gifted 3 year old - how to get him in school at 3-4

[ukjalady]

My son is clearly gifted - I am not going to bore you with his achievements to date - but having read up on it - I realize he is waaaay above average - probably gifted stage 4-5 according to mensa.

but as he is born in Oct, he wont get a school place until Sept 2013.

I went to visit a school this morning at their open day and I was rather stunned at the basic things being taught to the reception class - things my son at before age 3 already knew.

i really think he will be ready to start school next year when he will be 3 then turn 4. He will be with kids who are academically his peers; instead of waiting a year then being 4 and turning 5, and so much more advanced than the rest of his class.

i would anticipate that if he is not accelerated early- he will turn out to be a very disruptive force for any teacher as he has a high level of energy combined with his focus.

combined with this, as both his parents are 'large people' he is already looking like a 4-5 year old, not fat, just tall. His friend next door is 7 months older and only comes up to his shoulder. I could easily have seen him in that classroom today, and no one would have been the wiser that he has just turned 3.

Does anyone have any background in this or can offer me some advice based on experience with how best to get my son accelerated at such a young age?

Everyone I have talked to - including schools - have told me unless i get him privately educated - hehhehheh not gonna happen - I am stuck with the current govt rules.

all comments and advice appreciated,

cheers all,

Don't know how I'v wandered in to this section but just want to say that if your ds was as clever as a 25 year old you wouldn't send his ass to work would you? No, because he is 3. Just because he can do the work doesn't mean he needs to or that he will be able to socialize correctly with children on their level.

You are probably going to get flamed, you know. This seems to be one of the things you are not allowed to say on mn.

I know you didn't ask, but is your ds socially advanced? That would be as important a consideration as his academic abilities,IMO. Also, you might find that he is more settled and able to concentrate if you wait a year (you suggest that might be a problem but it is probably just because he is three).

you haven't got a cat's chance in hell.

don't worry about school coping, they will manage fine. they differentiate for each individual pupil and will just utilise materials from another year group or school as necessary.

dd1 works several years ahead of her peer group across the board. was eventually tested at 11.

the nursery attempted to get ds1 assessed a few days after he started nursery at age 3 because he was reading and doing multiplication, and working out change, and different ways to make any given number using different coins etc. the lea smartly refused. he's 9 now and his teachers refer to him as einstein or whatever. never been tested.

dd2 was assessed in yr r (we paid to do it privately as we needed it for something else) and was working up to 7 years ahead of her peer group. (she falls into the vs group v comfortably)

school differentiates fine in all 3 cases.

there is no way on this sweet earth that you will get anything for a bright 3 year old without paying for it yourself.

and he might get assessed when he starts yr r, but only if his behaviour deteriorates to such an extent that it is disruptive, or if it is believed there are other co-morbid conditions such as asd.

3 year olds need to have fun jumping in puddles and being 3, the whole algebra before breakfast and war and peace by noon is just a distraction. plenty of time for all that.

what do nursery say? (not that it matters really, lol, just curious. i know ds1's were distraught that the lea refused them outright)

it's about £650 for cognitive testing. it's very unreliable for such tinies, and is likely to be roundly ignored in any case.

leave it until he's at school. honestly.

Well, you started strong, but then you were quite reasonable.

I'm expecting about another 100 replies along the same lines when everyone else gets up in a few hours.

I can see that it would be quite frustrating if there is only a month dividing him from going to school or not. I have a friend here who was trying to get her twins, who just missed the cut off, into school a year early - but that was because she wanted free childcare. She didn't manage it either.

'very disruptive force', 'high level of energy'.

OP aren't those euphemisms for 'pain in the bum'?!

Being 1 or 2 years ahead is within the normal distribution in a classroom, and the social skills are definitely as important at this age, if not more so.

nope. can't find it. sorry. but i did note that you only have to have an iq of 132 to join. for some reason i assumed it was much higher. 132 seems quite low in context.

I would definitely advise against it. Whilst he may be cognitively ready for school he may not be emotionally or physically ready. Also just because he is currently taller does not mean that he will stay in a high percentile of growth. If you advance him now then how will this fit him (socially, emotionally and academically) in 5 or 10 years time when physically he may be that much smaller than classmates. Will he be able to physically master the fine and gross motor skills at such a young age that those a year older will have - such as tying laces, dressing and undressing himself, writing and so on? Will he have the physical stamina to get through an entire school day, with a good, calm level of concentration or will he become boisterous and over active through tiredness? To skip a year into Reception, means skipping all the other skills learned in Nursery such as sharing, cooperative play, turn taking (with peers and teachers) etc. It means missing out on role play and other opportunities which will help his expressive language and confidence. It means missing out on all the things a good nursery will give him, and for what gain in the end?

A one year advance does little for very gifted children academically; he will likely still find the work unchallenging for many years to come so there is little in the long term to be gained from advancing him a year and lots that will be detrimental. Many studies already show - and teachers will confirm - that boys who are young starts at school frequently do less well than peers throughout their school career. They are less mature than classmates and less able to cope with the demands (whether emotional or academic) as their school careet advances. Throughout my teaching career younger boys in secondary year groups have consistently been the ones with academic and behavioural issues. Whilst there are of course exceptions, it is never the less a broadly true statement that boys who are a young 4 when starting school do less well. So how would your son, starting at 3, manage over the years? This would concern me more than whether a one year advance would meet his academic needs.

Much better to look at other ways of challenging him. Challenge does not have to be about marching through an academic curriculum. Start him on an instrument just now (my DD started piano at 3 1/2 and her second insrument a few months ago at 4 1/2 - she enjoys both and they give her challenge whilst helping her learn the value of effort and persistence). Cater to his high energy level with gymnastics, horse riding or another physical activity/class. Visit your local library or work on projects with him that involve cutting, pasting etc. and which will enhance motor skills and spatial skills. My DD is about to work at home on her own 'space book' as she loves the topic having been introduced to it in nursery. It has fired her imagination for over a year and she loves books, dvds etc on the topic as well as moon gazing and so on. There are many ways to integrate 'book learning' with real world experiences that will benefit and challenge your DS without institutionalising him at such a young age (and school is an institution, let's not forget it).

Look on your time time with your son before he starts school as a wonderful opportunity to guide him and learn all about his growing interests and talents. Don't push him into school so young. He will not benefit from it in the long or short term, of that I am certain. Finally if you move in years to come you may find the new school refuse to accelerate him, leaving him in the frustrating position of repeating a year.

Why can't you just enjoy being with your son? Once they start school, they are never 'yours' in the same way. Ske the most of the time you have and the opportunities to do stuff.
I speak as the parent Of a child who has just started school and has been told they have never taught anyone as advanced as her. She amazes them with what she can do.

Agree with others that his physical and emotional maturity means school isn't a good idea.

DS's nursery/pre-school have already spoken to me about the ways in which they differentiate the stuff they are doing for my DS, who is ahead of his peers by some way in a couple of areas. Is your DS being dealt with effectively at pre-school? They can and do develop children individually and the physical and emotional context is right.

Stretch laterally rather than linearly. It's important that he's challenged and his brain is working, yes, but don't assume that school is the only way to do it.

Also don't assume that school is only about academic achievement.

To put this in context I teach at a university and have very unhappy 16 year olds in my class because they are not emotionally ready, they can't join in with some social activities (like going clubbing) and whilst the work is within their capabilities the other skills just aren't.

Surely if a three year old is gifted then the last place you want to send him is to school! School is very rigid and frigid about pace that children go at. Especially after reception. He needs to learn through play and a bright three year old will have no problems learning through play. The glorious thing about play is that children learn at their own pace.

Surely part time home education is a better route for the gifted three year old. Can you not do suzuki violin with him or toddler gymnastics? Or if finances don't allow that take him on a nature walk and learn about bugs.

I think you should wait until he is as school and discuss it with the school once they have had an opportunity to assess him within the confines of the school. My husband was moved up two class years when he was at primary school (a long long time ago) and was put forward for the 11+ on that basis. Good luck

Like reallytired I am a bit baffled as to why you want to send him to school early. From what little you say about his behaviour it seems he's really not ready and school won't really advance him much anyway. From your son's point of view school will be important for social skills, routine and structure but if you feel that's not a good enough reason to send him then why not home educate?

As everyone else has said ? state schools won?t accelerate. Even if they did, linear acceleration won?t help with a truly gifted child because they learn faster than other children, so even been a year ahead, they will still be learning faster than their classmates. Despite what you hear on here, teachers are good at differentiating. When you visited the school they were teaching basic things because that is what the children needed to learn. When they need more, they teach more.

I wouldn?t rush to get a child into school ? you have a fantastic opportunity before school to start to explore the world with him ? get him learning instuments, interested in paleontology and fossil collecting, digging for rocks, examining the different shapes of leaves from different trees, learning about wildlife (worms, slugs, snails, spiders, bugs), running, jumping, learning how to kick a ball, reading, drawing, lego. Instill the joy of learning now to avert the danger of boredom at school.

Don?t underestimate social skills. If you equip your child well with social skills now he will be articulate enough to explain to the teachers in reception that he can already read or whatever. I had a fluent reader at 3 who could spell any word once seen ? she was quite able enough at 4 to explain to the teachers that she didn?t need to learn to read or learn phonics. Teachers are far more likely to pay attention if it comes from the child and not a parent who could be perceived as being pushy.

I agree very strongly with all that has been said.

But I also think that a good nursery might actually be a better place for him. DD went to a Montessori nursery and they were very good at differentiating reading and writing for her (where she is several years ahead), far better in fact than her school now is. As someone said above, school can be very rigid. Her writing skills have actually gone backwards at school, because she just isn't practising them.

Just as importantly, though, they also concentrated on her areas of weakness - in her case speaking up and also physical co-ordination. Which is probably more useful than just focusing on the things they are good at.

ukjalady are you sure? In the first term at my child's school they have studied the Queensbury Rules, the Use of Weapons and they have covered the preliminaries of the Art of War. In Physical Education they've learnt how to climb up a rope and a pole, how to jump from a height without breaking ankles, and how to run across a muddy field without falling over while carrying a huge stick and not poking anyone's eyes out. In Chemistry they've studied dyes in mud, paint, rubber, wet leaves etc. In Pragmatic Linguistics they have learnt about exaggeration, hyperbole, slander, perjoratives and insults. They have learned about copyright and plagiarism. I think this is the standard Playground Curriculum for Term 1 in Foundation Stage.

Are you sure your 3 year old has covered all of that already?

That sounds like a school for my ds, strongest mummy! (more the sticks than the linguistics, tbh)

This is a wind-up isn't it?

He's a 3 year old. Let him giggle at the word bum and flick snot like other 3 year olds and he'll be fine.

Does anyone really actually think - "Oh, my child is gifted"? - and why would you?

Yup, first time poster, first thread.
Third one today.

ooopsadaisy that's a bit unfair. Yes, people are surprised and amazed by their kids and sometimes there are kids with startling abilities which parents can feel they have a duty to nurture.

If you are a research scientist, chartered engineer or a merchant banker surrounded by lots of other clever people with clever kids, then you have plenty of ideas of what to do with them (or what not to do). If you are surrounded by the merely lovely smashing and delightful kids who are meeting their milestones on time, and you yourself had a common or garden upbringing, then I am sure it can feel like being lost without a map.