Support thread for anyone applying through UCAS this year

[Lorelai]

Following on from a thread in chat I thought I would start this so that we can hold each others' hands through the UCAS process with all its challenges.

Who's with me?

medicine courses have quite a high initial drop out rate, I suspect PBL was an attempt to remind students from the start why they were at medical school. Newcastle/Durham is another one that culls based on UKCAT.

60% of applicants to medical schools get no offers. It is probably considerably lower for those like Yellowstone's son with good AS results but virtually all interview and you can't predict how that will go, or how you will do at BMAT. Unitarian's child approached it very sensibly.

Quick responses for medicine can be interviews but are often rejections, so initially no news can be good news. Medicine courses are quite long and the pecking order when you apply can change by the time you leave. Although it may make it a bit easier to find a job if you've been to a highly rated school that effect doesn't last long.

That's really interesting even to non medic applicants unitarian, and well done to your dd. Lovely to hear it all worked out so brilliantly for her in the end in spite of the wobbles along the way.

Can anyone confirm that it's OK to submit UCAS application with fewer than 5 choices and then add more later? How difficult is it to amend the choices after?

One of DD's friends got in third time round. He has become an expert on strategy and spends a lot of time on TSR giving wise advice.
I stalked on TSR that year and had identified him as a really nice guy and wanted him to succeed almost as much as I was rooting for DD. It tickles me that they are now friends.

Many do succeed the second time round because they have a better grasp of strategy.

DD was resistant to the fazing and found it quite funny. She let it be known that she was at a bog standard comprehensive but, hey, here I am at an interview. It never failed to shut them up.

I really like that account of the fazing thing. It happens for years in medicine though. I always get fazed so well done to your DD unitarian.

Imperial give out offers in two and a half tranches. One lot of interviews/offers are given out round about Dec/Jan and these will be to the top flight candidates (ranked by bmat score) who are likely to also be oxbridge candidates. The second lot of offers are in March when Imperial has been rejected by those who have accepted oxford or cambridge. Then there is a last lot... a trickle..in March. Personal statements are as likely to be looked at by a GP as by a consultant so finer detail of exotic work experience doesn't always impress. The more down to earth on the panel tend to ask what book the candidate has read recently unrelated to medicine.

yellowstone I have left Birmingham out by choice. Of the midland medical schools, Nottingham graduates have been impressive recently.

UCL is, of course, the best medical school at preclinical and clinical level nationally and probably internationally for all sorts of reasons.

Will catch up on here when I get time to read it all. DD always wanted to do medicine but has had to forget it at this time as her grades at AS weren't anywhere near. Shame as she met most of the GCSE criteria. At least we don't have to go through the horror that is UKCAT.

What has your DD applied for adamschic?

Wouldn't GCSE + Good UKCAT or BMAT get around disappointing AS? Couldn't she put down a couple of med school choices to test the water? (I see that the PS could then get awkward but it's a shame if that's her dream and she was top of her school at GCSE (which I think you said somewhere she was)).

gelatinous- on The Student Room, Minerva (helper) says you can add choices later, up to UCAS deadline, if you haven't done all 5 initially, but can't change PS, reference/other bits.
I hope that is correct as my DC has sent off UCAS form with just 4 choices on it. If he gets a reasonable offer before January 15 from one of the 4, he wont add a 5th choice, and if he doesn't get an offer then he will think of a 5th choice.

UCAS website agrees:

www.ucas.com/students/offers/makingchanges

Thanks wolfbrother. I think ds may keep back one choice until he sees how things go too.

Yellowstone, it is a shame. There may be other ways in once she get to uni. Just hoping to get into a good uni atm.

Application submitted here and awaiting reference to be attached etc. Also applied to four and will add a fifth choice if doesn't get the offer he wants. Offers will be unconditional (done his A levels) so hopefully won't need to add a fifth.
Its been a long haul. Applied in 2010 for anthropolgy got 5 out of 5 offers. Then decided to change direction completely to pharmacology, so withdrew his place to start in 2011. Did chemistry A level and now is applying again with fees at £9,000! This had better be the last time.

Not medicine ,politics here.Fretting about predictions ,currently AAB ,almost all the Universities he is looking at have a standard offer of AAB ,Given that his fourth AS is a C should we be looking to try to get his prediction upped to an A instead of the B.The dept involved have said that intellectually he is capable of an A but he has a C currently at AS as he had one disastrous D (other paper an A)which he is resitting in Jan to bring it up to at least a B.
Jeepers this is hard you want to be laid back but my worst fear is that he gets mo offers because it will be so hard to keep him motivated.

was it history perchance mrswoodentop? Just about everyone I know (and from different schools) did well on one paper and badly on the other (the source test one) in history. Mostly they've been told that the results usually improve substantially on a retake as they get better at the skills needed for it at A2, so if that's the case, then maybe the school could improve their prediction with some justification. Without a reason of some sort, I think it can be difficult for them to have a big discrepancy between achieved and predicted grades.

Yes it was the source paper however they have been quite positive as you described.Ds quite relaxed about the prediction ,just happy they exceed standard offer ,history dept have said to keep talking to them .But I just wonder if being predicted enough to get the standard offer is sufficient

adamschic I believe there are other ways but don't know the details. There are foundation courses for medicine - this was the route DD's friend took.

Here's one that came up with a quick google (sorry, my links never work)
www.sheffcol.ac.uk/index.cfm?PID=eac44f4f-3f4d-44f7-919c-f135ed15ed7f&cmd=Course&Course=HFHME1A

And here's a link to TSR
www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=932681

The post-grad route into medicine is even more competitive than the conventional route, from what I can gather, so I suggest you explore foundation courses for medicine before your DD commits to a degree course she might regard as second best.

I reckon he won't be alone having a lower history grade - it seems to me as though loads of really good candidates have tripped up on that paper, so the universities must be used to it and he does have the required grades predicted so it should be OK. But that said, it can't hurt to ask for a higher predicted grade either, especially if politics is quite oversubscribed (I imagine it might be).

This is more informative

www.wanttobeadoctor.co.uk/main.php?page=15

Oh History, DD is doing it too. The source paper results are very odd in some cases the opposite of what was expected (U grades to the bright ones and A grades to the not so).

Unitarian thank you for those links. She has one very bad result at AS now dropped and as some medicine courses are asking for B's so she just decided not to apply. Predicted grades for A2 will meet the minimum requirements at least ABB! It's when you hear that you should forget it unless you are going to get all A*s that one just gives up on the idea. Oh I don't know what to advise her now. Could it be worth applying????? Agggh!

Just plonking myself down in here. Have DD1 going through it this year, will have DD2 doing it next year and then DS two years after that. DD3 is going to be sent down the mines so I don't have to go through it all again in 15 years.

adamschic surely, if she's set on becoming a doctor, given that you have faith in her ability to be a good one and given very strong GCSE's, she should try it with at least one choice, if not two?

Is she going for a course which is similar enough to make the PS cover both bases? Others will know better than me which universities combine the GCSE scores and the aptitude test scores as a filter for interview, disregarding AS results and everything else. I know of one at least which does it this way.

If she gets rejected then at least she won't wonder 'What if?' and that might help her settle more quickly with a view to the graduate course. If she does get an interview, that's her chance!

She'll have three other choices for the alternative courses. I'd be trying to get mine to divvy up their choices like this because I think the possibility of success is there and for your DD that sounds as though it would justify this limited risk.

UCAS form submitted last night - at last!! Trying to edit the PS down was a nightmare.

Interesting to hear about others' medicine choices. We are up in Scotland so DS1 only applying to Scottish universities. He has chosen Edinburgh, Dundee, Aberdeen and Glasgow after visits to open days at all four. UKCAT score was good (hopefully in top quartile) and Dundee and Glasgow in particular select for interview using this. Edinburgh does not interview school-leavers, just mature students, and also uses the UKCAT, so fingers crossed here!

I only had an A and a D at AS level when I applied to medical school not so very very long ago, but had been predicted AAA at A2.

I got through my finals absolutely fine.

If you don't apply then definitely no place.

When I applied it was 6 choices not 5, but I got into both of my two non-medicine choices despite having a clearly medical personal statement.

I'm not saying it's easy but it is possible. I would encourage her (not you!) to phone the medical schools and speak to them directly. That shows interest, confidence and dedication and will also give you answers re individual schools. I know my medical school would be very happy for her to do this.

She is trying for a science based degree and has designed the PS around that. You cannot say really I want to be a Dr. but if not I will have to do this instead.

I will let her read your encouraging and helpful advice. On the one hand I wonder if it's worth a shot but then again sometimes you have to realise that you haven't made the grade.

The AS problem was in a difficult subject and the dept. at school realised that they hadn't come up to scratch. Only one girl got a better grade but a couple of boys did. Really wish we had listened to the teacher and chosen a different subject. She would also have to sit UKCAT.

You can't do that for say natural sciences at Cambridge, but you can for some things.

I applied for a vocational health care course. At interview the first question was "So clearly you've applied for medicine" and it was quite a grilling of an interview but actually the guy was really decent and said that he wished me luck with medicine but he'd gladly offer me a place and he hoped I'd consider it for insurance.

The other course was a science at a reasonable university who offered without interview but had an interview after type deal. Again they obviously knew I wanted medicine, but knew that not everyone gets medicine and people do go the graduate route.

Equally some universities (Aberdeen, BSMS) might reject a medical application but offer Biomedical Sciences.

Just wanted to let you know those things 'cause sometimes they're not obvious.

Wishing your DD all the best with her Science application . Happy to answer any questions.

adamschic has she given up the idea totally or would she still prefer to study medicine above all else?

If the latter then I would suggest withdrawing this year, concentrating on getting the very best grades she can - especially in Chemistry- and reassessing the situation with the results in.

I've quizzed DD and she says another friend of hers failed to get the grades for vet med. He did something called a Gateway course and is now starting his first year of a vet med degree as though nothing had ever gone wrong. DD says the same sort of courses are out there for medicine - but they seem to go under different names.

Don't dismiss the UKCAT exam as a bad hurdle. It could help her enormously - and it's nothing like as horrible as BMAT. It can be practised for and, with the pressure off this year, she could ace it next August whilst doing some extra work experience to enhance an application for 2013.

Of course, if she hasn't already submitted her UCAS form then she could still try for medicine this year. Those GCSE's might get her an interview and then she has to talk her way in. If she's really passionate about it then that should show.
They publish their requirements as though set in stone. They're not necessarily. The prospectus for the uni that made DD the AB offer states firmly that the required grades must be attained in the same sitting. That AB offer was actually taking into account the A she already had for Maths taken the previous year. In other words they liked the cut of her jib so they bent the rules a bit.
If she does whatyellowstone suggests and applies for a couple of med schools this time round then she should write her PS for medicine. The others won't know where else she has applied, will assume that they're the 5th choice, and probably snap her up on the basis of those GCSEs.

What are your DD's predicted grades, if you don't mind me asking, and have you talked to the school about ways in which she could improve/resit? Again, this might be easier if the pressure to log onto UCAS track in every waking moment is removed!