Liberal Arts Degree - who why where and how?

[Dunlurking]

Does anyone know much about these degrees? Who they are best for, what they do for you as a person and a career basis, where would be good to try in terms of university and how to get in - how competitive they are?

Ds a bit undecided about History, his best subject, as his first degree, loves drama and is a good mathematician, (and doesn't want to throw a language into the mix, which some seem to have). ASs being taken are History, Maths, Theatre Studies and Physics (which he is determined to drop). Is a Liberal Arts degree a reasonable option to explore?

Its tough isnt it. The main thing is that the course is right, but after that its a numbers game, and Universities have a certain number of places which they will be seeking to fill with the best qualified candidates they can find.

It is reasonable to ask them how many qualified applicants they expect and the weight they will give to non academic achievements/interview performance. It may be that Warwick are keeping their grades lower so they have a larger pool so they can select those they find most interesting.

Warwick were very open at the Open Day DS attended. For his subject there would be 2,000 qualified candidates, 350 places, no interviews. A strong PS was crucial, and in the end the boy DS knew who was offered a place had strong languages on top of his predicted grades. Lots of relevent EC ought to carry some weight. They will want to encourage good candidates so have no reason not to be open.

Its tough for DC to understand that their future involves an element of chance. Its not just how they fare in their exams, but how others do as well. One boy apparently missed a grade in each of his A levels and still got accepted onto a good law course. Another had a very narrow miss for engineering, and was rejected by his insurance, but was then picked up by a better ranked Department in clearing. DC control how much effort they put into getting good grades, and which courses they apply to, but then they have to cross their fingers. DS found the idea of tactics, considering comparative advantage, and shaping the PS towards the audience quite difficult. Considering a gap year as a fall back made it a lot less fraught.

Thanks needmoresleep you are keeping me hopeful. You are right - he can always have a year off so has nothing to lose by trying for 2016 with whatever he's predicted, within reason.

Dunlurking Apologies, never noticed your question re Birmingham.
Yes, LAS course was touched on in the Music talk, as allows Music as a major.
There is a talk video here from June 2013 that gives a very brief mention about 15minutes in. We went in Oct 13, same speaker, may have said more on LAS. Enough for me to remember, more out of curiousity. I think we both switched off as soon as we heard 'high achieving'. Tough enough asking AAA/AAB for straight Music.

Thanks for that circular. I will show ds. He likes the look of the Birmingham course. Whether his grades would be good enough is another matter.

Just to throw something else in to the mix, US college starts more at A Level standard. If you look at US courses for international students A Levels often exempt you from '101' courses.

Also some universities are very free about what units / modules you take in your first year, some insist on you taking a unit or two out of your main subject and you can change your 'major'.

See previous posts about US undergrad structure.

We are on the last stretch of open days looking at Liberal Arts at British universities. Anyone else applying for Liberal Arts wanting to pool their progress and impressions?

Very impressed by Exeter, Bristol and also Warwick, who are starting their course in 2016. Durham's course was basically combined honours as they have no core modules. Surrey underwhelmed us with their presentation although it looked good on paper, also they don't offer a History pathway. We have Birmingham and Leeds open days to go. And of note is that Kings' course was in clearing this year - so something that could be traded up to maybe or saved for a late application?

Ds has finished his personal statement. Very challenging! He has decided on an EPQ to help sell himself to Bristol in particular. The necessary A*AA predictions for Exeter and Bristol are uncertain......if he misses a grade we hope an EPQ will help!

Anyone else...

Durham's combined honours in Arts or Social Science is bloody excellent.

I'm not biased of course.

I like Durham but ds is adament he wants a course with Liberal Arts core modules. I can see that it gives the cohort a core identity and camaraderie when they are in and out of different departments over the years while deciding on and then studying for specific pathway modules.

OP if you are interested in the US system, my (UK educated) son is at an Ivy League college right now, so please PM me if you want to chat. It does sound like the US system might suit your son very well. It is fantastic! There is a lot of nonsense about the US system and also a lot of good accurate information on this thread.

Let me add one bit of info: some of the great US Universities are actually cheaper than UK ones if your family income is low. For instance, Harvard automatically gives you a full scholarship if your family income is below $65,000. This covers all tuition and living expenses, (estimated at $62,000 a year!). Admission is need-blind and financial aid is 100% based on need, not ability. This applies to foreign students as well as US students.

How has your son settled, clarashu? Did he find it a relatively easy transition, both academically and socially?

He is in his third year now. Socially it has been great, very easy to make friends and lots of activities that he enjoys.

Academically it is challenging for him because he never had to work very hard to do well here, and the level of work and knowledge among his peers over there is miles ahead of anything he saw in the UK. My son did 6 A levels, (A* in 5 and A in one of them, brag, brag, sorry) but he still feels like he was unprepared for the kind of work he was given in his first year in the US, and that lots of the other students were ahead of him, for instance in maths.

In the US, it is possible to move at a faster pace at a young age because they don't have a system of standardised tests to dictate the high-school classes you take.

I guess that overall the transition hasn't always been easy, but it has been interesting and rewarding.

Thanks for that, ciarashu.

Glad to hear that your son has settled well, although surprised that it is academically challenging insofar as I imagined it would be the same standard as in UK. Interesting!

DD hoping tot do this next year.

I'm reading a book that I would say is absolutely spot on for a combined arts personal statement as well as being really interesting and not a difficult read - "sapiens - a brief history of mankind" by yuval Noah Harari - a Sunday times best seller last year - not surprised - all about how Homo sapiens have succeeded because of their ability to bind societies together by telling collective stories eg about nationhood, money, equality, hierarchy, Christianity etc - I'm so enjoying it!

Hi Leeds If you want to chat, PM me, not that I have much information, but I can tell you a bit about his experience.

Dunlurking I understand that. However at Durham, barely anyone gets their sense of self and community from course friends. The camaraderie comes from your college pals. My best friends were studying completely unrelated subjects, but at my college.

So I wasn't with them in lectures, mingled with others, but went back to my best friends in college and lived life in a unit with them. In fact, DH was one of them.

I did a Bachelor of Arts degree and an additional honours year many moons ago (umm, just over 20), at a university listed in the times top 100 units in the world (sorry, not any of the countries you are talking about - just for reference).

I've worked in media and financial editing and marketing in my career. I had a major in politics (international) and a minor in European economic history). Wouldn't have got these positions without my generalist degree. It's common where I am from, was once jeered as a 'basket-weaving' course in my country, but clearly a very viable foundation for a career.

In traditional Scottish universities you study three subjects for the first two years and often two for "joint honours" for the two later years. There's quite a lot of scope there - many of my friends did history, English and philosophy or English philosophy and social anthropology or other such combinations.

claraschu thanks for the info on the US. Your ds must be amazing to have got his Ivy League place. Sadly ds won't even get 3A*s but he has considered the US. Fortunately some great unis have started Liberal Arts degrees in the UK in the last few years so he's not finding it a problem to stay here. Most of the courses have a year abroad as an option and he can do that year in the US. One of them offers William and Mary I think. I really fancy that!

museumum he's considering St Andrews. They have an open day in half term...
Figment that book sounds very interesting and relevant. Thanks. Will track it down.

imip thanks for posting about your degree and subsequent career. It sounds exactly the sort of direction he is talking about careers wise. I will show him your post. scatter he loved the college we went round (Grey) and wants to pick it up and plant it at another uni offering his prefered course!

Leeds2 is your dd going to apply to the US for "Liberal Arts"?

That is the plan, "Dunlurking"! I think it is great that more UK unis are now offering Liberal Arts degrees but DD doesn't seem to like the course content!

My engineer student son and his friends ridicule arts student friends of theirs on facebook but I think that's just engineering students for you. I don't think a "liberal" arts degree is treated differently to an "illiberal" one though. A Liberal arts degree sounds especially Guardian readery.
#arts degree#job centre is a common insult.
I suspect arts students have similar insults to hurl at engineers though.

Yes funny that 2rebecca. There was an excellent article in the Guardian here earlier this year where Professor Churchwell pointed out that most of the cabinet have a humanities degree, as do most of the main world leaders, with the exception of Angela Merkel.

Good luck to your dd for next year then Leeds2. Some of the core modules wouldn't appeal to me either but ds seems happy about them!

Posh rich people aren't typical though. They'd get good jobs via the who they know system regardless.