Cambridge University.

[oneteen]

ttps://news.sky.com/story/cambridge-university-aims-to-ditch-most-unequal-title-with-admissions-overhaul-11656787

She does outreach at her old school. She did after all go to a very bog standard state school and her friends from home are definitely not privileged in any sense of the word. But she is under no illusion that she is supposed to be “spotting” a certain sort of potential student.

What does her being "very gorgeous" have to do with anything?

When you are very gorgeous, you aren’t used to being treated as an also run!

I'm not sure why anyone's looks would have an effect on how they expected to be treated by an academic institution.

I didn’t say they did. I said that she grew up totally unaware of how to deal with other people’s pity/condescension because she has it all. Except her university doesn’t seem to think so!

She doesn't exactly "have it all" if she is "quite distressed" and suffering from "cognitive dissonance" merely because she has been identified as potentially disadvantaged, does she? Her sense of self seems very shaky indeed.

I feel uncomfortable that we are talking about a particular individual that we haven't met, without their knowledge, theorising about their psychological welfare. I regret my part in this.

No, her self esteem isn’t shaky at all. She was flummoxed at being treated as a “disadvantaged” person when her self perception was of a highly advantaged person, and she wasn’t initially equipped to deal with something that was more implicit than explicit.

Yeah you're right BadKitten. This is the second Cambridge related thread MariaNovello has dragged this story into and whilst I think it's truly bizarre, getting drawn in to saying unkind things isn't helpful.

maria, for goodness' sake. Having taught at Cambridge for several years, I can guarantee you will find thousands of students who are surprised to find others' perceptions of them are radically different from what they had always supposed was obvious.

Isn't it quite clear why this would be so?

Generally, when you are a child or teenager, you meet people who are quite similar to you. Even in a school with quite a diverse intake, there will be common features. In many schools, the intake won't be especially diverse - if it's a posh area it'll be posh kids and so on. As soon as a student leaves that familiar context, they will discover that there's a whole big world out there, and they may look quite different when placed within a much larger, more diverse group.

My take on the current metrics is that Cambridge have decided to have a go at this using whatever metrics happened to be readily available - essentially postcode and school data. It may misidentify some who aren't massively underprivileged but I'm sure the admissions people in the colleges looking at the relatively small numbers will be able to deal with that. Worst case is that a kid from a fairly normal school who gets excellent grades gets an offer instead of someone from the summer pool who missed their grades.

The more serious criticism, which the anomalous non-deprived girl has diverted us from, is that these metrics may miss some who are genuinely underprivileged - e.g young carers. But Cambridge can only work with the data they currently have, and hopefully refine the process.

But that’s not the situation I am describing, SarahAndQuack...

There are surely also issues of privacy around data usage for identifying disadvantage. How far can a university reasonably go (assuming the data is available)? Should universities be knocking on doors because data has flagged up an individual?

Give it a rest Maria.

Well, what are you describing?

Read the thread!

This is getting boring now.

Look, this is silly. Disadavnatge measure are crude : but thank God they at least exist. I went to a pretty middle class uni (as I guess thye ostly all are/were) , on a full grant, back in the day , on the face of it from an advantaged home but it was chaotic , to say the least and I would never have survived without the label of disadvantage which gave me the full grant. Nowadays, students like me do get more care and attention (and funding) at school : some are resilient, some less so. But , once I got to uni no one paid my disadvantage the least bit of attention. I cannot believe that any student at uni now (unless they have signed up to specific scholarship conditions) experiences any 'cognitive dissonane' of suddenly being told they are disadvantaged! What, do they get rounded up? Are they given a special hoodie?? Stuff and nonsense. I had to queue in a hall for my grant back in the day : that would have been the only outward sign of my poverty. I very very much doubt any lecturers know of anyone's background, except for in pretty exceptional cases, or where it is volunteered by the student.

I think the benefit to genuinely disadvantaged students far outweighs the "cognitive dissonance" experienced by students who are incorrectly identified as such.

Measures of social and economic disadvantage are necessarily crude and indicative only. I'm sure if the universities were able to improve their measures they would jump at the opportunity.

I have read it.

It seems to me you are describing the very common experience of a student finding it surprising that their perception of themselves doesn't line up perfectly with that of other people.

I find it slightly implausible that you are (apparently) describing a student bright enough to go to Cambridge, but unable to understand why the admissions office use some fairly simple/crude measures to determine who might need a bit of an extra chance.

I also find it strange that you seem to think this is somehow a problem.

(And piggy is right - the only reason you'd know a student's background would be if they volunteered it, or if you happened to be the DoS or admissions interviewer who saw them when they applied. Even then you'd very likely forget unless you needed that bit of knowledge.)

I'm clearly not the only one desperately trying to work out exactly what Cambridge did to make this poor girl feel she was being treated in some special way in order to help her out of her deprived existence 😂😂😂

I do hope things have settled down for her Maria. It does sound very odd but she obviously wasn't happy about it.

My DD wasn't thrown by feeling that she was 'disadvantaged', she was more miffed that their email was more based on where she lives than the performance she gave in the pre interview tests and at interview.

I suppose at this stage of the process it's 'computer says yes' (or at least, 'maybe')

she was more miffed that their email was more based on where she lives than the performance she gave in the pre-interview tests and at interview

Sounds like not a very well worded email ...but I guess in Cambridge's eyes - she ticks the boxes in every other respect it was just the fact that had more applicants than places and unfortunately she just missed the offer. Hence, they now giving the just missed offers a chance over just missed grades...which I still feel is the right decision- I think both sets of students may be under the same amount of pressure going into exams although I guess this is dependent on what the acceptance grades were with the just missed an offer DC.

In terms of Maria's post - something doesn't sound right - I know a couple of students currently at Cambridge from disadvantaged backgrounds- there is certainly no labeling students.