Is my 2yo gifted?

[MumofToddle]

I’ll be upfront, I‘ve only created this thread because I suspect I’m right and I’m looking for validation 😂I also know how insufferable that is and that I deserve to be taken down a peg, so please do feel free to disabuse me of my notions if I deserve it.

I think my 2.5yo son might be verging on ‘gifted’ (as opposed to merely clever, which I know he is without needed confirmation from anyone else). Here are some of the things he can do:

• complete verbal fluency - speaks in lengthy, complex sentences, for example ‘mummy, daddy said after we go swimming we are going to granny’s house because we need to borrow her car so you can go to London’. Has a good vocabulary - regularly and correctly uses words like ‘marvellous’, ‘surprising’, ‘mischievous’, ‘famished’.
• very good recall - for example he has a reference book of animals and can tell you the scientific names for about 60 animals, having been told them once or twice on previous readings
• can read simple words and some sentences. We didn’t teach him this so don’t know where it came from. For example today we drove past next and he said ‘N E X T, that says next’. He can read simple sentences in books he hasn’t seen before, such as ‘where is spot?’ (By sounding out the letters to work out the word)
• Can write his own name unassisted and copy letters if I write them first (imperfectly but recognisably)
• can name / discuss his feelings. Has basically never had a tantrum but will say ‘I’m disappointed because I don’t want to leave the park’.

What do you think - gifted, or just bright? It wouldn’t change anything either way as we don’t have any desire or intention to try and hot house him or interfere at all in his very relaxed, low pressure childhood, but I’m curious!

You’re so wrong here. ASD most commonly occurs with high IQ as most ASD (99.9% of it) is undiagnosed.

No it’s because parents of bright early talkers won’t seek diagnosis for what they view as a positive. Google Hyperlexia - there are multiple types and all of them are associated with ASD

It was my quiet laid back DS that is diagnosed autistic, mainly around communication issues but he was sociable if on the "shy" side as a young child (he's now 23). My extremely verbally advanced "tantrum king" toddler was diagnosed with dyspraxia although now he is sure he has Adhd as well.

Every bright child, every early reader, chatty kid, etc. really they can’t all be ASD and why are so many so keen on the notion?

Wrong, sorry to say this 🤷‍♀️

So explain to me why I know so many adults who were early talkers and readers and don't have any autistic traits.

It really just increased the probability, so makes one take a closer look. And there's a difference between bright and gifted.

I find it bizarre that some seemingly have the agenda of labelling every intelligent person as autistic. It's quite clearly nonsense and a very bizarre thing to fixate on.

Are you talking about early talkers and readers or those who come in at the exceptional level? Because there's a difference and the exceptional ones are the ones more likely to be autistic. You can't take one thing and build a whole diagnosis around it, as you clearly understand. There are also many, especially female, who remain undiagnosed, so the possibility is there.

Obviously not every intelligent person is autistic. Those on the exceptional end are more likely to be. I mean really exceptional, not just amazing or super talented. That said, there are those who don't perform well academically (even when intelligent) for many reasons. It's really necessary to look at the whole picture and history as well as more formal evaluations. It should be a process, not a fast measurement.

Interesting that distinction isn't being made elsewhere on the thread though, where people are cheerily insisting all 'bright early talkers" are autistic.

And again for an “expert” you don’t seem to be able to understand that a population where individuals are significantly more likely to have learning disability, will as a whole have a lower level of intelligence. It simply isn’t true that there is an even spread of autism across the same IQ distribution. Even with the addition of Asperger’s to the ASD melting pot (aspergics being individuals with IQs above 80 and no delay in language acquisition) the population is LD heavy.

It isn’t the case that most autistics are hi IQ at all. Those individuals are rarer just very vocal, especially in contrast to their non verbal/limited communication diagnostic peers.

I think its probably too early to tell. I would just enjoy your bright child now for what they are, but remember child development is more of a marathon than a sprint. They might carry on getting everywhere first and as some do, but they might plateu and find most other children catch up and they end in the middle of the pack, some slower starters might even overtake.

@MumofToddle Yes, he is. Mumsnet is famous for saying "Perfectly normal-maybe a little behind!" on posts like this. My dd had speech like this and was good with emotions, nowhere near in the other areas. It's important to remember though that he MAY just be doing things early and he'll plateau and the others will catch up.

Maybe 'bright early talkers' is too vague as to be meaningless? It has no definition. A bright early talker can mean above average but that doesn't make them at the exceptional end. For example, Mozart and Beethoven weren't just talented at music, they were exceptional from a very young age. (Wouldn't be surprised if they were autistic, for that and other reasons). Exceptional creativity can also accompany autism. We just can't see the bar too low for what constitutes 'bright and early'. Of course, there are autistic children who are well behind in communication too. That's why it's a spectrum.

No. Most autistic people aren’t high functioning (IQ over 80) at all. You just only see the ones that are and a fair few of those will be loud but undiagnosed.

And this is why you obviously don't have a clue because you are equating people with learning disabilities with lower intelligence. A learning disability might mean you don't perform as well on standard measures but it doesn't mean you aren't exceptionally intelligent. Standard measures have limitations, especially in the face of learning disabilities. I won't respond to you again because I just can't with someone who doesn't understand that learning disabilities and intelligence have no relation to each other.

Erm, yes there is a difference between bright and gifted. ‘Gifted’ has wained as a term because it’s now used widely as part of ASD terminology. Bright is fairly old fashioned as a term too.

True, but they are the terms being used on this thread, so just going along with that.

Exactly this 👍🏼

My understanding is Learning Disability in the uk describes those with IQs under 80
And Learning Difficulty describes those with barriers to their learning like dyslexia, dispraxia etc. I was using it to describe what used to be called “Low Functioning Autistics” but since the influx of people who believed that “function” relates to how well you pass for NT it is clearer to use LD. support animal shelters I think you believe having a lower IQ/LD is some sort of insult. It really isn’t.

Sounds like my asd nephew at that age

I don’t recognise this terminology. Dyslexia, Dyspraxia, ADHD can be standalone or be co-morbid to ASD. That last term means they can exist alongside/as part of ASD.

My understanding is they’re known as specific learning difficulties. Learning disability is different. All can occur in the ASD population and typically compound difficulties. There are more individuals proportionally with LDisability in the autistic population.

the majority of autistic people have low IQ.

That isn’t correct. From NAS, “One third of autistic people also have a learning disability.”