Mental health and suicides at uni.

[justasking111]

The report is of one uni. but is it their fault. We put two DCs through uni. from 1999 to 2003, one of their friends from school did have problems and came home. Is it the pressure of work, the pressure of money, or should some students not be expected to go to uni. would they be happier at a local day college??

www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/uea-student-deaths-mental-health_uk_5c8a47dfe4b0fbd766213fbc?ncid=fcbklnkukhpmg00000001&fbclid=IwAR26GrADNgCTpO5t24QH4QxVkBClSsQ3JwGn1eqSQifxNMmG_w1K4Dyf0z4

I should add, our DS was struggling in 2001 his final year, his tutor phoned us and said that DS was rushing home to his girlfriend because she had issues. Said girlfriend lived ten miles from us, we had no idea DS was doing this. His suggestion was that DS did a year in industry and redid his final year. We agreed and that was what happened, thank god DS woke up and sacked off the girlfriend.

Nowadays this would not happen you are not allowed to know when things are going pear shaped. I was told this in certainty on another thread here by university staff.

How on earth do you know it's the university's fault?! That's a terrible thing to say.

I don't think it was legal for your DS's tutor to phone you even in 2001, unless he had your DS's express permission. Certainly, two years later, I know it wasn't legal.

There are very good reasons why tutors at university cannot violate students' privacy - especially students who are having difficulties. You simply do not know, as a tutor, what harm you could do.

I have been in this situation with multiple students, and it is very difficult for parents, and I sympathise hugely. But I don't think it would be right to change the law.

Read the article!!! I did not say it was the unis fault. What I said is "The report is of one uni. but is it their fault."

If you had bothered to read the article you would know that it is the students who are saying this.

"Students at the University of East Anglia have spoken of their dismay over campus mental health services following the suspected suicide this week of a first-year scholar – the fourth to die suddenly there in less than a year.

Rising anger has been directed towards the Norwich university’s vice-chancellor, Prof David Richardson, whom students criticised for championing the institution’s investment in mental health support in the wake of the latest death."

Sheesh......

Staying at home and going to local college is not necessarily better for MH: it's an individual thing.

My dd is so much better since she left home and went to study in London- she is a completely different person! I reckon another couple of years in the town where she had been ill for so many years of adolescence might just have broken her. She needed to break away, she needed the space to breathe, she needed to believe in her own independence.

She is very clear that this is not an issue with us as a family, she gets on well with us all, she still rings for a chat whenever she is feeling low, she loves meeting up- but she cannot cope with living at home. She is even wary of coming home for the holidays for more than a few days because she knows it triggers her anxiety.

As a parent you are not always best placed to help your struggling child; I am very glad that dd has access to understanding tutors and a system in place that she might not have at a local college.

I have also spoken to students who feel their MH problems have been exacerbated by their families and who have needed to get away, even from very loving homes, for similar reasons.

If anyone had told me what my dd would be like after 2 years away, I would not have believed them- I would have cried for joy if I had (in fact, I'm feeling a little teary now).

I think one should be very cautious about trying to decide for a young adult with MH issues what exactly they can cope with or can't cope with. They need to learn to decide that for themselves.

The students are trying to do something about this themselves.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-norfolk-47576723

When the students are saying it's the university's fault, what they mean is that cuts has been made in student mental health support, so that students may have to rely on the NHS instead.

That doesn't mean that a local college would provide anything at all. The only option at home might equally be the NHS.

But I quite agree with the students that a university ought to be able to do better. And that is almost certainly about the priority of spending.

I have read the article. I also read your post. For the life of me, I cannot understand what you mean. You said 'The report is of one uni. but is it their fault.'

You didn't put that statement in quotation marks, and if it is a quotation from the (very small) number of students referred to in the article, I can't see it.

So, I'm afraid I think you did claim it was the university's fault.

I think there are so many pressures on students. Fees for one - certainly my children and their friends feel this acutely - if you drop out you have potentially racked up a lot of debt with nothing to show for it. Then there's the ease with which they can isolate themselves - from the unis that I know there is help available but the student needs to be in a place to go and ask for the help. They also seem to think that university is necessary - that if they don't go or leave before graduation that they won't be able to find anything other than a NMW job.

Given that mental health isn't great anyway amongst young people it's not difficult to see how moving away from family, friends and support is enough to tip the balance.

SarahandQuack - the OP said ‘is it their fault’ not ‘it is their fault’ (but should probably have added a question mark).

Oh, thank you arowana! That's clearer. Sorry, OP, I really did misread that - and I didn't understand your follow-up post at all, probably because we were cross purposes.

No, it's not their fault, then.

I agree with cory on the whole, though TBH I am not sure throwing money at student support is necessarily that productive. You can be in a horrible situation where you fund all sorts of things, but you discover they're not making the slightest difference. I don't know anything about UEA, but it certainly happens. If that's the case, sadly, I can see why they might not want to waste their money on things that weren't working.

We don't know why these tragic events happened.

I think the main issue here is the growing mental health problem among young people in general, not just university students.

This is for a wide range of reasons - lack of resilience, social media, lack of funding, and perhaps also a normalisation of MH issues which can mean that teens think this is normal.

I found the petition, the reasons for signing, should be read. You just want to hug these young people.

www.change.org/p/david-richardson-directly-address-the-mental-health-crisis-at-uea

I think students/young people are very resilient, but they are also being asked to cope with pretty difficult things. More so, I think, than when I was that age (15 years ago).

I do wonder if the bums on seats, unconditional offers, reducing offers may play a part in this. The student gratefully accepts offer, gets into debt, then flounders on a course that perhaps was not really suited to them in the first place.

The question of informing parents is a tricky one.

Alongside the students with supportive parents who can be relied on to say the right thing, there are others who would consider it shaming to have a child with MH issues- or who would simply go into denial and tell them that there is nothing wrong with them. Which is exactly the kind of thing that could tip somebody with high anxiety into suicide. Others would get extremely angry at any suggestion that their child might not be able to cope with their studies and that the money might be wasted.

Dd has had at least 2 friends whose families reacted in exactly this way: anger and denial and a sense that their child was letting the family down.

As a tutor and Personal Academic Tutor, even if rules were different, I am not sure how I could forgive myself if I was the cause of somebody's suicide through revealing confidential information.

There are no rules against asking a student if they have family support or if they should perhaps be going home for a while. We do that sort of thing every time. But a student says they do not want to contact their family, they have a right to decide that. They may have very good reasons.

Cory I do wonder if some parents just want to brag that their DC is at uni. without recognising it may not be right for them.

My DS had a friend at uni. his mum phoned me in a panic, she knew something was seriously wrong but her DS would not communicate what to her. I asked my DS to casually take a trip up there to see what was going on. He did and returned with his friend and all his belongings. He was suicidal. His Mother was just glad to see him safe and sound.

I should say the DS never went back but went on to do great things elsewhere and works all over the world.

I also think that it should be easier for families to raise concerns with universities. I understand that they can't divulge information etc but surely there could be a way for parents to flag up concerns just so that a welfare check could be made?

When I worked at a university each student had a personal tutor who they could talk to about any problems, including with their work.
I was one and if necessary could refer students to further support.
I know, for financial reasons, the university where I worked has now more students and fewer staff.
Thus there is very little personal contact between staff and students.
I imagine this is the situation in many, if not all, universities.

You can flag up concerns if you consider a welfare check needs to be made, just as you can with any adult. What you cannot do is know the outcome of the check without the specific permission of the student.

justasking, my best understanding is that students who are struggling academically aren't particularly more likely to become suicidal.

We still do have a personal tutor for each student and as far as I'm aware that is still the norm among universities. It is part of our duties to call in all our personal tutees at the start of each semester for a chat and then to make it clear how they can contact us if they want to chat: we also have 1-2 office hour a week. Mine are usually very quiet: I wish there was more uptake.

We also have a senior tutor in each department whose job it is to deal with problems beyond the remit or experience of the personal tutor.

Woodpigeon - so perhaps we need more personal tutors that students can talk to thus heading off a more serious crisis in their life.

Cory I do wonder if some parents just want to brag that their DC is at uni. without recognising it may not be right for them.

This may well be the case for some students. But ime most students with MH issues are at uni because they really want to be there, many have had ongoing issues for years, many are academically able.

I don't think there is any particular connection between MH issues and unsuitability for academic studies/living independently any more than there is between those things and developing any other illness.

University life can be stressful and stress can lead to added vulnerability, but equally not being able to get an education you want can be stressful & cause illness. The 2 years dd had to live at home after Sixth Form because she couldn't get into the HE she wanted took a heavy tool on her MH. She is much healthier, both physically and mentally, now.

I think this reliance on tutors (senior or personal!) is part of the problem.

We're not trained. Even if we get sent on a course or two on student mental health, we just don't have anything like the training to act as counsellors, and yet that's what we end up doing. Often because students feel comfortable with their tutor, as a familiar face, and will got to the tutor but won't approach an unknown college counsellor or GP. I can understand why students do that, but it's worrying.

As corythatwas says, I think it is still the norm in most universities for each student to have a personal tutor, as well as a senior staff member who is responsible for overseeing pastoral support.

I would guess that the relationship between MH issues and suitability for academic studies or living independently is pretty unclear. Unfortunately, suicides happen for many reasons.