Do schools really cater for G+T children?

[pinkmunkee]

My niece has been put on the G&T register in her school because she is excellent at literacy. It seems to me she's just very bright and very keen, but that's by the by.

When my sister asked how they would be stretching her, being as how she is G&T, the answer seemed to come back as "give her harder work."

She is about to go to secondary school and my sister asked at the intro meetings last term how they supported G+T children and they seemed to reply setting, with the odd gimmicky project to make it look like they're doing something. But they also seemed to say that primary schools don't really do anything.

So I wondered; what are other people's experiences of schools supporting children who are G&T? Primary or secondary, are you happy with your school? Or do you do extra stuff at home to compensate?

dd is exceptionally able in maths. Her primary school do try but its of limited success. She is given extension work in class that in general doesnt extend her - just fills up the time. They do pull her out once a week with a small group of able children and do open ended problems with them. Thats been a huge success. But this years teacher has said she can't promise that will happen this coming year as it depends on funding and available TA time. I've lobbied for it to continue and will carry on doing so if it doesnt restart. I tend to extend her maths homework myself as the stuff she brings home is set for the top group and is just far too easy for dd. Teachers have always been happy for this.

In literacy she is highly able. School finds that much easier, partly because she isnt 'way beyond' like she is in maths and partly because it seems to be easier to extend in literacy within the classroom - to get a child to express them selves deeply and to use ability appropriate language. Books wise we've had no problem - shes taken her own in since reception.

thanks.

anyone else?

It is a bit of a generalisation to say that your son is the most able one in the class! How have you assessed the other kids?
G & T IN schools is actually labelled too easily really. A lot are not actually G & T.
Kids are classed as G & T when they are achieving well , very well or excellent. Teachers are obliged to do their best to cater for all the children. If they are G & T then they will cope well with harder work. Usually you put in the extra work at home. I personally wouldn't because they don't obviously need it and children should enjoy being children.
Kids who are pushed too hard have too much pressure when they get older and fear to fail. If they love learning and enjoy the extra work that is different.

I never understand how parents know their child is the brightest in a particular class either. is puzzling

G&T can mean just mean cleverer than the other kids, not necessarily what most of us would call gifted and talented. Setting can work. The problem is in the mixed ability class. I think so anyway.

Please make sure she's still excited and inspired by literacy though.

I remember at my primary school that once I had completed the year 6 maths books (in year 3) they didn't know what to do with me. As a consequence I had a couple of years 'stagnating' maths-wise before my parents moved me to another school. I didn't really become interested in maths again until I went to secondary school.

You don't say how old your niece is but you should think about the subject matter of the books she is reading - I remember being given some dreadfully dull books suited to much older children, just because I was 'good at reading'.

This was in the 80s though - I hope things have improved since then!!!

Hana etc.: I don't know if DD was the brightest in her class last year. But when I played parent helper, DD wanted me to work with her group, and I couldn't help but notice that in her top set group, no one seemed more able than her.

I know you'll think that's just typical parental wishfulness & boasting, but I didn't/don't have this impression about her brothers, just DD.

So I have half-fancied that she might be the brightest in her year academically (I stress academically, because she lacks skills in many other areas). So I can understand people feeling confident their child is "the brightest".

That said, DD is not on the G+T register! And I actively don't want her stretched (well, maybe a tiny bit, but only a tiny bit) because she is most confident being a top student not a nearly top student. Better she works on the skills she lacks then the ones she obviously has in abundance.

My 6 year old is reading Harry Potter at the moment, yet the school have been sending him home with spellings like 'there' and last year, in year 1, he got told off for correcting his class teacher when she mis-spelt 'seaside' on the board. He can quite easily spell words like 'immaculate' and 'guarantee'. His maths, well, they are making him do sums up to 20 when at home he is doing multiplication, division and sums into the thousands. He enjoys science, but so far, I am yet to see ANY evidence that the school are doing ANY science. He is perfectly capable of explaining the process of photosynthesis to anyone, and is currently, at home, working on yr 6 work ( started at the end of yr 1 by me). The school seem ignorant of this, despite my repeated attempts to explain to them that his disruptiveness when his work is finished is due to him not being 'stretched' enough. All they seem to be concerned about are the children that will struggle to reach the expected levels for the end of yr 2 SATS. As he could reach that level by the end of reception, he is basically ignored in class, and rebels by 'acting up'.

Schools now have to have a G&T register. I expect that it varies as to what they actually do with them.
In this area they work with the secondary schools. I know that one boy, exceptionally talented at Maths went to the secondary school once a week. He is now there full time and has his GCSE at a young age and is working with the 6th form (I am not sure of his age but he can't be more than 14).
I know that a secondary school ran a day for talented writers, they took the best from surrounding primary schools and had a workshop.
I guess that you have to keep asking. I know lots of 6 yr olds who read Harry Potter, it shows that they are bright but not necessarily that they are exceptional. The teacher ought to notice and be setting the work accordingly, sending a child home to learn 'there' when he can spell 'immaculate' must be frustrating for him!

Reading more grown up books can be a bit misleading though. Sometimes they don't really understand what's going on in the book and they can get caught up with reading big books and impressing others. Also, with Harry Potter, so many children have seen the movie that the reading experience is altered by that. Not saying that's always the case but parents can, I think, get a bit carried away by their young child readings.

I did say that it wasn't always the case. I don't see any problem with embracing children's talent either.

Pinkmunkee, our secondary school do very little extra with the children put on the G&T register and I'm quite happy with that. DD was on it from year 7 and has been to a science challenge at a uni, once. However she came home beaming and said that is the sort of place I want to go. So it was worth it for that.

Occasionally there are extra things happening but only a few can go and it depends which sujects they have them down as G&T in.

We were told the next year that DD is on it for 4 subjects and she has chosen her options with that in mind. I know that she is not the brightest in her year. It was the CATS results that they used to compile the list, but she is doing very well across all subjects.

The only advantages I can see that being on it has are, more motivation and belief in their abilities, higher expectations and the teachers making sure that they don't fall back. They do try to do this for all the children but I think they keep an special eye out for the G&T lot.

When I first heard of the G&T register, the day I received the letter, I did a bit of research and learnt that the point of indentification was to track these children through to A levels as they are expected to get 3 A's. I guess the school may have to justify this if they fail to achieve.

I hate the whole G&T thing. My feeling is that schools should cater for all children, whatever their ability. However, I also can't help feeling that perhaps it is right that sometimes it should be the children who are struggling who get more help. Obviously the higher abilities should be appropriately taught, but it seems wrong that children who are already flying academically get even more help.

Also - Harry Potter - ds1 is DESPERATE to read these. He has just turned 7, and ability wise would have been able to read them for a while. But I am keeping him off them because I actually think the stories are too dark for his age - he is a very imaginative child, and the idea of Voldemort would freak him out completely. So we are saving them for later. This is not a reflection of his reading ability - or his understanding - rather he would understand them TOO well!

My dd has just been added to the G&T register at school. They ensure that work is differentiated to her level, this sometimes involves her joining the next year group up for some lessons. They are also part of a G&T cluster group and every summer they run summer schools for G&T children. DD has just completed hers a had a great time. So yes, DD's school do try and cater for them - but possibly not all schools do.

I think it does vary from school to school. The summer school sounds good. There is nothing like this in our area, just in the major cities. TBH unless she was some sort of genius, which she isn't, then it wouldn't be worth the expense, travel etc.

DD wouldn't be happy to do any extra/advanced work. As long as the school is guiding her towards top GCSE grades when she goes back in year 10 then onto top A level grades, that's enough for us.

I know some schools put G&T in special needs. This is obviously for the opposite end of the spectrum to which people normally associate SEN. This allows more time to be given to extra work in the G&T subject.

tortoise, DD is a major Harry Potter buff. She reckons age 9 is about right to understand them. She started on them at 11, as she got into books at that age, still got freaked out at some parts.

Mind you she is not G&T for literacy but due to reading has just been moved into top set for English. She has about 3 books on the go at a time and is now on Lord of the Rings!

I think 9 is about right too - I would worry about ds1 reading them now. Given that he is still hysterically frightened of the Puzzler in numberjacks, I think Lord Voldemort is a bit of a big ask!!

In a way, I'd be happier for him to read them if he didn't fully understand them iyswim!

He is enjoying narnia atm, which I think is a bit gentler.

Not all the children that are on the G&T register have always been recognised as high flyers and/or consider themselves academically able. Often, as in our case, they have slipped passed the teachers attention. Therefore, it was a revelation at secondary school so very worthwhile. This was a case in point to the whole thing (from what I've read) to identify such children.

Yes, I see what you are saying, he will understand them and have nightmares .

tortoiseshell, sometimes kids need the G&T stuff because being ahead of the class in certain subjects means they misbehave. It isn't their fault (nor their parents) if they're particularly able at something. Our DS1 was just put on the GT register for maths and science. Until he was able to do the extra work he was struggling with confidence because he just didn't understand why he was sitting there staring at his thumbs. He was expecting lots of attention from his teacher because he had little to do.

Once he had been identified as needing more difficult work in maths he was much happier and more compliant at school.

Thanks everyone for your contributions. I had no idea G+T was such a contentious issue.

What about homework- is it generally too easy?