Guest post: "Detention is no place for pregnant women"

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Lucy* was 23 when she fell pregnant as a result of brutal sexual violence. Her mother bought her a plane ticket to the UK, thinking she and her baby would be safe here - but she was detained straight from the airport. She arrived frightened, alone and pregnant, and was locked up.

Lucy spent four weeks in Yarl's Wood between months five and six of her pregnancy. She told me that she couldn't believe places like this existed in the UK.

Her pregnancy had been painful, Lucy said. At one point, things got so bad that her solicitor had to intervene to ensure she was taken to the nearby hospital for medical attention. The staff at Yarl's Wood were dismissive of her complaints; there's a prevalent culture of disbelief, and women are often accused of pretending to be ill to strengthen their asylum case. Concerns have repeatedly been raised about the quality of the healthcare provision at Yarl's Wood, and Lucy had no idea what was going to happen to her or her baby.

About a month after she was detained, Lucy was released. She had nowhere to go, and had to rely on the kindness of strangers until her baby boy was born. Her son is now three months old and they are living in the community, but their asylum status is still in limbo.

About a month after I first met Lucy, I also met Priya* in Yarl's Wood, where she'd been for about six weeks. She was 25, and around five months pregnant; her story is also told in .

I visit Yarl's Wood about once a month, and always take small gifts for the women I'm visiting – usually nice smellies, body lotions and shampoos. When I asked Priya what she wanted me to bring, she asked for a photo of a baby girl to look at, and I felt so saddened by the simplicity of her request. During her time in Yarl's Wood, she'd been taken to Bedford hospital for her 20 week scan, so she knew she was having a girl and desperately wanted to imagine what she might be like.

Priya had been taken late for her appointment, escorted by Yarl's Wood officers, and hadn't had time to speak to the midwife afterwards. She was clearly frustrated, anxious, and uncertain about what to expect. "I used to worry about myself, but now I only worry about what will happen to my daughter," she told me.

She also felt very alone. She has no family, either in the UK or her home country, and her partner, like her, is an asylum seeker. Although they spoke on the phone every day, he lived in asylum support accommodation at the other end of the country, and couldn't afford to visit. At the time, I was the only 'social' visitor she'd had. I couldn't believe how tiny and fragile she looked when we first met, but she told me she felt weak and sick all the time.

She struggled to eat the food that was provided, and had been unable to access proper support for her depression, low blood pressure, and problems sleeping. The experience of detention is immensely distressing, and over half the women we surveyed in detention said they thought about killing themselves. For Priya, pregnancy and the separation from her partner also made her more emotionally vulnerable, but staff were again dismissive and unkind when she sought help for her mental health problems.

Lucy and Priya's stories are heartbreaking, but sadly they are not alone in their experiences. Over the course of 2014, 99 pregnant women were detained in Yarl's Wood – despite the Home Office's own policy that pregnant women should only be detained under 'exceptional circumstances'.

At Women for Refugee Women we know, from the stories of women like Lucy and Priya, that detention is no place for pregnant women. And it's not just our opinion – two recent independent reviews, by HM Prisons Inspectorate and Stephen Shaw, as well as medical and legal experts, have expressed similar concerns about pregnant women being detained. Join our Set Her Free campaign to ensure all women who seek asylum in the UK are treated with dignity and respect - sign the petition here.

*Names have been changed

Womanwiththat article is terrifying.

none of the reputable ones attribute the current health funding crisis to immigration.

A large increase in population - however it makes its appearance - is most definitely the main driver for NHS financial problems. Few people stay in employment for decades anymore, so there is a shortfall in taxes collected. Longer lifespan is usually given as a reason, but that is way down the list.

The internal market of the NHS was in place in 1988. I remember the year before bureaucrats from somewhere (no one had ever seen them before) were scurrying around the hospital where I was working, locking doors after themselves just to go to the loo for 3 minutes. I recall they never spoke to anyone except each other. It was very hush-hush and sinister.

West14

Longer lifespan is usually given as a reason, but that is way down the list.

^^^

Hear hear!

I am heartily sick of being told that a hospital that was planned and equipped for a 500,000 population within its catchment area but now finds it has a user population of 600,000 within that same catchment area due to immigrant is struggling to provide services because its original 500,000 has grown old.

That is disingenuous and woefully innumerate and those that believe and spout this nonsense are deluding themselves in an attempt to deceive others.

Any refugee or immigrant who adheres to a religion that teaches that men are greater than women is a cultural threat.

That shows how much you know about Islam, because that's not what it teaches.

I can't be doing with this po-faced "we need to be able to discuss these issues", when there's been umpteen threads on here incessantly discussing this issue from an immigrant-hating viewpoint and you want to turn this into yet another one.

Should Germany serve pork?

Has anyone asked Germany not to serve pork? You do realise one of the long-standing ethnic minority groups in Europe are Turkish Muslims, yet the Bratwurst remains on sale.

It's interesting all this carping about the NHS, an organisation which employs many Muslims from abroad, do you consider them a "cultural threat" too? Would you refuse treatment from them?

West - so there has been no cuts to NHS funding, no issues with an ageing population and vast cuts to social services then?

Islam may not teach that 'men are greater than women' but that is the reality whether or not you choose to acknowledge it.

Hi Ipty

The German Government have announced plans to discuss the issue. I know that at a regional level in Belgium it's also been on the council agenda.

"The regional arm of Chancellor Angela Merkel's CDU announced plans on Tuesday to ensure that pork continues to be available at public canteens, as well as child daycare centers and schools across the north German state. The proposal is due to be presented by the CDU's group in parliament at next week's regional parliamentary session". From here.

I'm sorry you think I'm po-faced , please be assured I'm definitely not!

I think discussion is vital; suppression of debate, whatever the issue, however repugnant others find it, is a dangerous route.

Immigration on such an unprecedented scale is unknown in our lifetime. Debating the implications, for all who are affected, is happening everywhere and while the crisis continues, so will the dialogue.

Is Islam doesn't teach that men are greater than women, why are there so many more restrictions placed on women than on men in Muslim-majority countries? Things like giving evidence, what women must wear, not being allowed to drive in Saudi? If those things are not from the religion, are they purely cultural?

Any refugee or immigrant who adheres to a religion that teaches that men are greater than women is a cultural threat.

IPity

That shows how much you know about Islam, because that's not what it teaches.

Some verses from the Quran:

Quran (4:11) - (Inheritance) "The male shall have the equal of the portion of two females" (see also verse 4:176).

Quran (2:223) - "Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will..."

From the Hadith literature

Bukhari (6:301) - "[Muhammad] said, 'Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?' They replied in the affirmative. He said, 'This is the deficiency in her intelligence.'"

Muslim (4:1039) - "A'isha said [to Muhammad]: 'You have made us equal to the dogs and the asses'" These are the words of Muhammad's favorite wife, complaining of the role assigned to women under Islam.

Al-Tirmidhi 3272 - "When Allah's Messenger was asked which woman was best he replied, 'The one who pleases (her husband) when he looks at her, obeys him when he gives a command, and does not go against his wishes regarding her person or property by doing anything of which he disapproves'."

I could quote dozens more similar 'teachings'.

Please feel free to come back and explain how these teachings are in no way misogynist or derogatory towards women IPity

And whilst our leaders are debating whether or not to give EU access to 75 million Turks here is a direct quote from President Erdogan

In 2014, Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan emphasized that men and women are not equal: "Our religion has defined a position for women (in society): motherhood."

Quaint - You're going to need to feel free to try much harder then C+Ping from an anti-Muslim hate site.

The "hadith" about women and dogs is a deliberate distortion (see islamicresponsesatblogger.blogspot.co.uk/2010/09/response-to-suggestion-by-wikiislam.html?m=1), which would be laughable if people weren't using such distortions to deny helping refugees.

As for quoting Tayyip Erdogan, you can find plenty of people on Mumsnet , who think the same. Are they a cultural threat too?

Gosh! I read that at least twice and had trouble making sense of it. Is the jist of it that you don't pass in front of anyone praying? Kind of like trying not to pass in front of anyone at the cinema so you dont distract them. Not sure why dogs or women are relevant in that case. No wonder people get confused. Is it the translation or something?

Most women on MN are not the president of a country and they don't suggest it applies to all. Most of us consider that we have multiple roles in society depending on life stage often.

Sorry if this has already been answered but do we know the nationality of either of the women featured in this article?

I take this none of this is true either then

Wali as male custodian of a woman
According to Islamic law a woman needs a wali—a male guardian/custodian—for permission in various matters. Typically a father, brother or husband (a mahram) is a wali.

In marriage, the marriage contract is signed by not by the bridegroom and bride but by the bridegroom and the bride's wali (typically the father or failing that a paternal grandfather or brother of the bride).[104] In the case of the woman's first marriage the father or paternal grandfather is wali mujbir. In this case, the bride's silence is considered consent.[105] If father and grandfather are deceased another male relative may function as wali. If there is no Muslim relative, a qadi may function as wali. An exception to this is in the Hanafi school of Islamic law where a woman may under certain circumstances marry without a wali, if it is not her first marriage. After marriage the husband becomes the wali.

Women need a wali's permission to traveling,[106] conduct official business, or undergo certain medical procedures at least in conservative Muslim countries such as Saudi Arabia.[107] As of at least 2006, women in Sudan, Egypt and Morocco needed the consent of their husbands to obtain a passport.[108]

Or this

Sharī'ah law makes a distinction between adultery and rape and applies different rules.[128] According to the Qu'ran (24:4), the proof that adultery has occurred requires four eyewitnesses to the act, which must have been committed by a man and a woman not validly married to one another, and the act must have been wilfully committed by consenting adults.[128] Proof can also be determined by a confession.[128] But this confession must be voluntary, and based on legal counsel; it must be repeated on four separate occasions, and made by a person who is sane.[129] Otherwise, the accuser is then accorded a sentence for defamation (which means flogging or a prison sentence), and his or her testimony is excluded in all future court cases.[130][Quran 24:4]

As for quoting Tayyip Erdogan, you can find plenty of people on Mumsnet , who think the same. Are they a cultural threat too?

No, I dont think any mnetter ( caveat - unless they are the leader of a vast nation) who thinks women should stay at home are a threat.

I do think - the leader of a vast nation using religion as a tool to suppress women is a threat, yes.

I'm sure you can find similar texts in the bible to those you think prove prove Muslims believe men are superior to women. Are Christians a cultural treat too?

I don't think Erdogan is a particularly good representative for Islam, Quaint. What do the millions of other Muslims say on its view of men and women?

Erdogan is a threat to many people. That's another matter entirely. That doesn't mean that Islam is a threat to the UK or Europe. Didn't Hitler use some Christian principles for the basis of his authoritarian regime with a perspective on women as belonging in the home? Did that then make all Christians a threat? Er no.

Why do you need to know the nationality of the women in the article Icompletely? Is it relevant to how they are treated?

Well it's relevant to why they are in a detention centre, yes. I guess if they are from a country with no immediately obvious case for claiming asylum then the authorities are not going to just let them out, to go AWOL are they?

The thread is about objecting to them being held like prisoners in a detention centre. But until they've been processed what other choice is there? I don't see that in itself as being an abuse of their human rights - nobody dragged them off the street and put them there, they came voluntarily to seek asylum and must accept that there is a process to be gone through, however tedious.

What would you suggest happens to women who arrive in the UK pregnant or who get PG shortly after claiming asylum then? How would you want to see them housed in the interim?

Christians to the best of my knowledge do not allow those particular passages to govern inheritance law or any other laws in the present day. That I believe is the case with Sharia as it is used to form laws that are lived by, and form the basis of legal process in certain countries.

I'm not sure about knowing the nationality is any help either. The fact is they are here now. If there are ways we could make a difficult process better say by at least making access to a midwife easier, say an on call dedicated service that may help matters. Or would have perhaps in the cases above.

I'm sure you can find similar texts in the bible to those you think prove prove Muslims believe men are superior to women.
The difference is that I cannot think of a single country that bases its system of government directly on the Bible: the split between church and state is implicit in 'Render unto Ceasar that which is Caesar's, and render unto God that which is God's'. Whereas Islam - or at least some interpretations of it - mandates a caliphate.

Are Christians a cultural treat too?
Definitely a great cultural 'treat'! All that marvellous church music, stained glass, cathedrals...

What do the millions of other Muslims say on its view of men and women?
For what Muslims think about gender roles, might I refer you to this fascinating study of 35,000 Muslims?

I'm sure you can find similar texts in the bible to those you think prove prove Muslims believe men are superior to women. Are Christians a cultural threat too?

Deflecting again. Christianity encourages forgiveness. Islam demands severe punishment or death. That's the difference, as if you did not know.

The vicar in the church up the road is a cultural treat. He did a hilarious harvest festival talk for the kids!

'Deflecting again. Christianity encourages forgiveness. Islam demands severe punishment or death. That's the difference, as if you did not know'.

How does Islam demand severe punishment or death, West?

'Whereas Islam - or at least some interpretations of it - mandates a caliphate'.

I think you need to be clear here which interpretations and by whom you are talking about if you want to suggest that Islam is a threat. You don't seem clear on that at all. I don't think the agenda of Isis can be described as an 'interpretation' of Islam.

If there are ways we could make a difficult process better say by at least making access to a midwife easier, say an on call dedicated service that may help matters

Totally agree, we must always be looking to make things better and improve things, however that may be in all things.

Is their nationality relevant to their poor treatment in the asylum centre, Icompletely?

You only have to look at christian fundamentalism in the US bible belt to see that there is more than one interpretation of Christianity, and at least some of them are misogynist.

The same can be said for every major religion imo.

Perhaps a dedicated team within the centre and separate out the pregnant ladies. Do you think that would improve matters, emily? Maybe make sure the staff were chosen specially in that section so that instances like this would not occur?