Despite having the right grades, my child is not applying to Oxbridge because ....

[TalkinPeace]

• she wants to live in self catered accommodation
• she does not like the small sizes of the colleges / social units
• having to go back to college for lunch while doing a lab based degree does not make sense
• the whole gown and formal dinner stuff smacks of coat tails rather than standing on own feet
• she does not fancy fighting through hordes of tourists while moving between buildings
• having a tutor picked by which college they are based in rather than their research specialism seems very odd to her

Also, for what she wants to do, the course at Oxford is not that well balanced
and Cambridge, despite having a fab course was not a place that felt like home when she visited for 2 days.

So she will be putting other Universities on her form and taking a great deal of stress out of this house.

For what its worth, those of her friends I've chatted to are also ruling out Oxbridge in favour of other Unis because of the first four points.

What are other people's reasons for ruling out Oxbridge, despite having the grades?

I would imagine that for a scientist having Imperial* on your CV would give your career just as much of a bump as Oxbridge would. It perhaps wouldn't if you aspire to be Prime Minister, when PPE at Oxford seems to be the usual pathway.

*DD works for a rival university where they refer to that institution as 'Imperious'.

I don't ever set out to pull people down Piddly or to nit pick, you're reading stuff in which isn't there I'm afraid. Obviously I contribute to Oxbridge threads and other threads about which I know something and I tend to stick to Education rather than anything else. Not much point my contributing to threads about which I'm clueless, is there? Can you redirect your chippiness elsewhere, because it's ever so mildly irritating, and distracts from more interesting points.

uhtred I agree that no young person should go somewhere they think they might be unhappy.

However, I do think it's worth unpicking why you might think you would be.

And if it's because you think you might be surrounded by Tim Nice But Dims I really think you should have a word with yourself.

Ditto the punt punters.

omg, Oceanography is the best ever subject. They have the best field research sites in the world ever.

(Used to work in a lab full of oceanographers & look on enviously).
I think they had first degrees in things like math, biology, env. science, chemistry...

There must be some Tim Nice But Dims at University, but maybe less so than in previous generations. Do you think they congregate in certain subjects?

Anglo-Saxon N&C students in my experience read Tolkien at an impressionable age! Generally go on to be social workers and administrators. Actually all 3 I know well are northerners who come from families with no uni background at all.

The person I knew who did the roughly equivalent degree at Oxford was a northerner from a state school, and is now editor of The Guardian. So not exactly a career-limiting degree choice!

AtiaoftheJulii-
that is advice to Radley students from Radley school, it is not something Oxbridge have said.True if you are applying to Cambridge you will by June(as i understand it) need a good handle on the whole A level statistics, mechanics and pure syllabus, but that is usually (in state schools )tackled by the pupils independently

OP, My DD won't be applying to Oxbridge for a number of reasons:-
She wanted to work part-time earn some money
Preferred a sandwich course gain valuable work experience
Wanted to live in the hustle and bustle of a city.
Balance of having a social life and academics, DD is under the impression Oxbridge will be all work no life
On top of that DH has been discouraging DD for his own reason not reflective of all companies may I say.

DH works for engineering company, they haven't had much success with employing oxbridge graduates in his field, the 3 that they did have lacked people skills and working in teams amongst other things. Also I think DH was saying the company expected more of them since they had Oxbridge degrees, so a certain expectation was expected so when this isn't met after 6 months, there's disappointment and resentment. Dh doesn't want DD to have the extra pressure from having a Oxbridge degree, as I suppose alot will be expected of them when it comes to employment. Sorry if I have offended, but this is some of the realities why DD hasn't applied, please don't shout at me !!

Madam Yes, an internal Radley document, sorry if I was unclear. Interesting reading though.

And yes, the tackled independently bit is what I think makes the difference. I'm not defending any difference, btw! I would hope any university would try to assess each individual in context. (Especially as I have a grammar school son who is likely to do something mathsy!)

Re Radley - I mentioned it to try to illustrate the different expectations that schools have of pupils, not to try to imply that there's any concrete superiority

I think it illustrates the state/private divide. Original poster's child I think at state school so not surprisingly she and her friends are not going to apply to Oxbridge for slightrly strange reasons prsumably because of the influences of their school and friends. One reason many of us pay fees instead to avoid that.

Just over two years ago my potential medic was not greatly impressed by Cambridge and was in two minds about whether to apply. They didnt like the arrogance of some of the colleges and were put off by the lack of early clinical contact. But medics need to apply to their strengths, their academics were good and Cambridge interview a lot of applicants. They found a college they liked, went for interview, met some current students who were normal and were offered a place. Two years on they dont remember how stuffy they found some of the colleges.

They seem to have managed other activities, although in exam term the work/life balance suffers as some of their friends live in the library. They make up for it in May week.

There are strong financial reasons for staying away from London medical schools. You can pay as much for accommodation for a term as Cambridge charge for the year. Oxbridge and some London schools do 6 year courses, a disincentive for some students.

There are some rich kids who have been heavily tutored, scrape the grades and then perhaps struggle more than state school pupils who scrape the grades. The real impact of parental money comes well before they apply to university. There are also some rich kids who are just brilliant.

Maths students have to decide whether to hold difficult STEP offers or choose somewhere like Warwick with slightly less demanding STEP offers. I suspect fewer state schools pupils have the arrogance to hold the offers, although that is only part of the answer. Maths does need a whole separate thread.

Why is it arrogant to hold the offers?

To avoid what exactly Janet? .

Our state school regularly gets students (both sexes) into colleges such as Kings for maths, and I don't think anyone in the school regards going for it as arrogant. STEP is a necessary evil if you want the place.

Talkin

Might it be a good idea for her to post some of her concerns on The Student Room? Some answers from current students might have more credibility for her. It won't change her personal impression of the place of course but might just be worth doing before she finally decides not to apply.

Although I think some of her reasons are odd, I do actually think 3 years is too long to spend at a place where you don't feel comfortable.

Already - do you mean confidence rather than arrogance.

molio your state school is a super selective.

That is quite rare. Most state schools are nothing like yours and people go private to get selection.

'There are some rich kids who have been heavily tutored, scrape the grades and then perhaps struggle more than state school pupils who scrape the grades'
From what I understand,the interviewers see how easily prospective students pick up unfamilar stuff, and link it to the things they already know.Hopefully this weeds out the weak but heavily tutored and favours those with mathematical potential.

pidilly
I've been crossing swords with Molio and Summer and many others on many threads for many years
If I felt fragile about having my opinions ripped into I'd never post let alone start threads

FWIW if you have a problem with name dropping of the massively rich and well connected academics, I do not have a leg to stand on

DaMoves Janet appears to go private so that her kid or kids can avoid the polluting influence of kids like mine. The point about STEP really was that both alreadytaken and Janet are, in different ways, homogenising state kids and private. Both sectors are hugely varied. I think these caricatures do no one any favours and are pretty ridiculous, being often hugely wide of the mark.

TP I didn't name drop. I mentioned the son of a significant donor as not getting an easy ride in. I don't feel any need whatsoever to 'name drop'. It's rather insulting on a number of levels that Piddly thinks I'm bragging simply because I mentioned knowing someone with obvious wealth. Their wealth means absolutely bugger all to me.

Yawn, didn't take long to see you-know-who's new name. Boasting away as usual.

So, we should all post the worth of our richest acquaintances, and then an impartial adjudicator can decide who's allowed to have an opinion

Janet
Why do you bother to name change and then post in a manner that makes you utterly and completely identifiable.

If Talkin's Dd's college is the one I am thinking of I think the fee thing is entirely irrelevant to this discussion.

I have never voluntarily name changed anywhere. I am with M on the bragging thing though - who would be impressed just because someone has a friend who is impressive? It just sounds silly to suggest it is so.

However I do thinkk my point has validity that in an academic private school a child would not refuse an Oxbridge chance for those reasons ... although mind you mine didn't try because they thought they might not get in and secondly when asked by the school declined because it involved extra work and extra classes. In fact one of mine said he would have been happy if his GCSE this week had been Cs as that would better have reflected his efforts, silly boy.... laughing as I type.

I know my kids would not consider Oxbridge- or any English University for that matter.
There are plenty great establishments on our doorstep with no fees.