneerings who could do with a reminder of that cautionary tale.

MariaNovella · 14/05/2019 23:18

The pearl clutching on this thread is extraordinary.

People discuss mating. Students (gasp, shock, horror) have sex, with lots and lots of different partners. They evaluate one another as potential life partners pretty constantly.

None of this should be news Smile

marfisa · 14/05/2019 23:22

Exploring and experimenting with love and sex and relationships at uni: totally normal and totally great.

Describing this reality in the one-sided, gender-imbalanced way you have described it, Maria: outdated and weird.

I suspect we see the world in very different ways.

The university years are formative years, a time when most students men and women are still working out what kind of person they want to be and what they want to do in the world. That's hugely important, even more important than their academic studies IMO. Reducing this complex process to a 'mating market' doesn't do justice to the richly diverse reasons students go to university or to the wealth of experiences they have there.

goodbyestranger · 14/05/2019 23:24

Maria with the greatest possible respect, it was you yourself who said that the ladies of Bristol Uni who didn't have a suitable mechanism to 'make the first move' on a gentleman in the absence of college formals, and that that was the only vehicle which the ladies of Cambridge Uni knew how to/ could deploy. The tone suggested pearl clutching in the strongest possible measure.

goodbyestranger · 14/05/2019 23:25

Cross post.

Yes, dead weird.

MariaNovella · 14/05/2019 23:26

I didn’t attempt any sort of full picture of the mating market - the anecdotes of hormonally challenged 18 year old female undergraduates lusting over older students are merely one vignette among many possibilities Wink

goodbyestranger · 14/05/2019 23:26

Also who

MariaNovella · 14/05/2019 23:27

Absolutely not the only vehicle - it’s a competitive advantage for Cambridge females Grin

howwudufeel · 14/05/2019 23:28

I think you need a hobby Maria.

goodbyestranger · 14/05/2019 23:29

Maria on any common sense basis smart 18yr olds aren't going to compromise their chances of making a decent set of friends as freshers by setting their sights on a random from Bristol who's blown into town for a year. It doesn't make sense from any strategic pov whatsoever.

MariaNovella · 14/05/2019 23:34

Not to you, goodbyestranger, because you have deep-seated prejudices against people who do not fit your own narrow set of assumptions about what is desirable. But do not assume your own preconceptions are universal as they clearly are not.

marfisa · 14/05/2019 23:35

hormonally challenged 18 year old female undergraduates lusting after older students

I think I give up now

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